we've introduced spray bottles for misbehaving kittens and the only thing that's changed is that now my cat is constantly soaked while he's committing crimes
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I know there's very much a "don't give advice if it's not asked for," but I'll ignore that to tell you negative reinforcement does not work on cats and in fact will absolutely destroy your relationship with your cat. do not do this, I fucking beg of you.
Yep spray bottles etc aren't very effective just a note that these are positive punishment not negative reinforcement. Reinforcement is a consequence that increases the behavior. Spray bottles are trying to reduce the behavior (punishment) by adding a stimulus (positive)
Sorry if I'm being pedantic but I think you got them backwards, reducing the behavior results in positive behavioral results by adding a negative (punishment) stimulus.
You can reinforce an unwanted behavior (usually inadvertently.) It's still reinforcement if the behavior increases. And if the behavior is attention maintained even "bad" attention (scolding) can still serve as a positive reinforcer. It's a tricky concept that confuses people often.
Nope I'm literally a behaviorist my profession. Positive in this context doesn't mean good or enjoyable. It is in mathematical terms- positive means adding something. Negative means taking something away. Reinforcement = increasing a behavior and punishment = reducing the behavior.
that's just normal kitten behavior. the only way to reduce it is to redirect them. it is catastrophic (not an exaggeration) to "punish" them. cats do NOT associate the punishment with the action. They associate it with the person. all you'll succeed in doing is making it fear you.
no I know! cats are kind of weird because they react quite differently than dogs. so you'd think "hey don't do that, asshole" will fix it, but it'll just make them afraid of you, but they'll still do the thing you hate.
We have....too many cats and I was about to say the same thing. The worst part is cats are so different that sometimes even the stuff you linked doesn't work on some. One particular cat gets bored easily. We only slightly reduced destructive behavior with a cat wheel.
I have your kitten! We're doing lots of distraction, plenty of toys. Removal of temptation. About to collect things from hardware place to cover leads and stop chewing. Shelves, well, try to remove temptation, ways of getting to them. If he insists, provide safe access? It's like getting a toddler.
Also a lot of cat behavioral training is redirecting their attention (I do this when my two cats r in a standoff) with something like a toy that brings them away from the problem area
https://www.instagram.com/tv/ClEhAp0pqpV/?igsh=NTc4MTIwNjQ2YQ== this behaviorist helped me a TON when it came to getting my two cats to get along, but she has great tips in general for behavioral training both for cats and dogs that might help!!! she’s not active on insta anymore and prefers email for q’s but her vids r still up
Cover your electrical wires with
a plastic product .
I used this after my kitten was teething
and chewed my usb
cords.
I've tried clapping but he just takes a bow.
He's trained us and turned out well behaved and adjusted,better than
us actually.
Kittens are tough and good advice is needed.😸
Jackson Galaxy has great ressources on cat training on his website and socials. Really hyper cats and kittens need active, interactive playtime to spend that energy.
I never ever use the stove when my cats are out. I put them in my bedroom until I'm done, then I cover the burner with a turned over cold sheet pan. I cover cords with old bath towels or blankets. I block cabinets with jugs of litter so they can't get lost in there, or the walls.
I've been careful with my boys, and they'll be 14 soon. It takes a lot of diligence, but it's worth it to avoid injury, misery, disability, pain, huge vet bills, etc.
This is overblown. If you have a good relationship with your cats they will understand that you telling them off doesn't mean you hate them now or that they're unsafe
cats have an entire language of "cut that out you asshole" amongst themselves and it's weird to assume that it's impossible to establish such an understanding cross-species
they will however absolutely reserve the right to be little shitheads and continue to do the thing you want them to stop doing when they think you aren't looking
Sometimes my older cats chomp a younger cat's ear when they won't calm down, then 20 seconds later, they're happily cuddling as though nothing happened. I definitely won't go that far, but some things (like jumping up on the stove) need a quick, decisive response.
This spray bottles do very little and honestly the only reason I have one is if my two get into a spat and I need to break it up without getting close.
I sprayed my cat once and she loved it. I had the spray bottle for misting plants and she started coming over when I was misting them so she could get sprayed. Truly baffling
hissing at my cat (learn the different ways to do it) has unironically been 1000000x more effective than any kind of negative reinforcement has, and it comes with way less guilt ^^
LOLLL Bro has that SASS. Mine respects my authority m but I feel bad because he always looks at me like :( and I'm like I'm sorryyyy but you cant chew on my pen
My partner is really good at making the various growls, huffs, and hisses that get the cats to stop whatever they’re doing and back off. Me, not so much.
Did you put lemon juice in the water? That’s what we used for our dog, to break up a fight if necessary. Safer than trying to tackle an irate German shepherd. 😬
One of our old cats, Scrubby, would get Ideas in his head and he could not be dissuaded from them. Like "I want to be on the kitchen counter." Most cats learn pretty quickly what "No" means - Scrubby's brother Hash did, every other cat I've ever owned did too. Scrubby was Different.
He'd keep jumping back up over and over and over and over and over and over, like he couldn't help himself. He heard us telling him "no" over and over and over and he'd get upset becaues he just didn't understand. He *wanted* to be a good cat - but he also wanted to follow those ideas in his head.
No exaggeration, I'd shoo or push him off the counter over 30 times in under two hours. I resorted to the squirt bottle. Didn't help - he still kept jumping up and now, instead of crying about not understanding what his people wanted, he would cry about being wet and not understanding.
Eventually, the idea just dislodged itself from his brain - I'm pretty sure the squirt bottle and the Nos and the shooing-off had nothing to do with it, he just moved on from the idea that he had to be on the kitchen counter.
He was the sweetest little orange goofball, but he never had his day with the braincell. Always purring, though, and the belly was never a trap. Best kitty.
no no you're good hun lol the post is just moving quickly and lots of people wanna give me similar advice! just wanted to make it clear I've been informed
Some do - same with Burmese - i have a new kitten, Layanese cross, a mix of Himalayan/Tonkinese. Tonkinese are Siamese/Burmese descent. Himalayan are Siamese/Persian descent. He begs me to run the water. While i was working next to sink last night, he curled up and went to sleep in sink.
Please don't use spray bottles, I mean you can but it may make your cats misbehave more or become aggressive. I'm not saying they will, but they can. Try to find other solutions if possible.
We’ve got a new kitten in the house too. We’re all covered in scratches with our hands and feet pulled up into the chairs, watching the floors like we’re in a horror movie. The beast is a terrorist!
Playing is one thing but negative Kitten behavior like biting will become adult behavior if not corrected. My young cat was not deterred by a spray of water. I used an air can like you clean your keyboard with and it worked very well.
That is unbelievably cruel. Do a little research. Your name suits you. Poor kitten. I hope someone in animal rescue reads this and takes that kitten away from you. Monster.
We tried this. lol, our one little monster figured out how far that bottle would spray. Hed’d commit his crime, then as soon as he had an inkling of the bottle, he’d run - juuust out of range. Then he’d stare at you. If you took your shot, he’d wait, then go over and lick the water off the floor.
Ive used spray bottles, plastic bag sounds, and air cans. I know I shouldn't use them because it doesn't teach them that bad act was bad, only that the can or dad is scary. I highly recommend having treats on person and rewarding good behavior, and using a clicker for treats and associate that sound
My cat's a fucking dumbass. He walks right into the sink when I'm doing dishes, so I spray him full-blast to fuck off. He just stands there, takes it, and when it's over he just has a look on his face like "What did I do to deserve this?"
Spray bottles generally don't work with cats, as others have said.
They're sneaky as hell and all you're teaching them is to do whatever it is when you're not there.
They are good for cooling them (and you) down in hot weather though.
Try a can of compressed air, the sound startles and most don't like the air being blown at them, but not too close as they propellant could cause freeze burns.
Mine were the same way. They would just grit their little teeth and take it. Then off on their own merry way to do more criming. Miss those guys. Been gone now for almost 10 years now. Enjoy!
not a cat owner but I keep thinking >a lot< how they shame other animals by tapping them on the face and hissing and if it's a good idea to try it on them... but gently
There is no “misbehavior” of kittens. There is only a human trying to influence them to follow what kittens perceive as odd rules. Manage the environment to prevent the behaviors from occurring. This is the smart way. It’s not their failure,
but ours. Love, Animal Lady
I tried that bitter apple stuff on cords once since my two like to chew cords and my girl started to chew, made an awful face, then kept right on chewing while making that face while looking me dead in the eye like "I know it was you that did this". To assert dominance.
I've also done foster care. Spray bottles can work on most cats. Redirecting behavior can also help. Every cat is different. Spray bottles are not animal abuse, it's to disrupt their focus on the negative behavior. However, I did reserve it for adult cats. Kittens were kept to an isolated space.
I can't imagine having a life so comfortable and free of actual abuse that they'd think a spray bottle constitutes abuse. Not that it can't be used to abuse cats, but like I can throw treats at them too, that's not a point lol
I get it. I have strong opinions, too. I saw some real horrors doing animal foster care. I still keep a mini box cutter in my purse because of the number of duct taped boxes left in parking lots or dumpsters with no air holes.
Lurkers, if spray bottles aren't working, don't keep using them.
The thread here is plain.
All cats learn about the threat, but none of them change their behaviour without negative stimuli being present and for some it becomes a positive.
I've had some cats that the spray bottle worked so well on that I could make the sound with my mouth and they'd stop whatever crime they were committing. Then there are others who stare me down as water drips off their face, before continuing merrily along 🤷♀️
Cat Mommy if 40+ years. Been there done that,got the wet T-shirt. Doesnt work. Stop yelling, go big on praise, then withdraw praise and develop the Mom glare and the "ah ah AH". That works.
The most effective thing I’ve come across is those cans of compressed air. For some reason cats hate the sound it makes. I don’t even have to use it anymore. If I grab the can they run away immediately
Yep, spray bottles are not a deterrent to a hardcore cat (or kitten) they just see it as a sacrifice they must make to get what they want. I tried that once with a cat that desperately wanted to always drag my loaf of bread down to the floor, and chew into it, ruining it.
The best is when they just look at you & lick it off like "huh, this doesn't taste like the drink I ordered" then fuck off w/cuteness to the next feline felony
I had that problem too, after getting soaked he’d go run and hide in the litter box when I’d finally decide to go stop whatever he was doing. Wet kittens and cat sand weren’t fun.
Did this with my cat. She runs before you even get a spray off but is back 3 seconds later to do it again. I say mine hates me because she's so standoffish but she's like that with everyone. She also does things that say the opposite of I hate you. Like showing her belly and beggin' for belly rubs.
I once had a cat just like that. He loved food too. And to open doors. And to ride on my shoulders. And he was the biggest cuddle bug ever. I miss him ❤️🥹
When we got our dog as a puppy we tried negative reinforcement using a bottle full of beads, the idea was you shake it and she wouldn't like the noise and stop the bad behaviour. She thought it was a great game and loved the noisy bottle. It did not work as a training tool lol.
We put quarters in a soda can and duct taped the top closed. A couple of shakes from that thing and the cats as well a the dogs 'snapped to'. It was loud enough to break the pattern and annoying or scary enough that after a time or two they stopped.
I sprayed my kitten one time, and she's so scared of the bottle that I just leave it on the counter. I've broken her from trying to jump on the kitchen counters.
I used to do this, after a lot of research and reflection concluded that it’s actually harmful. The best things you can do to curb unwanted behaviors is to provide alternative items for scratching, and put litter boxes in places that get marked. Fluoxetine also works for inappropriate elimination.
Also, I have used spray bottles and will again if needed. It's best used as a consequence, and no more, as all disciplinary methods should be. The trick is, are you disciplining, or punishing. There is a difference and if it's the latter, it will just piss off the cat.
Comments
genuinely, kittens are kind of insane. they WILL calm down but in the meantime there's a lot of "hey play with this instead" to be done. 💓
Otherwise, fantastic point.
https://www.mspca.org/angell_services/top-5-ways-to-redirect-undesirable-behaviors-in-cats/
He stays on his end
of the table and never expresses any interest in our food and it all worked out extremely
well somehow.
We feed him when we eat and we're all fat and happy.
Cat's are weird, and
all different for sure
Not one size fits all
Put aluminum foil on the shelves or surfaces you don’t want baby kitty on, they don’t like the crinkle.
If you don’t have cable sleeves you can get them online! https://a.co/d/7pSNJvu (sorry for Amazon link; other places have them too!)
a plastic product .
I used this after my kitten was teething
and chewed my usb
cords.
I've tried clapping but he just takes a bow.
He's trained us and turned out well behaved and adjusted,better than
us actually.
Kittens are tough and good advice is needed.😸
first step is to accept that not only is it harmful, it won’t work. cats will just do it when you’re not looking
second step is to contain the cat. you can put the kitty in a crate or zipped playpen, like a puppy, when things are dangerous.
then, separate the consequence from you.
positive reinforcement is key — treats when they’re Off
if positive reinforcement isn’t working, AND IT’S A MATTER OF LIFE AND LIMB
they make something called a “scat mat” that administers a tiny (battery-powered) shock, like no worse than bad static. cats hate it.
after my sisters constantly soaking
a disturbed kitten created a monster
My cat still mistrusts me after 8 years of spoiling him and no discipline
I've never raised my
voice but he doesn't wreck furniture or really do anything wrong
except that cat caution
So try peeing on your cat
We tried to be gracious
He still did the crime
Blinking and bobbing his head
We took him off the bench
✊🏼
Cat life 😂🤣😂
Fortunately, they have short memories, although my older one can hold a grudge.
Pets and treats as a reward for good behavior worked.
Spraying it just creates fear.
They're sneaky as hell and all you're teaching them is to do whatever it is when you're not there.
They are good for cooling them (and you) down in hot weather though.
Then we learned to just make that noise ourselves to interrupt his bad behavior and send him running.
I miss having a young naughty cat.
He’ll be an absolute menace and the water spritz is just another game to play.
If that doesn’t work, indoor fire hose?
There’s further escalation options if needed:
He would hear the shower or bath being used, race up the stairs and jump in 😂
but ours. Love, Animal Lady
Lurkers, if spray bottles aren't working, don't keep using them.
All cats learn about the threat, but none of them change their behaviour without negative stimuli being present and for some it becomes a positive.
Turn and shake 4,5,6, 7
Some cats get it.
Some never get it.
And Some will just become swimmers.
I simply moved everything that the naughty cat couldn't leave alone AND! created alternative things for it to get in "trouble" with.
UNGOVERNABLE