this post says progressives need to address young men’s needs. like what? job security? education? mental health concerns? which side do you think has the better offering for young men in those areas?
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What they actually mean is 'provide young men with large numbers of compliant and disposable stereotypically 'attractive' young women for them to sleep with and mistreat and then give them a pat on the head for being such slimy fuckboys'
You think you can create some kind of benevolent social order to constrain them but politics is adversarial. They can create create their own social order. As long as they are the root of all evil you will never have their assent.
There's a truth here. Young men often respond better to things said with loud passion, even anger. The Right can speak with such a voice. So can the Left! The problem is THE CENTER CANNOT.
Yeah I feel like the issue is these guys' whole appeal is giving people permission to be the most base, selfish version of themselves, and there's not really a left way to do that
That dipshit disabled their replies and shares because obviously he got called out that the people who in his view “listen” to young men just weaponize their anger and don’t offer any real solutions. They just provide them with someone to blame for their ills: immigrants, DEI, the left, women…
Why must we treat young men like porcelain dolls rather than encourage them to do some real introspecting about their role and responsibility in the world? When many people facing real adversity in this world I refuse to placate a privileged subset of the population that can’t learn to socialize.
As always, the problem is not the actual positions of the Democratic Party, it's the positions that Fox News, Joe Rogan, etc, tell their believers that the Democratic Party holds
I think what they mean isn’t actual policies but media personalities that feed an addictive sense of false victimhood and grievance. They are grievance addicts.
Obviously there are ways to tailor messages to specific audiences or different channels of communication to explore, but these sorts of posts never get into the specifics of how they want to change the message or what channels they want to use.
AFIK, Rogan, Peterson, https://et.al., don’t address their needs either - only their wants. The vision they offer is an appealing illusion, where wealth and women are just a YouTube course away.
And progressives seem to be offering them the opportunity to grow up, which they need (but don’t want).
They mean 'the left needs to pretend privilege doesn't and has never existed'
That's the entire issue. Class, race, gender, whatever. The argument is that progressives need to play make believe that all success is 'hard work' and all failure is 'lack of effort'.
i do sometimes think we kinda borked it with the term "privilege" tho tbf
like it's really commonly misinterpreted/misunderstood by the very people who need to understand it to be better people
i mean
not that i have a better suggestion, im an idiot
The answer is "shitty young men want to feel like women want them without having to be good people to earn it" which is why it's unanswerable on the Dem!left. The issue is *actually* that the right is indulging this desire, and that's where the problem needs to be attacked. They won't do that tho
And I'm not talking about speaking to these topics in broad, sweeping terms. I mean speaking directly to young men. 'Town halls at college fraternities'-type energy. No, you won't win most of them over.
But we're abdicating our shot at *all* of them by refusing to engage. It's an unforced error.
So I get that it's exhausting to have some random Dude on the internet throwing out pithy statements like "we have to talk to men better" without actually saying 'what' or 'how,' but just because it's annoying doesn't mean there's not a kernel of truth in there.
I remember seeing that last year. was eye-opening to me. They literally do not address men at all. how can you expect their votes when you aren't even acknowledging them?
it feels like a round about way of blaming women/bipoc/lgbtq+ people for the behavior of young white men; like why does this group NEED to be told their special and good in order to not back a fascist regime
📣 The young men on the MAGA side need extensive psychiatric treatment. They were raised 2 be feral, taught to rape their own mother's and sisters as children! They are taught to hate women and beat their own mothers by age 5.
** It is a myth that any woman can fix these deeply disturbed young men!
Makes sense for young men, especially white men, to reject even some loss of their social privilege. Being born on third base rules! The left needs to be honest about that while showing how men gain from a fairer society. Right now it’s all about what they lose, so they demand others lose more.
it seems like less about logical policy and more of an emotional narrative to me. the people you mentioned hook young men in with this fake narrative of "If you're strong you can take whatever you want", and young guys eat that warrior shit up. The left is much more self-flagellation about it
the post is also using right-wing framing of the issue.
progressives have done great outreach with the youth.
the youth love multiple younger progressive politicians who addressed their needs and have won their votes.
its why more young people vote left more than they vote right.
most older generations are right-wards, and younger generations are far left of older generations.
it is right-wingers who make the claim that progressives failed the young men. this is literally the argument Andrew Tate's circle made. and that argument is based in lies.
So much of the loneliness issue comes down to just being toxic and off putting to women. And it's not that young men are overwhelming toxicly right wing, but rather that young women are overwhelming the opposite.
The only stable conservative relationships I know are all people over 40, where-
Well, yeah. A crucial part of the grift is that following the manosphere's advice makes men more miserable and lonely, driving them deeper into it. Happy people with friends and meaningful lives don't need to be constantly told they're better than some dumb girl.
they're still all in on the maga grift but they weren't raised and formed by the online culture surrounding it.
Of the 13 friends I have there are 5 couples and they're all left politically. 2 are conservative and have had almost no serious relationships and the last one is a "median voter" type-
who's always dating and has political views that are at best incoherent.
Obviously this is all anecdotal but how many women are really looking for a guy who spends his time posting AI anti-trans memes and being mad at "blue haired feminists"? That kind of shit leaks through in normal conversation.
Young (White) men need to know they aren’t special, that they have to work like the rest of us to get ahead, on merit, because they’ve never had to do that as the alpha group.
I answered most of the needs he finally listed in this thread with progressive legislation and vision. So far he just said “thank you, young men need to hear this.”
That said, there are discussions happening about how to create progressive avenues of information that circumvent wealth-captured social media and information ecosystems! Publicizing what kind of future progressives want for everybody, including young men, is going to be important.
I've on three occasions gotten people to reflect on their choices by arguing that rudeness->frustration->tilt->losing, so aggressively berating an underperforming player means they're ALSO making a mistake that hurts the team. Almost never works but I chase the high.
The "young men" (insecure, sheltered reactionaries with brainworms in part from the spaces they're in, listening to Joe Rogan etc) in question are unreachable without destroying the apparatuses that supercharged their radicalization. And even then, they are probably mostly lost imo.
People need to instill in kids - through participation! - the power of purpose, and the resolve to tinker with a problem until it’s solved.
I’ve worked w/ STEMpals, Robotics courses, road cleanups and eco-centered community events for yrs. A small dose of this erases a gaggle of DOGEbags any day.
With all the terminally online out there, just ONE touchpoint in y’alls community could expose the Tates, Rogans, etc for what they are - losers with no reason purpose.
My mental health improved drastically the more left wing my positions became. I stopped blaming myself for problems that were not caused by my individual actions. It recontextualized a lot for me.
tbf, “addressing the needs” of an entire demographic by just telling them to be the absolute worst version of themselves is probably pretty easy and effective
what the right is offering young men is the subjugation of women in lieu of any material gains for men. that, like many components of fascism, feels very immediately rewarding to some people. it’s not something you can easily replicate on the left.
Exactly. You're dealing with teenage boys with (as your episode recently points out!) intensely disinhibited brains.
You then offer them 1) a plate of misogynist chocolate fudge brownies, and 2) a plate of progressive steamed broccoli. On what side do you think they're likely to come down?
They do, but I think it's much harder work than what the right can offer, precisely because the right is prepared to lie and to provide easy solutions: mistreat women, buy into gender hierarchies, etc.
By contrast, to instill more progressive values I think requires careful mentorship
That's not what I'm saying at all! I'm precisely saying it's going to take much more work than what the right can manage. We have to develop tools to help make family and mentors more effective. We have to instill an ethos of care. That's much harder than throwing up a YouTube with bells and gongs.
I know it seems like the right has the boys all locked up, but what if we just offered them peace, love, and freedom? Feels like it worked about 60 years ago.
And that is exactly what some of them mean when they say ‘progressives should talk to young men about their needs instead of scolding them’. That ‘yes, we agree men are superior to women; men deserve better/more than women; etc’. They just don’t have the guts to openly state it.
The very concept of masculinity is a problem. Why do they need an identity that is distinct from women/other genders? It implies/requires certain privileges that are reserved to people on the basis of gender, and a modern society doesn't need or benefit from that.
I bet materially improving the wellbeing of their constituents, such as by defunding or even making strides toward abolishing the police, and not constantly giving ground on fascism, would probably be better advertising. Maybe building public housing. Maybe not being cowards who like it this way.
Yes, I don’t think they’re going to believe Democrats if they promise all the women will become docile, submissive and sexually desperate and ensure the men they can’t talk back anymore.
“In lieu of any material gains” doin a lot of work. Does half this MRA shit hit as well as it does if the douchebags in question have guaranteed jobs, make enough $$ to be the sole earners, healthcare for their fam, send kids to college, pensions? Dems tried nothing / out of ideas dot gif etc.
Re: spreading burden - 4 day workweek, childcare, free college, are all material policies the left could pursue (if they had any power).
And wealth imbalance between whom? The man and his wife/partner? Or his boss? Both sentiments are exploitable but the former is pathetic, the latter is just true.
Yeah, they want to kill us. They want to kill and enslave more than half of America. It’s hard to laugh about it because I think they will try to do it as soon as they can get away with it.
Ugh yeah I can only imagine. I think there will be clashes between the billionaires and the religious wings of the movement, but those will only come to head once power is really consolidated. I’m most curious to see how a state religion will develop or whether it really even needs to
I’m going to refer to The Handmaid’s Tale the tv show… but there is a scene showing how the founders of Gilead arbitrarily decided on extreme Christianity as a framework and means of control. They weren’t devout, but the construct suited them. I think that tracks here.
The left shouldn't seek to replicate it of course. But they definitely can communicate what they offer better. Really highlight the right are the ones obsessed with stupid culture war nonsense whilst the left offer actual opportunity and fair treatment for working class guys.
It shouldn't be replicated at all as the draw from Tate and Peterson stem directly from young men's insecurities of being unable to conform, prosper, and ascend the very systems that the left is opposed to.
I find it very frightening that the prospect of women being subjugated is attractive to so many men. Why do they hate women so much? Even if you are not liked by women, how can you justify blaming them all instead of yourself?
In one of the novelization sequels to Blade Runner, they talk about the reason that replicants were made sentient. It's because an unthinking bot doesn't know it's a slave and this was impacting on sales. Bad people don't just want their desires fufilled, they want others to suffer while doing it.
Yesterday I said precisely this about these psychos that want to rule the world: they can't get pleasure for themselves so they make people suffer. They can only feel good making other people feel bad.
So true! Even their god, the richest man in the world, seems like a sad psycho who only derives pleasure from people suffering. What a miserable existence! Meanwhile, most of us battling to pay our rent are probably happier than Mr Moneybags. And we don't take out our problems on those around us.
I have the theory that he puts those strange names to his kids to keep emotional distance. He fears they will abandon him so he prefers not to bond too tightly. The weaker the bond, the lesser the pain.
I had a person I was close enough with in Law School that we had these conversations. He was very in the “women are meant to be conquered” camp. It’s just a different set of fundamental values.
And unfortunately, there are enough women that subscribe to some level of this as well that it actually gives incentive for these type of men.
I'm not blaming women in this at all. It's a vicious feedback loop that's somehow more "rewarding" to both groups. It just makes it difficult to overcome.
That's another aspect of it. I live in a red state and even "sensible" (unradicalized) folks just take for granted that "men are fundamentally _x_ (in this case dominators) and women are fundamentally _y_ (meant to be subjugated)." Questioning, critically examining these ideas is "alternative"/weird
My wife once watched a very independent woman say to her daughter effectively, "It goes God, Dad, then me." This was years ago and maybe things have changed in their family or in other aspects that hierarchy changes. Either way, the fact that there is a hierarchy was so despiriting.
The unspoken thing here is CHURCH specifically evangelical churches which have gone all in on this creepy subjugating women in a way that I do not think was so prevalent as a kid.
If you're a reactionary you have the seemingly tangible past to turn to and identify. Then, along with all your other disperately motivated reactionaries, to coalesce around. Progressives have to agree on some hypothetical fiction out in the future to make community around.
This is tangential to thoughts I've been having about the wish for a left "Tea Party." The TP was astroturfed economic populism that morphed into MAGA nativism. All Trump had to do was just be like, "Drop all this stuff except for the racism." and boom, mass movement. A left version of this is hard.
No, misogyny is at the crux of this. Lots of people suffer from wealth disparity, including women, people of colour, disabled people, etc. Yet you don't see them embracing fascism en masse the way white young men are.
Wealth disparity and alienation is what allows the right to win young men over. They have no power over their own lives so the right offers them power over other people's. Other groups aren't offered power at the same level, but some do embrace fascism too, like white women voting for Trump.
Patriarchy, racism, ableism are all structures by which wealth obtains the buy in of those without. Privileged, yet poor in groups support ever greater wealth concentration and these structures justify wealth concentration to all.
You can observe the retreat of bigotry post WW2 for example
The forces of reaction were shattered and delegitimized and wealth redistribution that followed opened a lot of space for activism to roll back bigotry in turn, as wealth concentration has reasserted we've reached a point where we are losing ground.
If that were true, rich men would be less misogynist than poor men. If anything, they're more so. The richest man in the world openly despises women and dreams of reducing us to breeding stock.
And the rich guys aren't even misogynist in a different way! They parrot the same manosphere dumbassery as every other member of the He-Man Woman-Haters Club.
No, gender is the crux of this. The idea that “boys will be boys” prevails, when the truth is that boys will be emulate whatever they are taught. And a heavily gendered culture teaches them misogyny, etc.
Unfortunately, white women are predominantly Trump voters. My hypothesis: their interest in security and the unconscious appeal of the benevolent father. I day this with grief and as a long time feminist.
Clearly the women voting for Trump are not feminists. These are women who praise and worship men to get what they want. They don’t really love them, they are just successful using them.
White women moved ever so slightly left compared to 2016 and 2020 unlike almost all other demographics. And educated white women more clearly did. So it’s still not good enough but it’s also not the same trend as it is for e g Latino men who made BY FAR the biggest right shift.
I've started noping out of discussions on this because they tend to get hijacked by men who want the answer to be "women need to stop making me feel emasculated" but don't want to admit it, so they dance around the issue and shut down actually useful discussion and it just goes around in circles
So true, they do not see that it is the humiliating strictures of work and property, the shittyness of interacting with managers, landlords and corps, is the source of the emasculation and frustration they are "supposed" to be allowed to relieve by dominating women in their private life
I know this is asking way too much, but what if we drilled down on what masculinity means? Traditional, socially constructed gender roles are an invention born out of societies that are now foreign to us. The right is reinforcing the expectations of toxic masculinity to weaponize disaffected men.
This is the rationale behind the erasure of DEI, gender studies programs, grant funding with the lost of banned words ... It will become increasingly difficult to "drill down" into the construction of gender roles, or to critique narratives of masculinity in any public way.
They have to be willing to admit that "I feel like my masculinity is being threatened" is what's going on before we can start deconstructing patriarchal heteronormative expectations of masculinity, otherwise the conversation just goes in circles forever.
Like yes if they admit and accept that's the problem then deconstructing masculinity is extremely productive, but in my personal experience a lot aren't willing to admit it and you can't really encourage someone to go on a journey if they refuse to take the first step.
Same principle that has always worked in racial and ethnic hierarchal structures where minorities and newcomers are always under the heels of white men.
Citizen-immigrants against new immigrants too. I kept calling it “ego ladder”: ensuring if you can’t climb up make sure someone is below you. But LB had it better.
This can't be ignored. But seeking to just copy the right is a dumb move the left often make. Instead they should dig deeper - why are people anti immigration? Usually comes down to stuff the left should offer in line with their values. Eg housing issues, exploitative employers, etc...
And the subjugation of women appeals to them because they don't have a sense of the qualities they'd need to develop in order to become appealing to women as a romantic partner, or lack the faith in themselves to develop any appealing qualities without the shortcuts of money or good looks.
If only the much-maligned "friend zone" was understood as a golden opportunity to learn how to be a good friend to a woman without a sexual agenda. Imagine learning how to hold an engaging conversation, how to be a good dance partner, how to be gracious, how to just be good company.
The amount of times I had to tell my ex that the r word and the n word were hateful & he said "but you know I don't mean it like that." Yes, yes you do. Otherwise you'd use a 1000 other words available to you. They want to be a piped toddlers with zero consequences.
I feel like it’s another aspect of what OP is talking about. If a young man can use a slur without anyone commenting, and especially without a woman he is intimate with calling him out, that’s a way he can feel like he has more social power over others.
Also leans into “everyone is thinking [insert edgy trash here] but only I’m powerful/feared enough to get away with saying it.”
I think it’s why “weird” was so effective in confronting them. It told them they weren’t uniquely powerful, it was that actually, no one wanted to say, or hear, that trash.
If that’s the problem, why aren’t more young women going far-right as well? I agree on making education more accessible, but I don’t see how the left can match the misogyny the right offers young men.
The only left-approved route I could see working is a systemic effort to build self esteem and confidence in young men via healthy yet “guy coded” activities
Hiking/exercise clubs, backpacking, dnd groups, whatever. Anything to build social skills and self worth without toxic sexual/monetary goals
Highlighting cooperation, being calm under pressure, leadership and public service, etc. These are values that should supplant the alpha male bullshit being pushed.
It’s also important imo to view this not as a crisis men are experiencing so much as causing. The solution is self esteem either way
When they have women convinced they'll burn for eternity for saying no to sex, or tell them it's ok to beat their wives/girlfriends if they refuse. Yeah I had that in mind.
It's def part of the enticement, but there's also discussion on left that is taken as "white straight man bad" instead of "lifting others helps everyone".
"When you're accustomed to privilege, equality feels like oppression." IMO part of solution is better conveying that our ideas lift everyone up.
It’s hard to have this discussion without admitting all of this poor white men stuff is just that they had been literally oppressing women and people of color for ages and in trying to fix that problem the focus wasn’t on them And now they’re mad about it
This is part of the problem, tho. The young men in their teens had nothing to do with any of that. All they feel is the blame and none of the privilege. (Obviously their families likely have.)
The challenge is getting them to understand the situation without making them feel attacked.
The right can offer a comprehensive world view to young men. Either through religion or tradition. I don’t think there’s progressive way to tell people “this is the correct way to live.”
It’s the most important feature of progressivism to me. I want to decide what the meaning of my life is. I want other people to have that same power. I think striving for meaning is the most beautiful part of living. The trade off is it’s really hard to find meaning and harder to live without one.
Going back to From, etc. this freedom, which I cherish, which allowed me to be who I could be, which I want for others, may be very scary to some people.
i think the right also offers the promise of material gains through crypto/daytrading/dropshipping/etc hustle culture. maybe the left needs its own ponzi schemes and MLMs
A big help would be if the people in their late 60s and 70s yielded or stepped down from leadership positions. What could young people possibly hope for when their 50 yo parents are still treated like kids by the old farts in charge.
I think one of the first things we should add to the new constitution is term limits. Politicians should not have institutional brands. No one politician should hold a seat for 37 years, it’s just fucking wrong.
There was a big term limit push years ago and it kind of died after the courts threw it out for national stuff. We still have it in the local level and it’s a little weird in that the same five people switch up what they run for after a couple terms
It’s the silent generation that never let go. There’s a lot of boomers, but they are still snot nosed kids to a lot of the upper government. I think it did something to them.
I totally agree! This is why I retired at 60 - left my school district administrator position to someone younger, who in turn left their position for someone younger, etc. I wasn’t a politician drunk with power, though.
I dunno, the immediate destruction of ultrawealth and the systems that allow for it would do me pretty well. Universal Healthcare, Education, and Housing are pretty seductive too.
Seems like the Democrats have a more general problem with failing to target messaging to specific groups. Spanish language media, etc. Same with young men.
It’s passion through hate that speaks to young men and their more base desires. This stunts maturity at which point men develop empathy. The right knows they can’t win people over with their crap once men mature.
The behind the bastards episodes on Tate by @iwriteok.bsky.social really captures it. These influencers are often correctly identifying the problems caused by capitalism/our corrupt society, they offer an answer that focuses on turning these problems to young men benefit. We should be able to
Offer a compelling alternative, the problem IMO is that centrists/neoliberals focus souch on shutting the left/progressives out that young men correctly see that they offer no answer to the widespread problems they're facing. So what alternative do they see but the right wing answer?
Yeah basically. The far right offer easy (non) solutions to complex problems. They are able to tap into system 1 thinking.
The left meanwhile are stuck with trying to come up with actual solutions and engaging system 2 from the off. They need to be far more direct about the actual problems.
yes, it also past subjugation offers to punish the people, women mainly though also Queer people and often non-whites, for making them feel bad, all your personal failings as a young (often white) man aren't anything to do with you but because the woke culture is punishing you for being a MAN!
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I wonder why?
And progressives seem to be offering them the opportunity to grow up, which they need (but don’t want).
https://www.smbc-comics.com/comic/need-2
That's the entire issue. Class, race, gender, whatever. The argument is that progressives need to play make believe that all success is 'hard work' and all failure is 'lack of effort'.
like it's really commonly misinterpreted/misunderstood by the very people who need to understand it to be better people
i mean
not that i have a better suggestion, im an idiot
but its something i think about
I do think it's an inertia bit, it can be reversed but goddamn it won't be through anything with "decorum".
You know and I know that progressive policies will be better for them. They don't.
But we're abdicating our shot at *all* of them by refusing to engage. It's an unforced error.
Now I don't think that's true per se but... well. Here it is, let's do some searching: https://www.presidency.ucsb.edu/documents/2024-democratic-party-platform
"Men", once you filter out places where it's just in-another-word, has... 3 that I could find. Two about soldiers, one about LGBT men.
Look, the whole platform doesn't have to center on men, far from it. But to go the whole mental health section...
You know and I know the right is talking to them about this, specifically with the window dressing of "Dems don't care."
We do! But we're sure as shit not showing it!
We can do better.
** It is a myth that any woman can fix these deeply disturbed young men!
progressives have done great outreach with the youth.
the youth love multiple younger progressive politicians who addressed their needs and have won their votes.
its why more young people vote left more than they vote right.
it is right-wingers who make the claim that progressives failed the young men. this is literally the argument Andrew Tate's circle made. and that argument is based in lies.
The only stable conservative relationships I know are all people over 40, where-
Of the 13 friends I have there are 5 couples and they're all left politically. 2 are conservative and have had almost no serious relationships and the last one is a "median voter" type-
Obviously this is all anecdotal but how many women are really looking for a guy who spends his time posting AI anti-trans memes and being mad at "blue haired feminists"? That kind of shit leaks through in normal conversation.
I don't think it's fair to tar a massive demographic including all kinds of minorities as being screaming racists.
What are the sides you're talking about here? Honest question.
I’ve worked w/ STEMpals, Robotics courses, road cleanups and eco-centered community events for yrs. A small dose of this erases a gaggle of DOGEbags any day.
We’re so far into the doom spiral we’re actually in dum dum doom.
The path back is long, but those same sycophants will (hopefully) have the tools to see cracks in veneer themselves.
That is all we can do, Marc. Hope you keep at it!
None of this is hard, it just takes time and giving some measure of a fuck to your fellow man.
They're being fed a lot of crap which makes them repellent to women. And when it's illegal to pay for sex and your state blocks pornhub...
Getting rid of no fault divorce, putting them into wedlock, restricting women from the workplace, banning abortion and contraceptives…
That’s „speaking to men“ for them
You then offer them 1) a plate of misogynist chocolate fudge brownies, and 2) a plate of progressive steamed broccoli. On what side do you think they're likely to come down?
By contrast, to instill more progressive values I think requires careful mentorship
We could flip it somehow
Personally, even with that mindset, I am more into the idea of "spread the burden" so say, both partners work half as much and have more free time.
The core problem, is wealth imbalance.
And wealth imbalance between whom? The man and his wife/partner? Or his boss? Both sentiments are exploitable but the former is pathetic, the latter is just true.
Maybe that's what these people want, easily digestible nonsense.
Like - with WHAT? Empathy? I’m sorry, we’re sold out of that
It’s just that they aren’t the only ones they want to help. And they don’t want to help them be assholes
If you’re unaware and need a morbid giggle, MAGA Mein Kampf dropped and the Amazon reviews are spectacular!
https://www.amazon.com/Unhumans-Secret-History-Communist-Revolutions/dp/1648210856/ref=mp_s_a_1_1?dib=eyJ2IjoiMSJ9.uH20yNtRpbnVr2IH7dGsu5_omDA4Pv5YlTq4sZ2nY6ia-Iwl8y5VfbOMh-s5oq18hTy_k3Ie9IThAuaK2_in-61ElaCfqXYUUdi356Gp6HjLR5MV483B0HhOieo5QJu_GS7El60PtSByUZtYwcZkhxCeLEi62EMEHrjC4ugrg3QI_gDIKnpNGz0CrC_KhGlpobQpzozTqaPUQB9q2W4Vrg.sSyNuBYIkuSPov9gtTWFISis0mOH3OmcwB9ZJgcxUSQ&dib_tag=se&keywords=unhuman&qid=1741463457&sr=8-1
Sorry, I just beheaded that guy.
These chuds get off on the power of domination and having control, especially over women.
A bot won’t do it, no matter how many times they punch it or fuck it.
I'm not blaming women in this at all. It's a vicious feedback loop that's somehow more "rewarding" to both groups. It just makes it difficult to overcome.
Respect of young men, sure.
But respect is earned.
You can observe the retreat of bigotry post WW2 for example
In short: one struggle
This needs to be disaggregated by race, cause this “women” as “all” is just not true.
Why do women have to 'earn' respect from teenage boys in your book?
If you can convince the lowest man he's better than the best woman, he won't notice you're picking his pocket
Media: Let's make the Queens Gambit.
I think it’s why “weird” was so effective in confronting them. It told them they weren’t uniquely powerful, it was that actually, no one wanted to say, or hear, that trash.
…I guess u have some feelings about all this 😂.
The democrats think they have a branding problem when really they have a product problem.
Hiking/exercise clubs, backpacking, dnd groups, whatever. Anything to build social skills and self worth without toxic sexual/monetary goals
It’s also important imo to view this not as a crisis men are experiencing so much as causing. The solution is self esteem either way
The other thing the right offers is power and control.
"When you're accustomed to privilege, equality feels like oppression." IMO part of solution is better conveying that our ideas lift everyone up.
The challenge is getting them to understand the situation without making them feel attacked.
The only thing they get is told not to be rapey misogynistic little shits when they are. And many many of them are.
So they get blamed for actions not themselves
I think the left certainly offers that
It's fucking toxic as hell. I don't want to "hustle" at 5 side gigs in my free time. I want to fuck around in my free time doing nothing.
The left meanwhile are stuck with trying to come up with actual solutions and engaging system 2 from the off. They need to be far more direct about the actual problems.