Do you know what depresses me about the UK #wine scene? Nice restaurants who push cheap-as-chips wine and peddle falsehoods. e.g. "Old-established family co-op..." Collis is the largest co-op around, making 100 000 000 litres of wine per year. - ThreadSky

emmabentleyvino.bsky.social • 82 days ago

Do you know what depresses me about the UK #wine scene?

Nice restaurants who push cheap-as-chips wine and peddle falsehoods.

e.g. "Old-established family co-op..."

Collis is the largest co-op around, making 100 000 000 litres of wine per year.

Comments

emmabentleyvino.bsky.social•82 days ago

"The result of this expertise and organization is around 100 million litres of wine..."

"60% is bottled and sold on international markets by companies in the Group, including Cantine Riondo, and the two subsidiaries Cielo e Terra and Casa Vinicola Sartori."

https://www.collisgroup.it/en/on-the-market/collis-bulk-wine/

emmabentleyvino.bsky.social•82 days ago

As a wine trade, we kept on being told to tell stories to reel in our customers, but aren't they going to wake up one day and see that it's a web of (at best) exaggerations and (at worse) lies.

Why can't the somm or the wine-list be honest?

"Drink this, it's a bit sweet and it's cheap."

milanowski-tony.bsky.social•82 days ago

Bit tricky as the owners of the coop probably do include lots of family vineyards. Making it worse is the coop model can be better situation than beingba small supplier to corporate wine conglomerate.
So I would view this as potential positive

emmabentleyvino.bsky.social•82 days ago

Unfortunately, in the case of my small town, the big wine conglomerate (with 7 production facilities all over Italy, original site here, also making Kylie's prosecco rosé) is the one which still has an appetite for buying grapes. The local (small) co-op is struggling.

emmabentleyvino.bsky.social•82 days ago

But in the case of Collis, with 6000 suppliers, the % of grapes coming from original-family-owned vineyards is going to be diluted to a pittance.

I guess it annoys me most how the "Italian family" idyllic is rolled out again and again.
(And yes, I did marry into an Italian winemaking family! 🤣)

milanowski-tony.bsky.social•81 days ago

It hard to know who supplies grapes from outside, but I am guessing that there will reports that will list how many are small family concerns (say 10ha or less) vs memebers who have acquired additonal properties over the years and now are more company orientated

milanowski-tony.bsky.social•82 days ago

Howevet any quality food establishment that use "tipple" goes in the bin

tomlewiscambridge.bsky.social•82 days ago

Came here to say the same thing - "tipple" is an absolute red flag.

Separately, why is high-volume production considered a negative indicator for wine quality? Mass-produced cars are much cheaper and more reliable than handmade, for example.

janetrad.bsky.social•82 days ago

Same in France. Coops are demonized so they do all they can to disguise their origin. But they meet a need, so why be coy about it?

emmabentleyvino.bsky.social•82 days ago

Exactly, they meet a need; both in terms of farmers with vines who would never succeed in bottling and commercialising their own products, and for creating distribution networks that go far further than a family-sized winery.
Some work well too. The trade ought to be telling those stories.

donalde.bsky.social•81 days ago

Is Collis the same as Cielo e Terra? I can see how they’d have bought it based on the producer profile off bancroft’s website.

donalde.bsky.social•81 days ago

That looks like Dishoom?

emmabentleyvino.bsky.social•81 days ago

Very observant! Dishoom Edinburgh.

donalde.bsky.social•81 days ago

Would be a shame if they’re misrepresenting a massive coop as dishoom have some very strong corporate morals built into the company.

emmabentleyvino.bsky.social•81 days ago

It is rather ambiguous, because it started with a family winery in the 60s but I would argue that since 1999, it's grown out of any "family" proportion.

Could make the comparison with Rocca Sveva; they make the best wines of the group but who ultimately is making the big decisions? The co-op.

donalde.bsky.social•81 days ago

Fucking love a sustainable and equitable value chain. In fact it’s one of the things I look for first when tippling.

emmabentleyvino.bsky.social•81 days ago

Alongside a good bottling line 🤣🤣

emmabentleyvino.bsky.social•81 days ago

Hahaha!
To be fair, I like the fact that Bella Storia wines are organic and any movement towards more sustainable wine production is to be welcomed. Also like that Collis bought Villa Favorita (went to auction 3 times) and are restoring it. Co-ops have a place and a raison d'être.

milanowski-tony.bsky.social•80 days ago

Isn't that the reason for Fairtrade wines?

ridesmith.bsky.social•81 days ago

That and gold stickers on the bottle of competitions won that I’ve never heard of or stickers with score numbers on them of publications I have heard of.

patriciaanne.bsky.social•82 days ago

Isn't that because of distributors and brokers only sell wine that has a high price point?
I remember watching Joe fattorini during Covid.

emmabentleyvino.bsky.social•82 days ago

Not really the case in the UK where you have importers bringing in everything from the bulk to the very finest. 🤷🏽‍♀️

patriciaanne.bsky.social•82 days ago

Check out Joe https://youtu.be/30f4UGZAF78?si=i7tQf87lVZJeCaov

emmabentleyvino.bsky.social•82 days ago

What part in particular? I've watched the first 10 mins but don't see any reference to purchasing and pricing in the UK.

patriciaanne.bsky.social•82 days ago

Oh not specific for that ...he has a whole series to watch.
Joe is just AWESOME

seand.me.uk•81 days ago

If you like beer, it's even worse! Restaurants that put a lot of effort into their menus and wine lists and boast about supporting local business, small vineyards etc and then sell Carlsberg are so so common.

emmabentleyvino.bsky.social•81 days ago

That must be dishearteningly depressing.
My Italian husband is so surprised to see Moretti and Peretti so pervasively in the UK. "Why do they buy Italian beers?" he asks.

seand.me.uk•81 days ago

There are some fantastic Italian breweries. We just don't see their beers here very often. ☹️

I guess the answer lies in whoever does marketing for the etti beers!

seand.me.uk•81 days ago

At a recent wine tasting I learned that pinot grigio became very popular in the UK (because of Sir Terry Wogan) and many Italian distributors packaged whatever they had lying around as "Pinot Grigio" because we aren't a very discerning people when it comes to booze.

janetrad.bsky.social•82 days ago

It's an old trick.

iandel.bsky.social•82 days ago

I know restaurants have to make a profit but when it comes to wine they take it to extremes.

pimmisa.bsky.social•82 days ago

£42 for a bottle of a spumante is daylight robbery no matter which restaurant it is sold in.

paytontalks.bsky.social•82 days ago

🤦‍♀️🤦‍♀️🤦‍♀️

davidroundmw.bsky.social•81 days ago

"Family co-op" is also transparent nonsense. Surely, by definition, a co-op isn't family-owned because it's owned by its members?

donalde.bsky.social•81 days ago

From Bancroft’s website (I did a bit of googling)

donalde.bsky.social•81 days ago

Ahh but those members have families…

davidroundmw.bsky.social•81 days ago

If they had just written "families-owned" they would have escaped my pedantry...

donalde.bsky.social•81 days ago

Family managed.
The, I can see how the Chinese whispers between the producer, the wine supplier, the buyer and then the person writing the menu text ended up with such garbled nonsense.

davidroundmw.bsky.social•81 days ago

Yes, that is very carefully worded for maximum ambiguity and deniability.

ridesmith.bsky.social•81 days ago

Shhhh they are Italian

ridesmith.bsky.social•82 days ago

We call this smelling your own farts in the US