The scientific view of the ‘physical’ (all the way up & down) is what is measurable or describable through best current theory and experiment. What its ontology actually *is* beyond present theory and experiment is unknown (some kind of quantum foam or vacuum energy?). 1st person is also ‘physical’. - ThreadSky

jamesdmac.bsky.social • 90 days ago

The scientific view of the ‘physical’ (all the way up & down) is what is measurable or describable through best current theory and experiment. What its ontology actually *is* beyond present theory and experiment is unknown (some kind of quantum foam or vacuum energy?). 1st person is also ‘physical’.

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jccust.bsky.social•90 days ago

Now it seems you are conflating what is not yet scientifically known (or even researchable) with what today's science has already ruled out. Substance dualism, idealism, or any non-physical approaches are already ruled out from today's scientific view (it's not just 'we don't know yet').

jamesdmac.bsky.social•90 days ago

Whatever the ‘physical’ is according to best current theory and experiment, it is clearly an incomplete and partial 3rd person description. As far as I know the ontology of matter has not been satisfactorily agreed. But whatever its description is, the 1st person is already an expression of it.

jccust.bsky.social•90 days ago

Well, in fact, science has already ruled out non-physical approaches (i.e., not dependent on the consequences of the fundamental physical interactions). You are free to disagree with science, but that's the scientific view today, and this means that contrary views are unscientific/pseudoscience.

jamesdmac.bsky.social•90 days ago

As I have said repeatedly I am not positing the non-physical; I have been discussing 2 distinct approaches to the ‘physical’ (whatever its ontology is): one from the 3rd person (science), and one from the 1st person (awareness, conscious being, or whatever descriptor fits). Both have their place.

jccust.bsky.social•90 days ago

See, you cannot say that you are advocating for an approach that is different from the scientific approach and, at the same time, claim that you are not being unscientific (or engaging in pseudoscience).

jamesdmac.bsky.social•90 days ago

This is silly. Are you saying that any activity which is not a practice of measurement and description is ipso facto ‘pseudoscience’? So just being alive is ‘pseudoscience’? This is why I said up-thread that you seem to be dismissive of the 1st person perspective, or pay it scant attention.

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