I asked for "someone". Stop telling me to rely on AIs and LLMs for translation over domain-knowledgeable human translators for these specialized medical guidelines. If we don't have a human translator, how do we know whether its output is right? If we do have a translator, why bother with AI? - ThreadSky

zinniajones.com • 5 days ago

I asked for "someone".

Stop telling me to rely on AIs and LLMs for translation over domain-knowledgeable human translators for these specialized medical guidelines. If we don't have a human translator, how do we know whether its output is right? If we do have a translator, why bother with AI?

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Comments

woollahra.bsky.social•5 days ago

You asked for someone, not something. It's a valid ask to look for German-knowledgeable translators with medical specialization

dachipster.bsky.social•4 days ago

That’s a teeny-tiny domain. And 400 pages is not a small ask. Think how long it would take to type up a copy of The Hobbit. (~300pp).

Now imagine you’re translating from elvish as you go.

woollahra.bsky.social•4 days ago

It's not the size of the domain thats the issue. It's the consistency. For many medical terms there's already a clear medical term or combination of terms in German that everyone needs to use for consistency, same as any specialist realm.

dachipster.bsky.social•4 days ago

My specialist realm is AI. I spent all day yesterday tearing down bad work done by an unstudied coworker with an LLM. I know shit from shinola in this realm, what it can and cannot do.

Trust, but verify. Or wait for the unicorn free german medical translator.

woollahra.bsky.social•4 days ago

If i wanted unicorns in my medical translation, I would have translated a journal article about Spondylitis of the Central Horn In Unicorns and Bicorns.

dachipster.bsky.social•4 days ago

Good one.

webroughtmatches.bsky.social•4 days ago

There are like five 'unicorn' translators in the comments already who volunteered to do this for free. People do actually like using their skills to be helpful, it turns out

woollahra.bsky.social•4 days ago

Never let them do it for free, even if you have to commit to something they're unlikely to collect on... like free lunch in your neck of the woods when they come on past.

spiritomb.bsky.social•4 days ago

Go away

zinniajones.com•5 days ago

If I want a machine to do this, I will ask for *something*.

zinniajones.com•5 days ago

You think racing to be the first one to post "ask ChatGPT" makes you anything other than a profoundly useless person?

dachipster.bsky.social•4 days ago

Because the ai is is not likely to be wrong. It doesn’t always do idiom well, but if you’re looking for a human to do it all it will take forever to find one and for them to do it.

It will be much easier and much faster to find someone to proofread the AI than to translate the 400pp from scratch.

pumpkinspicegob.bsky.social•4 days ago

naa, fuck off with this, the AI models are regularly wrong. And the fact you think they are not, is terrifying.

dachipster.bsky.social•4 days ago

I work with them every day, my MS thesis in AI was in NLP, and the translations I’ve read in Spanish have been OK. But I would still use a proof reader. It will be way faster with an AI assist. But if you think you know my day job better, by all means, give advice on LLPs.

pumpkinspicegob.bsky.social•4 days ago

Exactly. I pegged that from the way you talk about it.

Now take a step out of your fuckin AI bubble, and live in the real world for a bit and see how much the focus of your work is fucking up the world.

I don't give a shit if you're the pope right now, FUCK OFF with AI/LLP/LLM's ect.

dachipster.bsky.social•4 days ago

Dude, pay attention. There’s a LOT wrong with it. But live in the real world: how long it would take you to type out 400 pages? Now ask where you’re going to find the unicorn german medical translator who will do 400pp free. Or is a proofreader easier to find?

Denigrating expertise=MAGA.

pumpkinspicegob.bsky.social•4 days ago

LMFAO, "Bro." Pay the fuck attention.

Computers, cannot be held to account for a mistake.

A person can be.

I'm not saying there's 0 value in what AI has to offer, obviously there is value there, but in this current political and economical climate, you're just harming others and furthering harm.

spiritomb.bsky.social•4 days ago

Translating highly context-dependent language that relies on specific sociological frameworks, where a mistake in interpretation of words like "Geschlecht" can put lives at risk, cannot be entrusted to a machine. Even if humans proofread it afterward.

tailormaede.bsky.social•4 days ago

I’m honestly floored that most if not all the comments are about AI and NOT the fact that they are looking for someone to literally do weeks of work with a specialized skill-set for “little to no pay.” Really?!

This is what it’s like to be a linguist/writer/editor. I shoulda been a plumber….

zinniajones.com•4 days ago

I realize that that's the part of what I asked that's completely fucked up, and I am sorry for it, and I don't know what to do, and if someone got in touch with me and asked 'how much is little pay' I would try to work with them and try to give them the money I have available.

spiritomb.bsky.social•4 days ago

An example: German uses the word "Geschlecht", and only context differentiates whether it should be translated as "gender" or "sex." Trans people do *not* use those words like the (cisnormative) general public. LLMs would predict a cisnormative interpretation and produce a BAD translation.

inanna-nalytica.bsky.social•4 days ago

Honestly, this was not really the case when I used AI tools to translate my trans research proposals back and forth from German. Though this may be reflecting how I wrote the original, and of course I still always checked by back-translating with a different tool to test stability of phrasing.

spiritomb.bsky.social•4 days ago

With all due respect, I don't think you want to die on that hill.

I've typed incorrect German (from my own brain) on numerous occasions into Google translate, which gave me the English for what I was trying to say. My German was still wrong.

inanna-nalytica.bsky.social•4 days ago

It is true that backtranslation could mask errors in an original translation. That said, your specific example seems like it rather indicates that Google Translate here succeeds in capturing intent when going from German to English, so in and of itself would support using it in that direction.

inanna-nalytica.bsky.social•4 days ago

That said, Google Translate is not that good in my experience. For my (successful) BMBF and DZHK medical grants, I translated from the English with DeepL and backtranslated through Google Translate.

inanna-nalytica.bsky.social•4 days ago

For day to day shorter things EN->DE, I mostly went the other direction - Google Translate first, languagetools to fix the occasional error, then DeepL for backtranslation as that consistently has captured meaning better in texts where I know the subject well.

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