That's a very utility-centred perspective on it. Only part of the generation is 'purchased' by the utility, a good part of it is produced/used behind the meter, at lower cost than the utility. Fair competition, part of the 'cost shift', is just solar supplying cheaper power than the utility. - ThreadSky

willparker.bsky.social • 3 days ago

That's a very utility-centred perspective on it.

Only part of the generation is 'purchased' by the utility, a good part of it is produced/used behind the meter, at lower cost than the utility.

Fair competition, part of the 'cost shift', is just solar supplying cheaper power than the utility.

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willparker.bsky.social•3 days ago

That cost shift is always going to exist even if there's zero compensation for exports, unless the utility drops midday prices closer to wholesale costs.

wombat-ee.bsky.social•3 days ago

I work for a utility so yeah you could definitely say I have a utility-centered perspective.

Behind the meter consumption should not be included in cost shift calculations, I agree. It’s like eating a tomato you grow in your backyard. But utility purchase of excess generation is a cost shift.

willparker.bsky.social•3 days ago

Agreed in principle, but the utilities are also driving up customer costs by rates that reduce effective, peak-minimizing battery use and excessively limit solar competition.

Utility analysis also completely ignores customer savings behind the meter, which reduces overall electricity costs.

willparker.bsky.social•3 days ago

Competition and trade tend to lower costs for everyone, but the utility model is built around monopolistic assumptions and regulators haven't figured out how to assess/achieve the full benefits of prosumer tech yet.

willparker.bsky.social•3 days ago

So the utilities throw up excessive 'trade barriers', and everyone ends up paying more than they should.

wombat-ee.bsky.social•3 days ago

If you remember Econ class, natural monopolies make sense in a lot of ways. There’s only so much room underground to run wires or gas pipes or water pipes. Retail energy supplier competition helps sometimes but not always. I have friends in PA who’ve had negative experiences.

willparker.bsky.social•3 days ago

Yeah, it's not an easy model to get right. There's likely a sweet spot where utilities use their natural monopoly to provide reliability services while customers get fair pricing for supplying a substantial amount of energy (and capacity). Symbiosis.

Few if any utilities have gotten there yet.

wombat-ee.bsky.social•3 days ago

It’s a sticky subject for sure. TOU rates that more accurately reflect wholesale would be good, except for all the people who can’t shift their usage. Higher fixed charge to reduce how much TOU cost is covered with volumetric is good, except for poor low-usage customers. Etc.

willparker.bsky.social•3 days ago

There could be solar-only TOU rates, though, or ones tailored to equalize costs for low income customers. e.g. 10c cheaper midday and 8c more at peak, with hours adjusted so average net bill change is zero.

There are ways to mitigate, I just think utilities/PUCs don't recognize the benefits.

wombat-ee.bsky.social•3 days ago

Like the best option on paper would be to take almost all T&D/infrastructure costs out of the per kWh cost. Costs $40 a month on average to serve a residential customer? Cool, your basic charge is $40/mo and your per kWh is lower. Kinda like how industrial tariffs work. But on paper isn’t everything

wombat-ee.bsky.social•3 days ago

Also some smaller utilities are starting to implement demand charges, which does pretty accurately represent the system requirements to serve a particular customer. So high fixed charge + a demand charge + low per kWh charge with aggressive TOU might be the ultimate answer.

willparker.bsky.social•3 days ago

That's a good model as long as demand charges are manageable, e.g. averaged over multiple hours and several peaks. Having high penalties for a single high load hour makes it hard to build a business case for batteries.

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