Intuition check: without thinking too much about it, does the idea of having motives for believing something seem a little weird to you? Does it seem like motives are the kind of thing you have for actions, and reasons the kind of thing you have for beliefs? Or do motives for belief make sense? - ThreadSky

aporetikotatos.bsky.social • 104 days ago

Intuition check: without thinking too much about it, does the idea of having motives for believing something seem a little weird to you? Does it seem like motives are the kind of thing you have for actions, and reasons the kind of thing you have for beliefs? Or do motives for belief make sense?

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deacondrew.bsky.social•104 days ago

I think some people are motivated to believe in a God because they are afraid. Does this get at the issue?

aporetikotatos.bsky.social•104 days ago

That seems right, but it leads me to wonder whether believing for motives is ever rational; are some motives for belief also reasons for belief, or are motives for belief always as indifferent to reasons as believing in God out of fear alone?

aporetikotatos.bsky.social•104 days ago

A different, but related, question: are there any good motives for believing, or is every motivated belief to be disparaged in the way that we should disparage, say, believing in God out of fear that he’ll punish you? Whether motives can be reasons or not, can there be good ones?

deacondrew.bsky.social•104 days ago

I am just reading this now. I love these questions! You are making me think. That’s hard!

aporetikotatos.bsky.social•104 days ago

These are the kinds of questions I ask students, and they often give me blank stares in reaction. I think they think I’m looking for ‘the’ correct answer. I’m mainly interested in how things intuitively seem to people as a starting point for thinking more.

deacondrew.bsky.social•104 days ago

That reminds me of when I ask parents why they are bringing their children for baptism. I tell them there are no wrong answers, I just want to properly respond and respect their needs. Yet so many tell me what they think I want to hear.

I have to be gentle with them.

aporetikotatos.bsky.social•104 days ago

In this case, I’m reflecting on some claims that Austin Farrer makes early on in his Faith and Speculation. He’s happy to think of motives for belief (i.e., faith) that are commendable as well as those that are disreputable. I began by thinking that’s wrong, but I’m coming around. Need to read more.

jandrews2.bsky.social•103 days ago

What about a case where you have equal reasons to believe P and ~P, and a reason to think remaining agnostic would be bad, but also an additional motive for P? It seems rational in that case to go with P.

aporetikotatos.bsky.social•103 days ago

Yes, if the grounds for belief aren't solely some non-rational motives, but the reasons otherwise aren't conclusive, we can see how motives for belief can be possible and at least unobjectionable if not salutary. I wonder whether that's true whenever goods in addition to truth are at stake.

aporetikotatos.bsky.social•103 days ago

I also wonder why we shouldn't think that belief for reasons in the narrow sense at issue here ('epistemic' reasons?) is itself motivated belief, i.e., motivated by concern for truth, reasonableness, etc.

jandrews2.bsky.social•103 days ago

That's a great question. It's normal to distinguish reasons from causes (eg neurological) but where do acts or states of will/desire fall under that dichotomy? Aquinas eg seems to think will is involved whenever we don't have infallible deductive knowledge.

houxtian.bsky.social•104 days ago

Not only does it make sense, it was the defining crisis of my early twenties

aporetikotatos.bsky.social•104 days ago

So would you say the crisis of motives was different than a crisis of reasons?

houxtian.bsky.social•104 days ago

It certainly felt that way at the time, as it seems reasons can be refined by reasoning but I had no earthly idea how to refine my motives, nor which motives were worth refining, nor (as all reasoning seemed motivated) how to move “up” from motive to pure reasoning.

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