Yeah....not a good thing. So basically poor people are gonna have defects? Be second class citizens for not being able to have traits BEFORE birth. This is dystopian.
This is pretty much already the case. Poor pregnant people get worse nutrition and are exposed to more teratogens so their children come into the world with a far higher rate of birth defects.
I read that as typically the rates for defects would remain the same as usual. However if you’d like to cough up a few grand, you can make genetic changes such as sex or eye colour. Kinda like a premium build-a-baby package.
I think of the women/couples that consider the options of freezing their eggs or even same sex couples. What if the women of the partnership that isn’t carrying would like their child to have their hazel eyes, dimples, or ginger hair like their side of the family? I don’t see it as an elite status.
Rather than gene editing specific features we may actually be able to simply have the genes of both partners in the child. substituting the X or Y chromosome of the other partner for the DNA of the donor egg or sperm.
Modern medicine in any capacity beyond the medieval age is borderline playing with god.
This is no different. This is a new procedure. There will be regulations set by sane governments. Regulations may be adjusted the more we learn and discover about it.
No, it's playing with genetic material. I know a couple who had a cranial defect-BOTH of them had it-and they had a child and he had it AND THEY STILL HAD ANOTHER CHILD. If they could've cleaned the genes their kids might have been normal, with healthy skulls. I think they should have adopted. EGO
Playing with God would mean we're creating a whole new thing when we're not, we're using the tools given to us. Is it playing God when we turn grapes into wine or yeast into bread too?
Actually the idea is to try and eliminate any trait that's undesirable in any way so that those traits will in the future be considered defects. Poor people will still have those traits because they can't afford to pay "a few thousand dollars" for the genetics work.
Sadly health benefits in line with wealth is far from a new thing :( Defects are also caused by things like malnutrition and smoking, the incidences of which are much higher where there’s poverty. Types of IVF which select healthy embryos in people with a known genetic abnormality already exists.
Removing birth defects isn’t a bad thing, removing a gene that could give you cancer isn’t a bad thing, removing that extra Y chromosome that makes men violent IE Charles Mason wouldn’t be a bad thing. We have Crispr
Nah shit like that is a game changer. We been living for years it’s about time they come up with something to benefit our longevity. People who have single gene disorders can have it “edited out” of their genes. People with sickle cell, fibrosis etc.
Nature has a way of correcting itself. Suppose the "wrong" gene becomes popular; suddenly, a virus wipes out everyone with that gene. We get to start over. In the end, it's still the survival of the "fittest"
I feel like that argument can be used for a great deal of denying progress. Not meant to travel above 20mph. Not meant to survive viral disease, etc etc.
As someone with many genetic conditions that ruin my quality of life, this sounds great. HOWEVER, we all know the slippery slope this puts us on. I wish we could have nice things without the fear of eugenics 🙃
In this use case, he modified DNA so that the children wouldn’t contract HIV from their fathers, which (imo) certainly has its benefits. What was absolutely unethical was that no one knew he modified the DNA. But I agree, it’s a slippery slope.
Also the need for the genetic modification was unnecessary as sperm washing is already available for HIV positive men wishing to have children. It was a publicity stunt to win the Nobel Prize and cash in through commercialization.
Oh wow! I read that it’s also very rare for children to contract HIV from the father so that lines up. Sad because, in the right hands with the right intentions, gene mod could have positive outcomes, but that’s not the world we live in.
You are right. I am not against genetic engineering. Engineering of somatic cells will be a game changer for hereditary diseases. Unfortunately, it will also be big money for "medical tourism". People will inevitably want to alter their children for non-medical outcomes. Ethics matter though.
Sperm washing? What century are you in?
People with HIV on effective treatment have undetectable levels of HIV meaning they can’t pass it on. U=U undetectable equals untransmittable.
That includes conceiving and giving birth without passing it on.
I am in this century. Many countries in less affluent circumstances have used this and was mentioned several times in the reviews of his actions as cheaper and more practical in poor nations.
Wait, is this the guy who gave the embryos CCR5 Delta32 Deletion mutation? I remember it needs 2 mutations and his research only gave 1 twin 1 mutation. It left them at higher risk to be severity ill from flu. Also weird to make it about HIV when that same gene also makes you immune to cancer
I think he was messing with genes closely related to intelligence and brain functioning. Condemned for it worldwide. However CRISPER is a relatively cheap technology. Worrying. First . Do. No . Harm.
I’ve only seen this snippet of the story. Interesting - and unsurprising - to learn that there’s much more to it. There are far too many variables outside of genetics that influence intelligence. Probably not the best place to start.
What do we weed out? How quickly do we start to eliminate the future existence of groups of people who currently exist as valid, worthy human beings? It may start with just the big stuff, but then it will be every little thing. Trying to craft the “perfect” human. What does that look like?
I think this is a good thing that requires A LOT of moral restraint This doctor used it to erase a certain gene from the baby to prevent them from having AIDS once born (father was positive) but it can very quickly go into designer baby/frankenstein territory & we all know money erases boundaries
As he should be! It’s an ethical/moral dilemma fs! I was just stating that I think this practice could do great things for certain situations but that it should be a throughly, highly regulated practice.
But if that can’t be (& I’m sure it won’t be) then the practice should be banned altogether 🤷🏾♀️
AIDS isn't heredity. Babies are born with it- they get it if exposed during birth of after. You can safely have a HIV/AIDS Free child if your infected with preventatives. The guy claims he uses CCR5 Delta 32 mutation so the child wouldn't get AIDS later in life. Also, he was only able to get it to
I'm hoping there are reasonable bounds. Sickle cell gene? Repair that in utero. Height gene, maybe leave that alone. We don't need Gattaca around here.
I can see how this can be abused with "Designer Babies", but this could help babies that would not survive due to a deadly birth defect. It should be limited to that. I am sure they could enact some serious safeguards.
If you could remove the sickle cell gene, or polycythemia, or spina bifida, diabetes, or any of a number of other disabling defects, wouldn't you do it? But I don't think this tech will be SAFE for a long time yet. Won't stop 'em marketing it.
Because the common consumer has no idea what the effects of editing a certain gene will be, I believe that “Gene Therapy Consultants” will become a necessary occupation to assist families in their decisions and protect them from bad actors, like how a lawyer helps their client navigate complex laws.
I’m for this if it can focus on eliminating or controlling genes that can potentially inhibit people’s lives down the road, but with that being said, it should be affordable to all. I think manipulating something like eye color is cool but should rank lower on the list.
True and every episode ends terribly 🥴😂 but people don’t see it is a cautionary tale and them critiquing the lines of ethics when it comes to tech/science
I'm afraid of mRNA tech to begin with. Are we truly good enough to predict the true outcomes of our DNA tinkering? I tinker with electronics and software, but never a person.
“Yea, I think my child having a vagina and blue eyes is worth a few thousand dollars. No, I don’t think a better use of some of that money would be to feed a struggling family with kids that are already alive”
Gene editing is nothing new. And has been going on for years back then they were called designer babies. But this could be amazing for people who don’t want to pass on certain genes that cause diseases to their children’s. Genetic disorders as well
I don't think they were gene editing. They were testing embryos and then the parents were only using Certain ones to their liking- hence designer babies. (besides this guy) there was that one in UK? That made one with 3 parents.. i think
🤷🏾♀️ you're supposed to be selective with the person you choose to have a baby with for the same reason tbh but people like to pretend that's not the original basis of attraction.
I'm going to take a more positive approach and suggest it's to reduce or eliminate genetically inherited diseases, like cystic fibrosis, congenital deafness, muscular dystrophy, sickle cell disease, Tay-Sachs disease and others.
I'd say that depends on the use. If your fetus has a high genetic propensity for debilitating and potentially life-threatening illnesses, I could see paying a couple grand to give them a more healthy life being worth it. but really, no deciding eye color, skin tone, hair texture, how smart, etc.
Makes me consider the implications of humankind continually removing itself from the natural selection process.
Also, the rich becoming an upper-class 2nd species in a way, healthier, stronger, more resistant to disease than the poors 🤔
Lets give it another 10-20 years, how much for immortality? 😇
Here we go with genetically modified children for a price, of course. However, embryonic sex modifications have been taken place for years in South Korea, India and China.
Yeah, I gotta agree a few thousand dollars will rule out autism a few hundred thousand dollars will turn the elite's children into geniuses. The unlevel playing field even gets worse
gene editing therapy is aimed at treating genetic diseases and it’s already available for some diseases e.g lyfgenia for sickle cell disease, just not before birth
I am pretty sure there will be regulations about that. People tend to draw lines on anything new that they don't adequately understand just yet, and then adjust that line the more it is understood.
They are using this therapy for fetuses that would be born with Cystic fibrosis & it has been successful. Goal is to wipe out CF completely, which would be a great thing, because that disease is so very cruel.
I understand the sentiment and I don't doubt gene editing is going to cause a lot of problems but if we can get it down right it will literally be the next step in human evolution
If it’s for congenital anomalies, fine (sickle cell disease could theoretically be eradicated). If it’s so you get a blonde haired blue eyed baby, absolutely not.
If used ethically (and ONLY if used ethically), this could be amazing. Immunity to major diseases, for example, could save MILLIONS of lives. However, this also sounds like a eugenicist's dream, and it's a bit optimistic to expect ethics and ONLY ethics from our capitalist healthcare system...
In this case, the scientist pictured found a way to edit genes so that children born with this treatment have complete immunity to HIV. I believe the good outweighs the bad, we’ve known CRISPR was going to bring about this eventually.
Not going to lie, if I had a family history of a fatal disease and I could edit it out to ensure my child would not get it, I would and not even think twice
Therapy is about healing, not about modifying babies to order. This kind of therapy already exists. What this man says is that the therapy will be increasingly cheaper, therefore more available to parents who need it in order to ensure their babies are born healthier.
This is more dangerous than ai.. imagine another hitler anti christ figure shows up and gets ahold of this kind of tech and twists it.. literal comic book super villain shit. It would be more ethical to learn how to gene edit and cure diseases post birth then pre birth.
Overwhelmingly the sci-fi horror scenario is one big evil company controlling (insert new tech here). pre-natal therapeutic gene editing with ethical constraints could be profoundly positive. There are conditions that if not treated very early cause profound problems.
7 years from now, when I’m trying to run away from the genetically modified super fast running Zombie children with wings… I’m gonna remember this post, as one of them takes me down and starts chewing on my head.
Just to play devils advocate - genetic diseases could be wiped out, defects and other issues prevented before birth. The QOL for so many could be improved
I have a friend working in this field, and it truly can be amazing
It could also be a tool for some horrific things (like many other things)
Comments
This is no different. This is a new procedure. There will be regulations set by sane governments. Regulations may be adjusted the more we learn and discover about it.
Gene editing can save millions of lives, if applied and regulated correctly. Screening and correcting for life-threatening defects is a net positive.
People with HIV on effective treatment have undetectable levels of HIV meaning they can’t pass it on. U=U undetectable equals untransmittable.
That includes conceiving and giving birth without passing it on.
https://marcelsberg.com/en/helix
Gundam Seed predicted the future and its BLEAK AF
But if that can’t be (& I’m sure it won’t be) then the practice should be banned altogether 🤷🏾♀️
feelsike weve seen that movie
Also, the rich becoming an upper-class 2nd species in a way, healthier, stronger, more resistant to disease than the poors 🤔
Lets give it another 10-20 years, how much for immortality? 😇
Should be interesting.
Also ...Sky Net is real!
Also, this is the guy who edited the chinese babies and went to jail for that, right? Right?
i support gene editing of humans far more than gene editing of agricultural plants
But then I wondered, could we correct any MAGA genes? 🤣
there is literally nothing wrong with it
I have a friend working in this field, and it truly can be amazing
It could also be a tool for some horrific things (like many other things)
Mom: “Lee Woo at Cellulo Corp.”