This week on the blog! Part 2 of our look at the famous opening sequence of Gladiator (2000) this time looking at formations, signals and infantry tactics. Once again, Gladiator does a deceptive job of pretending accuracy, while not achieving it. acoup.blog/2025/06/13/c... - ThreadSky

bretdevereaux.bsky.social • 7 days ago

This week on the blog! Part 2 of our look at the famous opening sequence of Gladiator (2000) this time looking at formations, signals and infantry tactics.

Once again, Gladiator does a deceptive job of pretending accuracy, while not achieving it.

https://acoup.blog/2025/06/13/collections-nitpicking-gladiators-iconic-opening-battle-part-ii/

Comments

sashotodorov.bsky.social•6 days ago

Something that hit me when reading this re: Legionaries forming families where they were. Was there any sort of leave in the legion? Pulling a kid away pretty much permanently for 25 years feels like a hit to Roman familial norms.

brianchang.bsky.social•6 days ago

They mostly stayed at the same forts on the frontier and their families would live around those forts. Eventually those communities around the forts turned into special military communities where the legions got most of their recruits

sashotodorov.bsky.social•6 days ago

But at the start of the Imperial army you're still talking about recruits from within the "core" provinces around the Mediterranean. You're talking functional emancipation of sons from out of their father's authority when they are in their late teens, very early 20s.

marbleliberal.bsky.social•5 days ago

This kind of thing is also a draw for the army in the 17c. For instance, most people in central European cities weren't allowed to marry, so being a soldier was a way for someone who didn't qualify for marriage to have a lifetime female partner and children

sashotodorov.bsky.social•5 days ago

ISH - in Germany it was fairly common for people to be in "common law marriages" until finally being able to purchase land. The big draw was less legal emancipation and much more the steady wages, plus, in the case of Prussia, state provided land for service.

marbleliberal.bsky.social•5 days ago

I was thinking about city dwellers, so instead of no land --> land I was thinking about journeyman --> master, but you're right

sashotodorov.bsky.social•5 days ago

IMO a somewhat more comparable situation was how the French structured their pay schedules for their West African colonial troops. They built them around a fairly low salary, with a large lump sum at the end of the service period built around a rough approximation of average dowry prices.

beijingpalmer.bsky.social•5 days ago

I mean that's a great unspoken incentive for recruitment to the legions for a lot of people, I assume

beijingpalmer.bsky.social•5 days ago

also I have no idea how far down the social scale the paterfamilias system actually extended in practice but I suspect it broke down once you got past the middle a lot of the time

sashotodorov.bsky.social•5 days ago

My assumption would actually have been the inverse - in a country as land poor as Italy is by the middle to later Republic a father in a poorer, but still landholding, rural family has a lot more control over his sons' economic future than a wealthy patrician.

tequila0341.bsky.social•6 days ago

*Commeatus* was pretty common in the legions and ancient writers were constantly urging that it be restricted. Bribery of centurions for leave was endemic; Hadrian would restrict the ability of officers below a certain rank from granting leave and also ban granting leave to more than 30+ at a time

uscivilwar.bsky.social•6 days ago

I know intellectually it was exploitive, but there are days I kinda miss the late 50's / early 60-'s Hollywood where they did these massive, insane productions with hundreds, sometimes thousands, of costumed actors and performers.

Today they'd go CGI, and it would be mid instead of awesome.

birblib.bsky.social•6 days ago

I feel like a historically accurate depiction of a Roman army would work really well if they were the villains (or at least temporary antagonists).

Our plucky heroes from Germania or an indomitable Gaulish village or wherever assemble every combatant in their society to square off with the Romans.

birblib.bsky.social•6 days ago

We see the Romans come into view, but their dispositions are initially masked by ranks of velites coming forwards to throw javelins. Our heroes have their own light infantry and we see some exciting loose-order combat, complete with lots of javelin-dodging. Our heroes are doing OK!

birblib.bsky.social•6 days ago

The velites, having done their job, retreat into the first line of Roman heavy infantry, who are by now quite close. That's fine, our heroes have their own infantry (some of it heavy) formed up, and the surviving light infantry reposition to support them as the Romans close in.

birblib.bsky.social•6 days ago

There is a short, sharp exchange of projectiles before contact. Our heroes send javelins and arrows into the Romans, but the incoming Roman pila hit much harder and we see some casualties on our side. The Protagonist steps into the front rank to replace a guy who can't get a pilum out of his shield.

birblib.bsky.social•6 days ago

Contact. The romans are within spear range, but it's hard to hit them because of their big shields. A character next to the Protagonist gets his spear stuck in a Roman shield, and the Roman in front of the Protagonist rushes him before he can free it. The protagonist has a shot on his flank...

birblib.bsky.social•6 days ago

But it takes Protagonist two blows with spear and three or four with sword to bring the Roman down. Elsewhere, we see lots of Romans getting wounded and [whoever Our Heroes are] getting killed. Our Heroes give a little ground and draw tighter into their ranks. It's close, but the Romans falter.

isaiahbishop.bsky.social•6 days ago

Barbarians show i think demonstrated how well this could work even if execution was bad

birblib.bsky.social•6 days ago

Yeah, that show was almost good. I actually felt it was more insulting to the Germanic tribes than to the Romans in some ways, since the attention to detail when depicting the Romans made the utter lack of it when depicting the "good guys" much more obvious.

isaiahbishop.bsky.social•6 days ago

very frustrating! Also the fire on the ambush was very annoying, where simply good cinematography could show you that being ambushed in the rain while strung out is already completely terrifying and awful

preachypreach.bsky.social•6 days ago

the opening scene to Rome was pretty bad in the technical specifics (pea whistle, only the budget for 20 extras etc) but for capturing the tamed discipline and carefully released violence of the Roman army it was pretty good at the vibes in the short scene

preachypreach.bsky.social•6 days ago

(On using the horror of the Romans as a framing device, even Josephus, supposedly a favourable source to them, casually describes them crucifying civilians trying to escape upside down in front of Jerusalem’s walls and auxiliaries slitting open people to find any gold coins they’d swallowed)

isaiahbishop.bsky.social•6 days ago

Yeah i think something like that works good as horror, because if you aren't fighting regularly in the field theres literally nothing more horrifying than organized formations.

isaiahbishop.bsky.social•6 days ago

Idk something capturing the desperation of a bunch of dudes trying to figure out what to do against this big machine, and everyone realizing its going against them right from the first projectile volleys

preachypreach.bsky.social•6 days ago

… you could do a pretty neat Cowboys and Indians reversal- have your lead characters be the local militia for a town on the Parthia/Roman border (Palmyra say) and have the day be saved at the last minute by the standing horse archer army showing up

isaiahbishop.bsky.social•6 days ago

Definitely think more should be written on romans as relentless and organized terror thats just going through the woods and wiping settlements out. And then each part of their tactics and equipment is part of that image

birblib.bsky.social•6 days ago

Another scene I would love to see in a story about the Romans would have a VIP who has heard about the Roman way of war but never seen it be observing a battle for some plot reason. This guy is a stand in for the modern viewer and he peppers his roman minder with questions about...

birblib.bsky.social•6 days ago

... all the elaborate formations and tactics and engineering works and things he's heard that Romans used. His Roman liaison officer (minder/babysitter), whose jaw is quite pronounced and whose eyes are slightly too close together is like "we're actually gonna walk up and beat the shit out of them"

isaiahbishop.bsky.social•6 days ago

You outflank them by hitting them through the centre first, easy

stephenjudkins.bsky.social•7 days ago

*sigh* yeah you're probably right. But, counterpoint: the scene was incredibly cool

minionofmidas.bsky.social•6 days ago

A matter of priorities

christosilvia.bsky.social•5 days ago

Ridley Scott should have directed 300 not Gladiator! The Persians really were a fires-based ancient military. Maybe a Darius biopic?

ikemakos.bsky.social•6 days ago

you apologize for using it repeatedly in the post, but actually now I would like all historical inaccuracies in films quantified in terms of “this is like having M1 Abrams main battle tanks show up at [insert historical event]”

gnarlygale.bsky.social•5 days ago

they should have just made a movie about the gallic wars instead of that ridiculous gladiator nonsense

lorehouse.bsky.social•6 days ago

📌

wil9876.bsky.social•6 days ago

📌

gcampax.com•6 days ago

Great read as always!

In light of yesterday's DC events, I wonder if there's a reason why the Roman army is never seen in its full battlefield size and organization: in the modern mind, large coordinated infantry units are associated with the DPRK or the SW Empire, not the "good guys"

belayer.bsky.social•6 days ago

If we as a society ever do another big-budget ancient roman movie, I always thought the tragedy of Quintus Sertorius’s role in the Serotorian War would be a damn good one. At least, his life always read as tragic and poignant to me.

billy-in-philly.bsky.social•7 days ago

I remember when this came out, and I tried to find some background on the topography. I was amazed that this whole section was clear-cut in the UK for a building project. Thought it was a serendipitous use of the land.

triplezero.bsky.social•7 days ago

ONE MINUTE THE LEGIONARIES HAVE SHIELDS, AND THEN THEY DON'T. WHERE DO THE SHIELDS GO?

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