Today’s @yougov.co.uk survey into why the public back assisted dying (or don’t) is a stark insight into how prejudice against disabled people lurks. The belief that needing care is inherently undignified and that ill people are a costly burden on the state are not red flags to ignore. - ThreadSky

francesryan.bsky.social • 168 days ago

Today’s @yougov.co.uk survey into why the public back assisted dying (or don’t) is a stark insight into how prejudice against disabled people lurks.

The belief that needing care is inherently undignified and that ill people are a costly burden on the state are not red flags to ignore.

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Comments

fionasaveournhs.bsky.social•168 days ago

People have no idea that getting personal care actually affords you to dignity. It would be far worse to be left without it.
Also, we know it will get watered down over & over again. Can you imagine if this lot of Tories or Reform got in, they'd have us all killed off.

marshacoupe.bsky.social•157 days ago

Disabled Californian weighing in. We've had assisted dying available for over eight years. It is not being used to kill off disabled people. Not here, not anywhere 'end of life options' are available. It's a welcome option for those wanting to end suffering near the end of life - and rarely taken.

quakererica.bsky.social•167 days ago

I was in my 30s when so-called friends started saying they’d “understand” if I killed myself. Still get told how awful it must be to live with chronic pain and be a wheelchair user in spite of being 69 and leading a full, active, happy life, enjoying grandchildren. Disabled lives don’t matter.

babs05.bsky.social•168 days ago

Good little capitalists. The value money over life.

winter02.bsky.social•168 days ago

This is about terminally ill people with 6 months to live. Nothing to do with capitalism.

babs05.bsky.social•168 days ago

Who told you that?

winter02.bsky.social•168 days ago

Reading the bill in detail.

https://commonslibrary.parliament.uk/research-briefings/cbp-10123/

babs05.bsky.social•168 days ago

I know what's in it, thanks. It's not what it says. It's what it doesn't say. And the topic is the public's attitude. Too many value money over life.

winter02.bsky.social•168 days ago

How on earth do you make a leap to money over the quality life for someone with the tragic situation of 6 months to live? Currently only the wealthy have Dignitas in Switzerland available so this is social justice.

buzzocular.bsky.social•168 days ago

Lots of naivety in some about what the last stages of death can look like - even with the best palliative care.

loufioravanti.bsky.social•168 days ago

Chilling!

maxgam.bsky.social•168 days ago

Or after 14 years of Tory power people can see how others can suffer with little compassion

gillianography.bsky.social•168 days ago

It's terrifying isn't it, I'm not sure what safeguards they can put in place to stop exploitation of this legislation.

winter02.bsky.social•168 days ago

The safeguards are 2 doctors and a judge for cases of terminal illness with 6 months left.

chr-m.bsky.social•167 days ago

Not good enough, also I know of people who’ve been given 3 month outcomes but have gone on to live for years (and not in constant pain)

winter02.bsky.social•167 days ago

There will always be exceptions but that shouldn’t condemn those in a tragic situation.

chr-m.bsky.social•167 days ago

It’s pretty tragic that care for the sick is so underfunded
Nobody is condemning anyone.

winter02.bsky.social•167 days ago

Even the best palliative care cannot prevent very distressing and painful deaths.

garyinscotland.bsky.social•168 days ago

The doctor's meeting with the patient must be a week apart and the patient can withdraw at any point in the process

garyinscotland.bsky.social•168 days ago

I wonder how many folk have actually looked at the bills. Not many I fear from the comments

winter02.bsky.social•168 days ago

Or they are dressing up religious views to hide them.

garyinscotland.bsky.social•168 days ago

I'm trying to discuss in good faith. But I blocked some twat yesterday who bizarrely went from arguing against the bill, to insulting me over my age! Most odd, jumping from pro-life to aegism in a single post.

winter02.bsky.social•168 days ago

Unfortunately the anti lobby have a lot of money

https://amp.theguardian.com/society/2024/nov/24/tory-mp-danny-kruger-investigated-by-standards-watchdog-over-assisted-dying-funds

ninjafingers.bsky.social•168 days ago

I support assisted dying...but only in terminal cases that involve a lot of suffering. Key word being terminal. 6 months to a year and there's no chance of doing anything more for them.

It must not be used as a way to get rid of "burdens."

sanguinepar.bsky.social•168 days ago

Whoever put in the line about "save the NHS money" really needs to rethink their suitability for this sort of thing.

If they mean it like that, then it's appallingly callous.

And even if they don't, then they are still demonstrating a real lack of basic common sense in expressing themself well.

2nd-act-rn.bsky.social•167 days ago

daftgingy.bsky.social•168 days ago

Is it any real suprise when it's exactly the narrative the media and the government have been promoting.

garyinscotland.bsky.social•168 days ago

But it isn't Samantha, both bills, the Scottish and Westminster bills reference explicitly those with terminal conditions only. It is nothing like the narrative you suggest.

chr-m.bsky.social•167 days ago

But it may change further down the road. We need assurances that the sick, Frail, elderly and disabled will be looked after well ( better than currently) and with dignity. And not be faced with suggestions that they are a burden or would be better off ending it all.

garyinscotland.bsky.social•167 days ago

Then you'd need to introduce a new entirely separate bill. Because none of that is part of this one. We don't look after the sick, disabled, frail and elderly now so I am puzzled why you appear to think their lot will get worse as a result of a bill dealing explicitly with terminal ill people.

chr-m.bsky.social•167 days ago

Because I’ve watched how this has progressed in other countries and because we don’t want to look after the frail and the sick it is a fear that safeguards will not always be in place and that before too long it will become the ‘responsible thing’ to end your life early.

garyinscotland.bsky.social•167 days ago

Then you'd need to introduce a new bill for that, because this one only deals with people with terminal illnesses.

daftgingy.bsky.social•166 days ago

The solution is proper investment in Palliative Care, its a sneaky way of avoiding that investment. Good Palliative care acheives the same goals without placing anyone at risk or under pressure.

daftgingy.bsky.social•166 days ago

Not what i was getting at in this instance. But the fact the bill does not include anyone else that is not terminally ill means it's descrimatory if it becomes law. Why it's being pushed so hard to just get it passed as they know this. Its what happened in Canada

daftgingy.bsky.social•166 days ago

This means if it is passed it will end up not being merely terminally ill people with 6 months due to our Equality Act 2010.

francesryan.bsky.social•168 days ago

There’s legitimate reasons to support assisted dying e.g. suffering. But many people are basing this on, frankly, pretty fucked up ideas about disability and if we don’t challenge that as a society - and indeed, actually legislate off it - I’m not sure that ends well. At least for some.

nesstheenby.bsky.social•168 days ago

I would love to support an Assisted Dying bill, but I can't in good conscience do that until the social support for people is properly funded. Otherwise consent is always going to be manufactured

buzzocular.bsky.social•168 days ago

It's a very narrow bill that isn't applicable to those that simply need social support - which is underfunded

nesstheenby.bsky.social•168 days ago

This particular bill, yes, but I don't trust the UK not to extend the scope of their assisted dying program to include people they see as a burden, especially not with the way this government are treating disabled people/people on benefits

mick-mcdermott.bsky.social•168 days ago

It doesn’t need an assisted dying bill for some future government to do such a thing.

The DWP already routinely ask people with mental health issues why they haven’t killed themselves - those who ask for help to end their lives should be given it.

nesstheenby.bsky.social•168 days ago

It does legally. Suicide is legal yes, and I'm not denying that the DWP process is dehumanizing and raises the risk of suicide, but helping someone die by suicide is still a crime

buzzocular.bsky.social•168 days ago

I think that's a really important thing to bear in mind, ofcourse. But really important to point out that in the British system this would require a majority in parliament.

nesstheenby.bsky.social•168 days ago

It's a lot easier to pass a modification or an extension to an original bill than an entire new bill itself

fionasaveournhs.bsky.social•168 days ago

The problem is there are people already saying the safeguards are too strict. When you look at other countries who brought this in, most have watered it down. We can not guarantee it won't be watered down here, too.

buzzocular.bsky.social•168 days ago

Sure. But we have to be honest about how the bill could change - it could change only if a parliamentary majority in both chambers makes it so.

Not via judges as has happened in Canada.

srward.com•167 days ago

Thank you, Frances. 🙏🏻

robredotruthe.bsky.social•167 days ago

kinda struggle to accept your position here...

like i can understand people saying 'look morally i don't think people should be allowed to determine when they die.' i dnt agree personally, but people obviously have the right to apply a religious belief (for eg.) to societal governance.

robredotruthe.bsky.social•167 days ago

the issue with your position (as laid out here- i'm not aware. of ur stance beyond this) seems untenable.

once you accept that people have the right to decide when they die (and be supported in that), i can't really understand how we can then say 'but that right doesnt apply when it: (....)

robredotruthe.bsky.social•167 days ago

- tries to their family- or society- money
-is based upon a percieved lower quality of life because they are reliant on others for care

...like if it's a right; surely it applies to everyone-irrespective of their reasoning?

gwenglens.bsky.social•168 days ago

This gives evidence to support my gut instinct opposition to assisted dying. As a disabled person who runs training sessions for fellow counsellors on how ableism & internalised oppression can show up in the therapy room, it’s clear how deep the prejudice remains even in so-called self aware people.

fillian.bsky.social•168 days ago

No one makes it through a long life without losing the ability to care for themselves. We should extend mercy, compassion and the right to life to ALL. Disabled is NOT disposable. Our elders are our living connection to history and should be respected and revered. We have a RIGHT to live. All of us.

warren-watched.bsky.social•166 days ago

The ultimate purpose of an assisted dying bill or even end effect is to eliminate those who would be an ongoing drain on financial resources. It’s much cheaper for someone to die than to spend years caring for their needs.

That was even a selling point in Canada.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/manitoba/medically-assisted-death-could-save-millions-1.3947481

blondcataddict.bsky.social•168 days ago

My mother (bless her) told me the other day that life without going out regularly & being able to drive ‘wasn’t worth living’. I have left the house 5 times this year & haven’t driven since Covid.

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