The UK could now get into the place Harold Macmillan foresaw and feared - trapped between Europe and America, unable to choose either. Let's see how it pans out, but we may be simply forced to join the Customs Union and consider some sort of Anglo-French defence union. - ThreadSky

gsoh31.bsky.social • 145 days ago

The UK could now get into the place Harold Macmillan foresaw and feared - trapped between Europe and America, unable to choose either. Let's see how it pans out, but we may be simply forced to join the Customs Union and consider some sort of Anglo-French defence union.

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dankelly.bsky.social•144 days ago

Hard to contemplate a defensive union with a country that could tip towards the Ukraine-skeptic far right at any time. We might need to consider some sort of Anglo-Scandi-Baltic alliance.

jonconnorton.com•145 days ago

Time to renew the Dunkirk Treaty?

vanders.bsky.social•145 days ago

The UK & France already have some sort of defence union through the Lancaster House Treaties.

techpriest.bsky.social•145 days ago

Though those treaties were written when Britain was an EU member state and may need updating

IMO Britain also needs to be reaching out on defence to Poland, in a big way

gsoh31.bsky.social•145 days ago

Yep: If we want or need to get really radical, this will have to include a new nuclear sharing deal with Eastern European states (and more nukes) if the Americans effectively remove the nuclear shield. The risk of general war will rise appreciably if there is a deterrence gap emanating from DC.

vanders.bsky.social•145 days ago

The EU already has a mutual-defence clause, so in theory France would have to defend the baltic states or any other EU member if they requested it. Most EU countries are also in NATO, with similar requirements.

In practice you'd have to convince France to take a much deeper leading roll in NATO.

vanders.bsky.social•145 days ago

Up to and including distributed their nuclear weapons to other countries, developing & producing more of them, and co-operating with the UK on weapons development. All which is a pretty tough sell given France's relationship with NATO over the past 60 years.

gsoh31.bsky.social•145 days ago

It's tough times tho - if Trump goes for some of the more radical options in front of him.

techpriest.bsky.social•145 days ago

Though I suspect France's relationship with NATO changes radically if Trump straight up abrogates the treaty and America withdraws. At that point it's a European defence treaty that Canada is somehow a member of

vanders.bsky.social•145 days ago

I'm fairly sure Brexit didn't change anything. The UK & France have done things like joint carrier exercises since the UK left the EU.

finn86.bsky.social•145 days ago

If forced to chose, we will have to make ourselves indispensable to America I'm afraid. By far our strongest current ties are with America + in any case, Europe has shown no ability to secure itself. Being on the Europeans bad side is unfortunate, being on the American's bad side could be terminal

paulframe85.bsky.social•145 days ago

What, with a fascist Le Pen in power?

rich-bryant.uk•145 days ago

saw some interesting polling the other day - right-wing French voters, le Pen's base, want to support Ukraine and hate Trump.

It's not entirely surprising, he's like the AntiFrench. Everything your French person despises all in one orange sausage skin.

gsoh31.bsky.social•145 days ago

Yes, I don't think this reads across - like hanging around with Trump isn't going to help Farage break out of his base in the UK.

mattythurst.bsky.social•145 days ago

A lot of people saying it will embolden the far right but I can see an opposite come true.

Le Pen would be right to remain at arms length if she hopes to win

gsoh31.bsky.social•145 days ago

Yeah, okay I can see Reform UK winning more seats if the Tories try to 'ersatz nationalist party' them, but Trump is toxic in the UK.

paulsingh.bsky.social•145 days ago

I think circumstances might force Britain’s hand now. The pressure on Starmer will become overwhelming.

jpasher.bsky.social•145 days ago

Hear me out: we ask to become an overseas department of France

jpasher.bsky.social•145 days ago

Just think how much better the weather will be

gsoh31.bsky.social•145 days ago

And the bread.

jpasher.bsky.social•145 days ago

Last one to the Alliance Française is a rotten egg!

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