It’s telling that Chow talks about development charges paying for affordable housing and shelters. How it is logical to tax housing to pay for housing? Why are these programs funded from DCs at all? The idea that DCs cover the “impacts” of growth is a sham. www.thestar.com/politics/fed... - ThreadSky

alexbozikovic.bsky.social • 22 days ago

It’s telling that Chow talks about development charges paying for affordable housing and shelters.

How it is logical to tax housing to pay for housing? Why are these programs funded from DCs at all?

The idea that DCs cover the “impacts” of growth is a sham.

https://www.thestar.com/politics/federal/carney-government-recognizes-theres-no-time-to-waste-on-new-housing-olivia-chow-says/article_4b9b41a7-5b9d-4e5b-a19d-dd2f481888d9.html

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graue.bsky.social•21 days ago

Economic principles suggest such taxes mostly fall on the seller of developable land to the developer, since land is the input with the most inelastic supply. If so, such taxes raise money for public goods with little impact on production. Incumbent landowners just get a smaller payday.

fidelityalt.bsky.social•22 days ago

It's almost like cities are just charging new entrants a 6-digit fee to live in the city only to take that money and use it for whatever they feel like

fresh72.bsky.social•22 days ago

Using it to fund shelters is short sighted, using development fees to finance non-market & subsidize affordable housing is a no brainer. Market can't fix everything

alexbozikovic.bsky.social•22 days ago

Counterpoint: publicly built housing should be funded out of general tax revenues

fresh72.bsky.social•22 days ago

Ideally yes, but on the state level It'd be difficult to get the greenlight. In NY It's a struggle to get the MTA fully funded even when service covers the tri-state area. Trying to get housing funded in areas where there's a shortage from places where there isn't, is a tough sell to the masses

ontariotrafficman.bsky.social•22 days ago

Not sure how it is in NY but in Ontario the purpose of Development Charges is to pay for the net cost incurred by a development (e.g. transportation, sewers, hydro, water, etc.)

Housing developments REDUCE the need for housing programs, so arguably they should be getting a discount on DCs for that

dougsamu.bsky.social•22 days ago

This overlooks Supportive, and Affordable Housing. Development Charges fund the municipality to build and extend infrastructure outside of existing infrastructure. Ford took away cities ability to require a percentage of affordable in new builds.

ontariotrafficman.bsky.social•22 days ago

It doesn't "overlook" supportive housing etc, it deliberately omits them because demand for them is not caused by housing development. They are baseline needs and should therefore be funded by general taxes.

kielselguhr.bsky.social•22 days ago

Canadian govs seem to hate nothing more than consistent funding. Dev charges over property taxes, fed/provincial funds to build transit but not to operate it, etc

chadleddy.bsky.social•22 days ago

Development charges are being used for general city purposes, far beyond the direct costs of utility hook-ups, etc. It’s just a tax on new housing, which lowers new supply, and drives up the value of existing homes, which also benefit from lower taxes. Scandalously unfair to younger/newer residents.

alexbozikovic.bsky.social•22 days ago

To clarify: generally cities claim the development charges are paying for infrastructure. Why are shelters the first thing that come to mind here?

alexbozikovic.bsky.social•22 days ago

Toronto isn’t building new roads; the TTC is not building much to serve high-growth areas; the city is generally not building new sewer lines to deal specifically with growth; and the need for new parks is a complex issue

g026r.leftblank.org•22 days ago

Can also add: all the high growth areas have signs warning you that your kids probably aren't going to get placed in a nearby school.

antigentri.bsky.social•22 days ago

Standard CYA legal disclosure. TDSB's actual enrollment continues to steady decline year after year. TCDSB is marginally better, showing modest growth in the last few yrs, although its overall numbers are still below pre-COVID levels.

alexbozikovic.bsky.social•22 days ago

There are in fact enrolment pressures in high-growth areas even as enrolment declines.

Directing density to the areas of the city that have empty schools and declining populations would mitigate this and other "infrastructure deficits"

antigentri.bsky.social•22 days ago

Agreed that there should be more planning coordination between city and the public school boards to utilize infra more effectively. Just curious... what areas are experiencing legit enrollment pressure? I know Etobicoke lakeshore (old motel strip) is one. Maybe Y&E?

george.borkbork.ca•22 days ago

Ttc doesn’t even do growth anymore. That’s Metrolinx. They officially moved that to them…

alexbozikovic.bsky.social•22 days ago

This boring stuff matters. Questions around "infrastructure" will be central to the policy debate about how to build housing. Luckily @mikepmoffatt.bsky.social and team are asking tough questions.

antigentri.bsky.social•22 days ago

More boring stuff that matters: unemployment in the Toronto CMA is 8.6% (416 alone is higher) or ~150bp and 250bp higher than in Montreal and Vancouver, respectively. Also 150bp higher than the rate for Ontario ex-Toronto... let that sink in.

antigentri.bsky.social•22 days ago

A decade of booming condo development, spurred by artificially low interest rates, has blinded us to trends in the real economy. All the construction cranes + transit expansion projects have masked the fact that the City proper is suffering economic stagnation/decline not seen in the last ~35 yrs.

antigentri.bsky.social•22 days ago

In Apr only 105 new condo units were sold in ALL OF THE GTA, and the inventory of unsold units completed and under development is roughly 20k. Be prepared for further material correction in the housing market on a scale not seen since the early 1990s. That will help with affordability.

yousaf.bsky.social•22 days ago

You just have to look at the tables in the DC background reports to see, and in the case of TO, it’s overwhelmingly affordable housing, Scarb Subway, and the Gardiner that’s the bulk of the DC funded capital program.

reluctantaxe.bsky.social•22 days ago

Why is new growth paying for Toronto's inability to maintain their infrastructure.

yousaf.bsky.social•22 days ago

Because new growth can’t vote until the money has already been spent. Old growth keeps their property taxes low.

lisawedmann.bsky.social•22 days ago

Why is it always the Feds need to step up? What about provinces? What about her buddy Ford? All three levels of govt need to be working on this. So far I only see the Feds trying to get homes built.

michhham.bsky.social•22 days ago

The direct link is odd. It seems like a ruse but not untrue in the sense that (high) development charges and (otherwise low) property taxes pay for everything. Has there been any talk of new funding models for cities? I haven’t seen any lately.

brianhuntley.bsky.social•22 days ago

I seem to recall that when there was a sudden massive increase in density on lower Spadina, Toronto Hydro had big issues delivering power. Development charges should have been paid - and spent - to improve the infrastructure there in advance.

(Just one example why dev charges are needed.)

whereisgraeme.bsky.social•22 days ago

Anywhere south of Bloor if you ask Toronto Hydro how much an OTC will cost you they basically shrug

Whether or not you will have adequate power available without having to pay for system upgrades yourself is a crapshoot

Completely ridiculous

This applies to 4-6plexes too, not just big builds

dawe.bsky.social•22 days ago

the Federal Housing Minister said that DC are cost recovery and the DC program he was most familiar with from his mayoring days does that

jacobdawang.com•22 days ago

You see Alex, the more housing you build, the more affordable housing and shelters you need. Makes complete sense.

alexbozikovic.bsky.social•22 days ago

Councillor Perks believes this to be true.

whereisgraeme.bsky.social•22 days ago

It almost assumes that new housing is the cause of housing affordability, doesn’t it…

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