Incidentally, if you want to know why the government doesn't have any money and services are starting to fall apart, you may enjoy this graph, from this article ifs.org.uk/taxlab/taxla... - ThreadSky

showerabsolute.bsky.social • 14 days ago

Incidentally, if you want to know why the government doesn't have any money and services are starting to fall apart, you may enjoy this graph, from this article
https://ifs.org.uk/taxlab/taxlab-key-questions/how-do-uk-tax-revenues-compare-internationally?tab=tab-403

Comments

algrooves.bsky.social•14 days ago

No overlay cost of living for the same countries, starting with rent and mortgage / property costs

algrooves.bsky.social•14 days ago

*now

magnayn.bsky.social•14 days ago

Exactly this. Or disposable income at purchasing-power parity after _all_ taxation (including council tax), rent/mortgage and utility payments.

IoW our failure to build means less money available for other purposes.

showerabsolute.bsky.social•14 days ago

So what, what has that got to do with my point? The average Britain pays very little tax. This is a problem when you want public services

algrooves.bsky.social•14 days ago

The point is that you can't tax these people more without reducing other essentials costs like property, energy, transport and food

showerabsolute.bsky.social•14 days ago

Well, you can. But it has downsides you've set out. I'm stating the problem here. More than I am the solution

magnayn.bsky.social•14 days ago

I'd cheerfully switch a world where that person pays £600 in tax and £1200 in rent for one where they pay £1200 in tax and £600 in rent.

And so would they!

But unless you've a policy to get on that path (my suggestion: build houses), tax percentage graphs are a mere symptom.

magnayn.bsky.social•14 days ago

The point is that they're paying a LOT in other costs for which they see little benefit. That vacant space on the right isn't "disposable income", it's "usurious rents".

showerabsolute.bsky.social•14 days ago

It's also shit services. The poor do not need lower taxes, they need better services and benefits.

bronterre.bsky.social•14 days ago

Surely the most striking feature of the chart is the low UK employer SECs, apart from the case of Denmark.

showerabsolute.bsky.social•14 days ago

Not an area I know enough about. But I will note that Britain has a particular political obsession with avoiding any unemployment (that others cushion better with better social insurance) which may be related

apwlay.bsky.social•14 days ago

Whenever I see this chart (or variants) I'm interested in Denmark. You hear a lot about the unemployment system, but nothing about the "it's all income tax" thing. I'd love to know more (seeing as I'd be initially predisposed to move that way and tax all income vs penalise work)

optimaximal.bsky.social•14 days ago

Is it just one of those 'it's always been that way' systems? If the system in Denmark works for them and the government covers all the social security via income tax, why change it?

apwlay.bsky.social•14 days ago

There must be some interesting differences to pick apart though, and I wonder if we can tell their impact.
Rich retirees paying more tax on their income, for example, workers paying a bit less (maybe?)

laura-elseplace.bsky.social•13 days ago

I know there has been research in comparative social policy in Denmark and UK but don’t know the references offhand. If anyone seriously wants to know, I can find out for you.

charleswinchester.bsky.social•14 days ago

Thanks for sharing that. It'd be interesting to see a more up to date set of figures, to see what - if anything - has changed.

showerabsolute.bsky.social•14 days ago

I'd be stunned if it wasn't worse

charleswinchester.bsky.social•14 days ago

Me too!

conradvink.bsky.social•14 days ago

Those big employer SSCs for other European countries are mostly state-mandated contributions into occupational pension schemes. To compare like for like this graph would need to include employee+employer pension contributions for the UK.

incessant.bsky.social•13 days ago

Yup. Amazes me how often this is explained and yet never seems to land with anyone. If you adjust for how pensions and tertiary education are funded the UK employee will snap back to the middle or even towards the higher end.

graybouk.bsky.social•14 days ago

That data is quite old. Is there a chart with current data?

showerabsolute.bsky.social•14 days ago

Can't find a newer one quickly but I'd be surprised if it were not very very similar? This is (mean) average, median harder to find which is annoying as that's kind of the problem. It does show the *other* problem well though

cleminan.uk•14 days ago

📌

mountaingeek.bsky.social•14 days ago

📌

worklesshard.bsky.social•14 days ago

Caveat being, have you actually been to Belgium recently? Otherwise v. clear.

Comments

Posting Rules

Reply