It is really important, and my challenge to journalists and academics and so on in general is to do this, to point out how completely and utterly out of kilter the UK's idea of "local" government is with international norms. Local government on these islands is an embarrassing legal fiction. - ThreadSky

ballotbox.scot • 72 days ago

It is really important, and my challenge to journalists and academics and so on in general is to do this, to point out how completely and utterly out of kilter the UK's idea of "local" government is with international norms. Local government on these islands is an embarrassing legal fiction.

Reposted from Jennifer Williams

Excl: Government will move to scrap district councils in its devolution white paper on Monday, sparking the biggest local government reorganisation in 50 years

on.ft.com/3VBH0ui

Comments

ballotbox.scot•72 days ago

These figures are circa 2020 (I haven't updated them since, and there are always reorganisations of varying forms going on in countries), but it shows just how utterly outsized our councils are.

Anyone saying local government in any part of the UK is "too small" is, frankly, a liar or an idiot.

ballotbox.scot•71 days ago

Fun fact now I'm home and skimming social media before bed: there's been so much local government consolidation just in the past few years that the Council of European Municipalities and Regions count of UK municipalities is 333, which is *205,000* on average, vs about 158,000 in that 2020 chart.

ballotbox.scot•72 days ago

If you suggest Frumpington Under-Spribble South West shouldn't have an MP in Parliament, our political class start crying blood about local representation, but then they package the whole town (pop 180,000) into Greater Spribble Valley (pop 820,000) and say that's one local council. Arse backwards.

ballotbox.scot•72 days ago

Also! Stop calling what you're doing to England "Devolution", it's not devolution! I don't think we should be precious about status of nations vs regions HOWEVER it's absurd to use the same term for the legislatures at Holyrood/Cardiff Bay/Stormont as we do for letting Andy Burnham play with buses

ballotbox.scot•72 days ago

"Play with buses is flippant", but let me put it this way: next week, the Scottish Government, Welsh Government and Northern Ireland Executive could all bring forward plans to create Metro Mayors just like Andy Burnham. They could, years later, abolish them. Burnham cannot create or abolish himself.

starbourne.bsky.social•72 days ago

Someone outside my local town have decided the library should be closed. Local people don’t agree with this. I wonder if the local government reorganisation in the 70s introduced more democracy or actually removed it

ballotbox.scot•72 days ago

Well indeed, and that's a key point. I personally look back on the 1973 Act (it predates me by nearly 20 years, but as a nerd!) as well-meaning but going too far. Many burghs and counties were unworkably small, but we went too big. Whithorn and Buteshire going, sure, but why Paisley and Ayrshire?

yunod.sustainabletranslator.scot•70 days ago

https://www.thenational.scot/politics/24788988.labours-offer-scottish-andy-burnhams-not-need/

sjpartridge.bsky.social•72 days ago

But 'Federal' is apparently a dirty word in the UK.

ballotbox.scot•72 days ago

I disagree, it's actually a word nobody thinks or cares about. Fundamentally people in England - and if we're talking a Federal UK, it's the English who need to buy into it - don't *care* about their internal governing arrangements very much, leaving Federalism patter to Scots and fringe weirdos.

sjpartridge.bsky.social•72 days ago

In my experience the idea of a Federal system scares the horses amongst the establishment. Surely that's what Brexit was all about.

pmcghee.bsky.social•72 days ago

Good point about UK not having good Regional/Municipal gov by European standards, but:

Population:

N Ireland 1.9m
Gtr Manchester 2.9m
Wales 3.1m
Scotland 5.4m
London 8.9m

It's not just playing with buses.

ballotbox.scot•72 days ago

Yes, and for the 1.9 million people that Michelle O'Neill and Emma Little-Pengelly are the leaders of, their legislature has complete free reign over healthcare, education, policing, local government, large aspects of transport and taxation. They can draft and progress actual legislation.

ballotbox.scot•72 days ago

"Oooh look I represent a big city" is an infuriating attitude that, for example, led to many people presenting Sadiq Khan as the most senior elected Labour official pre-GE24, when in fact it was (the various) Welsh FMs because they had *substantially* more governing power over many more areas.

antireactionary.bsky.social•71 days ago

That looks like disinformation, since you excluded parish councils. They would be more comparable with the smaller 'municipalities' on the chart.

ballotbox.scot•71 days ago

Excuse me, if you're going to use a word as strong as "disinformation", I would rather advise you can damn well justify it. I have used the definition of the Council of European Municipalities and Regions, which does NOT consider Parish Councils to be equivalent to municipalities. Bore off.

cameronws.bsky.social•72 days ago

Can you expand on "Scotland (UK, reformed)"? I couldn't see anything about that in the article so I'm not sure what it refers to

ballotbox.scot•72 days ago

This chart is from my New Municipalism project, which I don't promote much at the moment because the next version is due for publication in January! (I finished it months ago, just too much has been going on to actually release it) https://newmunicipalism.ballotbox.scot/

cameronws.bsky.social•72 days ago

oooo neat! I was presuming more of an urban subdivision approach (the Leithers clamor for independence from Edinburgh as ever) but this seems like a no-brainer

sanityormadness.bsky.social•72 days ago

Having skimmed through it, one thing confuses me - I get not wanting to include Edinburgh & Glasgow in wider regions, but why have them as unitaries? Surely they should be regions in their own right, with municipalities within them?

ballotbox.scot•72 days ago

I'm curious: "surely" on what basis? Glasgow's population is circa ~630k, Edinburgh's, what, ~490k? Copenhagen, population ~660k doesn't have sub-municipalities. Valencia, population ~800k doesn't have sub-municipalities. Helsinki, population ~650k doesn't have sub-municipalities.

ballotbox.scot•72 days ago

Now there are comparably sized cities that *do* have some sub-municipalisation, whether those are true municipalities or special, less powerful "boroughs", but it's not in fact blindingly obvious Glasgow or Edinburgh need that - Govan and Leith alone do not justify carving up the rest of the city

sanityormadness.bsky.social•72 days ago

To quote your own headline, albeit in a different context, "A Local Division for Local People". If your aim is to have municipalities of average 42k people because existing divisions are too big, why should someone in Glasgow have only a 600k+ unitary as in the existing system you think is broken?

harry-is-human.bsky.social•72 days ago

Especially as the district council size you indicate here has significantly less power and money than its counterparts elsewhere.

I knew of a German municipality of 100k people running a €100 million broadband programme - unthinkable in the UK.

exogenesis2.bsky.social•72 days ago

The problem is muncipalities don't exist in the UK, parish councils are entirely toothless.
Most countries have municpalities/townships etc then a regional level above that.

jenniferbgnk.bsky.social•71 days ago

The only positive thing to say about Scotland in this is that at least it is simple. England is chaos. But we really need to look at what services lg provides and then decide the size of council need to provide it.

blue-eyedsamurai01.bsky.social•71 days ago

Is it anything to do with local councils' inability to keep a meticulous record of their ins & outs appropriately?

peckersley.bsky.social•72 days ago

As a local govt academic, this is also a hill upon which I would die and a message that I repeat ad infinitum. Unfortunately, however, neither politicians nor journalists want to listen

https://bsky.app/profile/peckersley.bsky.social/post/3ld7lhyjds22y

foundationsofthedigitalstate.com•71 days ago

Team Maximum Finland from Scotland reporting for duty

Our proud motto: 800 councils or death!

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