This thread also talks to the wrong aircraft identified possibility. Plus a few other bits like possibly using night vision goggles that could have impacted the situation. Worth a read. #AA5342 bsky.app/profile/puck... - ThreadSky

wandrme.paxex.aero • 29 days ago

This thread also talks to the wrong aircraft identified possibility. Plus a few other bits like possibly using night vision goggles that could have impacted the situation. Worth a read.

#AA5342

https://bsky.app/profile/puckthepilot.bsky.social/post/3lgx4xvyxsa2r

Reposted from Puck the Puddle Pilot

Initial thoughts.

1. 3 crew members means reduced visibility on one side of the aircraft.

2. based on coms they either lost sight of the CRJ or were looking at the wrong aircraft when they said they saw it.

3. Tower behaved normally.

Comments

chasetralka.com•28 days ago

I made a quick map for my non-avgeek friends. It seems to me, after reviewing ATC audio and ADS-B data, that the helicopter pilots (green) were expecting a plane to be landing on 01 (blue path) and looking out the right side of the cockpit, rather than it coming from the left on the purple path.

chasetralka.com•28 days ago

Additional context: Those arrows are the expected pathways, not the actual ones. The chopper appears to have been further into the river (reducing separation from planes on short final) and higher than the 200' AGL specified for Route 4.

Caveats: Preliminary data and I'm not an NTSB investigator.

chasetralka.com•28 days ago

Aviation folks talk about the Swiss Cheese model: errors will happen, but unless all the holes line up an accident won't occur. Sadly the holes lined up. ATC thinks chopper has the plane, chopper thinks plane is on 01 approach, plane thinks chopper has them, chopper drifts a little west and up… bang

sebgregg.bsky.social•28 days ago

Yeah. Good visualization, good work.

curtosis.bsky.social•28 days ago

It’s partly accurate (they did change runways for the landing a/c) but: drawing the helo’s path as an arc makes it look like they were in their lane, when ADS-B shows them mid-river. More importantly, it doesn’t show the vertical separation: they were supposed to be < 200ft and were reporting 350.

chasetralka.com•28 days ago

Yes, should have specified further (ran out of characters) those arrows are the expected pathways, not the actual ones. The helicopter does appear to have been further into the river (thus reducing separation from planes on short final) and higher than the 200' AGL specified for helicopter Route 4.

curtosis.bsky.social•28 days ago

Yep. Route 1 and the river crossing route are also at or below 200 MSL between at least Memorial (north) and Wilson (south) bridges.

chasetralka.com•28 days ago

Correct. The helicopter chart doesn't really make it clear where Route 1 turns into Route 4 (seems to be either when you pass Haines Point or when you cross Route 6), but all of them should be below 200' MSL (I put AGL in my post but in this area they're functionally the same).

curtosis.bsky.social•28 days ago

Obviously early days, preliminary data always incomplete, etc.

fatguynaltlcoat.bsky.social•28 days ago

this is so helpful. thank you so much

emilgson.bsky.social•28 days ago

Seems like something an air traffic controller might have spotted and been able to warn them about ?

wandrme.paxex.aero•29 days ago

https://bsky.app/profile/afacwa.org/post/3lgxsftmaf222

wandrme.paxex.aero•28 days ago

https://bsky.app/profile/airlineflyer.net/post/3lgxubztctk2e

wandrme.paxex.aero•28 days ago

https://bsky.app/profile/flightradar24.com/post/3lgxugn7x722g

wandrme.paxex.aero•28 days ago

https://bsky.app/profile/willguisbond.com/post/3lgxv2f2t422a

wandrme.paxex.aero•28 days ago

On the one hand I want everyone to stop making this about the administration change or anything that happened in the past 10 days.

On the other hand, fuck that guy and anyone else who dares to shit on the work ATC does.

https://bsky.app/profile/davidslotnick.bsky.social/post/3lgxvs4x74s27

#AA5342

wandrme.paxex.aero•28 days ago

https://bsky.app/profile/jonostrower.com/post/3lgxw7davvb24

dubya20790.bsky.social•28 days ago

This is who they are dude

carljanderson.bsky.social•28 days ago

But let's be clear.. If Harris had fired the FAA Chief, had the ATC Hiring freeze, and gutted the Safety Coucil.. it would be all over Fox News.

This is why Dems lose elections.

wbianco.bsky.social•27 days ago

Since 2014, the FAA worked to diversify air traffic control. Did they compromise safety? Everything Policy analyzed data on hiring and mishaps. While mishap rates vary, there is no sign that the initiative reduced safety. For details, see https://tinyurl.com/yc456yw8. #AirDisaster #AA5342 #FAA #DEI

megateer.bsky.social•29 days ago

This thread and another thread responding to this one as well as your threads all show why investigations are so important before we try to make conclusions - so many good points and possibilities of the many issues that likely contributed to this tragedy.

travelbuddha.bsky.social•29 days ago

For reference, another AA liveried CR7 landed immediately before #AA5342, on runway 1 (not runway 33 where AA5342 was attempting to land). Immediately behind N709PS in landing sequence were an AA A319 followed by an AA 738. The next CRJ to land was at 4000ft of altitude when the accident happened.

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