A few comments on this. I didn't post about this yesterday because it is ultimately irrelevant for Ukraine & only has an impact on domestic politics. Even if the motion is positively voted on in the Bundestag, a delivery of Taurus KEPD-350 to Ukraine cannot be enforced. 1/4 - ThreadSky

deaidua.org • 106 days ago

A few comments on this. I didn't post about this yesterday because it is ultimately irrelevant for Ukraine & only has an impact on domestic politics. Even if the motion is positively voted on in the Bundestag, a delivery of Taurus KEPD-350 to Ukraine cannot be enforced.

1/4

Comments

hwki.bsky.social•106 days ago

The Green party could still vote in favor of sending Taurus and show that they are ready for a coalition with CDU and oppose the policy of SPD. The SPD would stand alone with the exremist parties.

deaidua.org•106 days ago

True, but this again is only about domestic politics, as I mentioned in the first post.

hwki.bsky.social•106 days ago

You are correct.

alochmar.bsky.social•106 days ago

From a military perspective, would Taurus even make much of a difference at this point? It’s not 2022 anymore.

richardhoffmann.bsky.social•103 days ago

The smart fuse(void counting) within it is ideal for taking out the Kerch Bridge.

alochmar.bsky.social•103 days ago

That's true, but the bridge itself may not be all that important anymore. For example, there's railways connecting the Donbas to Crimea now that didn't exist two years ago.

richardhoffmann.bsky.social•103 days ago

Granted. It would be another useful air launched cruise missile for taking out deeply buried hardened targets.

jamesjenner.bsky.social•105 days ago

It would only really add to the amount of cruise missiles available. It doesn't do anything fundamentally different from Storm Shadow/SCALP or JAGM.

sarkast70.bsky.social•106 days ago

There is one possibility to speed up. Providing a plattform where it is already integrated in parallel. Tornado would be such a plattform. Training could start imediately. I know not quite probable, but training could for example be done by KSA.

deaidua.org•106 days ago

Training of Ukrainian pilots to operate a German launch platform like Tornado, just makes no sense, as it takes up much more time than just integrating the cruise missile on a launch platform they already operate.

sarkast70.bsky.social•106 days ago

That is one big issue in this conflict. Measuring essential activities for combat with scales we developed during fully relaxed peacetime decades.

deaidua.org•106 days ago

In the end, the decision still lies with the Federal Chancellor. He is against it and, as he has said several times (also recently), will not change his decision.

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deaidua.org•106 days ago

If nothing changes in the next three months and Friedrich Merz keeps his word, a delivery of the cruise missiles will probably not take place until mid-2025 by a government led by the CDU.

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deaidua.org•106 days ago

After all, one should not forget that an announcement of the delivery is not enough. The cruise missile must at least be integrated (not certified) into a Soviet launch platform and crews must be trained. That takes a few months.

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hwki.bsky.social•106 days ago

Taurus could also be integrated with F-16: F-16 fighter jets “suitable to carry Taurus” https://www.merkur.de/politik/nato-scholz-spd-ukraine-krieg-putin-selenskyj-donezk-donbass-f-16-kampfjets-russland-taurus-93238706.html

deaidua.org•106 days ago

An integration into the F-16 takes up much more time than integrating it into Soviet launch platforms, which is why I haven't mentioned it. Integration into the F-16 makes sense at a later stage, when Ukraine already operates Taurus and has a consistent supply of new cruise missiles.

bobthomas2666.bsky.social•106 days ago

Integration of the American AIM-174 for the F16 is a priority as this weapon is networked into MiM104 and other NATO systems.

bobthomas2666.bsky.social•106 days ago

The announcement itself is a valuable weapon. It demonstrates to the Kremlin things are going from bad to worse. It robs the Kremlin of hope that Europe, Germany in particular, will fold. Putin was counting on Germany to repeat its actions from 2014. That belief in 2022 was a cataclysmic mistake.

oscarromeo68.bsky.social•106 days ago

https://steadyhq.com/de/u-m/posts/16d9bf70-8242-42a6-9f26-9c97f3ec8641

pst55.bsky.social•106 days ago

I wonder how far away Ukraine is from getting Gripens or F/A-18's.

v-holmsen.bsky.social•106 days ago

Exactly.
Both JAS-39C and F/A-18s are already launch platforms for the Taurus.
Finland is getting F-35s soon, and could then give some of their old F/A-18s to Ukraine.
Ukraine is training on the JAS-39, and delivery of those could take place fairly soon.
6 months mentioned by GUA seems reasonable.

deaidua.org•106 days ago

Can the Gripen actually fire Taurus, or just carry? There is a difference. The only thing I know of are the carry tests, which is also the only thing mentioned on Wikipedia and even the CEO of MBDA Deutschland stated that Taurus can currently only be operated by Tornado, EF-18 and F-15K.

imaginefella.bsky.social•106 days ago

Thanks for clearing that up, hopefully Biden's decision today will make some adjustments to the timing

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