The average speed of a train from Manchester to London is 89mph. It takes around 135 minutes to cover 200 miles. HS2 was planned to make that faster. The average speed of a train from Manchester to Leeds is just 44mph. That's why we need Northern Powerhouse Rail. - ThreadSky

slowbikeiain.bsky.social • 57 days ago

The average speed of a train from Manchester to London is 89mph. It takes around 135 minutes to cover 200 miles. HS2 was planned to make that faster.

The average speed of a train from Manchester to Leeds is just 44mph.

That's why we need Northern Powerhouse Rail.

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artesea.co.uk•57 days ago

I'm in Leeds later this week. 70 miles away, takes 60 minutes on the train (although I do have a 15 wait at Doncaster as the directs are rare).

devpat.bsky.social•57 days ago

And in Wales ..68 miles from Carmarthen to Cardiff takes 1hr 50 mins ..that's about 38mph. That's why we need our £4bn contribution to HS2 back. @YesCymru @Plaid_Cymru

adamedwardscycles.bsky.social•57 days ago

New 110mph tracks are under construction between Huddersfield and Dewsbury right now. They separate fast and slow trains enabling more local services to run. Liverpool to Stalybridge is now electric. Wires are advancing to Leeds from the east. Trans Pennine Upgrade is happening right now.

slowbikeiain.bsky.social•57 days ago

That is true. It's late and it won't fix a lot of the problems, but some elements are happening.

garyinscotland.bsky.social•57 days ago

40 million domestic flights are made in the UK every year, over 20 million of those between Glasgow/Edinburgh and London. Our local train services share their rail track with intercity and freight trains. They all use the same track. That's why we need HS2.

garyinscotland.bsky.social•57 days ago

Building HS2 would give you Northern Powerhouse Rail at a stroke by freeing up all the track space currently shared between local Northern Rail services AND Intercity trains AND freight trains for Northern Rail and freight alone.

worcesteryokel.bsky.social•57 days ago

It took about that time when I started doing the London Manchester journey as a student in 1974. 50 years on and no change in speed.

muddymoles.bsky.social•57 days ago

HS2 was planned to get the fast traffic, which needs to be hugely spaced out, away from freight and local services. A massive upgrade to existing capacity. Crippled by poor management brought about by politics.

gloriousnse.bsky.social•57 days ago

To be pedantic, HS2 was planned to increase capacity, and the "faster" was to be a byproduct of the new capacity.

And currently, frustratingly, there isn't a live plan to get it anywhere near Manchester.

But yes we need better rail in other places too.

slowbikeiain.bsky.social•57 days ago

Indeed, but my post was about speed rather than capacity so I mentioned that element of HS2, prior to phase 2b being canned.

gloriousnse.bsky.social•57 days ago

IMHO too much focus on the element of speed can create an argument that you don't need to add any new north-south infra through the midlands and north because that bit is fast(ish) already...

When the reality is it does need it, as capacity is really limited and already causing issues.

slowbikeiain.bsky.social•57 days ago

Trains from Manchester to Leeds (and, indeed, Liverpool, Sheffield, Bradford etc.) are criminally slow. That's major issue.

Happy to discuss HS2 separately, and the need to free up the congested WCML for more freight and local trains while increasing North-South capacity.

gloriousnse.bsky.social•57 days ago

Agreed, I just think that setting up arguments of one versus the other creates a situation where we likely get neither, rather than one or the other.

Especially as the Manchester bit of this was supposed to be something used by both, and having neither seems very much to be on the cards.

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