I want to just … present you with a couple searches. As cybersecurity people who are aware the junior jobs market is in dire condition. That even mid tier professionals are unemployed. With degrees. www.google.com/search?q=cyb... - ThreadSky

hacks4pancakes.com • 8 days ago

I want to just … present you with a couple searches. As cybersecurity people who are aware the junior jobs market is in dire condition. That even mid tier professionals are unemployed. With degrees. https://www.google.com/search?q=cyber+skills+shortage+site:.edu&sca_esv=1d586943b81c7f12&prmd=niv&source=lnt&tbs=qdr:y&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiOof6khpiMAxVTlIkEHc40ClwQpwV6BAgDEAw&biw=393&bih=665&dpr=3

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forengirl23.bsky.social•7 days ago

The issue I see is when you run an institution of higher education like a business. When this happens you are chasing the next shiny object. Then, the value of the education falls. The only thing that matters is number of students. Big business numbers game. /1

forengirl23.bsky.social•7 days ago

In the 90’s early 2000s the big number game was the MBA game. Then the Cybersecurity game, now that is fizzling so, oh look a new shiny object “AI.” You also have to ask why GPA scores have increased when more secondary education students cannot even read or write./2

forengirl23.bsky.social•7 days ago

In secondary education the infection of greed began about twenty years ago. The schools are full of administrators with few “teachers.” Then this infection invaded higher education. More specialized administrators, few if any full time professors./3

forengirl23.bsky.social•7 days ago

Now, most universities are majority of adjunct professors. Less pay, no benefits. Worse, no obligation to institution. Because the institution does not value them!! More adjuncts are teaching at three to four different schools just to stay above poverty level./4

forengirl23.bsky.social•7 days ago

Just like in business, the cost of product goes up, but the quality drops. If your goal in life is “big money,” get out of education because you are killing the institution. The driving goal must be the importance of the deep knowledge the student receives. I will die on this hill!

seemsgood.lol•8 days ago

I can’t help but notice that the entire first page of results are people with something to sell me.

eightxeroxedbutts.bsky.social•8 days ago

I'd guess most are training companies

maxsec.bsky.social•8 days ago

Same in the UK.
They all want unicorns.

death-glare.bsky.social•7 days ago

It's easy to feel trapped too in this state.

shadedowl.bsky.social•8 days ago

It certainly seems to be a consistent theme for the industry across many job markets. Australian higher education does the same thing, whilst also having the tendency to renumerate the roles below average (where they even bother to employ CSec professionals at all

hacks4pancakes.com•8 days ago

I think you could run the search from Google Australia and hit similar off results.

packetlevel2.bsky.social•7 days ago

Of this 18wks with the Wireshark class, we will have 4-5 assignments using AI to make sure all are at least minimally trained.

shumeister.bsky.social•8 days ago

Is the market saturated? The tech had boom and bust, and recently the practice of over hiring, then dumping/ mass firing in big companies.

morelikeanonja.bsky.social•8 days ago

It paints the whole field as a bait and switch cash grab. Which… can’t be great

staceychampagne.bsky.social•7 days ago

This is why I’m evolving Hacker in Heels’ focus to experienced practitioners.

The problem is that if you start speaking the truth, people brand you as being “mean” or a “gatekeeper.”

staceychampagne.bsky.social•7 days ago

This isn’t about the worthiness of the next gen.

It’s about how effed-up we are as an industry. We can’t take them in until we get honest and fix ourselves.

zoe-j.bsky.social•8 days ago

This in conjunction with a rise of cybersecurity “influencers” reminds me a lot of the ZIRP/“coding bootcamp” boom.

I’ve seen a number of social media accounts claim “get sec+ and get 100k+/get a set job for life” type of claims taking advantage of those who want a job/stability.
It’s frustrating.

bennettelder.net•8 days ago

The coding bootcamps teaching jquery in 2022 for thousands of dollars per week really got under my skin at one point and I figured out they're from the same predatory company.

https://duckduckgo.com/?q=site%3A.edu+%22trilogy+education+services%22+weeks+program&t=ha&va=j&ia=web

clawclawbite.bsky.social•8 days ago

Same, but 2018. I won't name names, they gave false hope to individuals without degrees who paid thousands of dollars in hopes to learn and escape their lower paying professions.

About 1/4 would get hired, 1/2 retained after a year.

The people teaching were pompous and acted as saviours.

bennettelder.net•8 days ago

Looks like they closed them and the search results are gone but a ton of universities were cheapening their name by attaching it to a cookie cutter bootcamp, charging tuition prices for credit-less classes, and aggressively marketing to vulnerable groups.

eightxeroxedbutts.bsky.social•8 days ago

Parent Co.: https://www.highereddive.com/news/judge-signs-off-on-2u-bankruptcy-plan/726776/

hacks4pancakes.com•8 days ago

Especially this one. This one is especially heinous. Do take notes. https://www.google.com/search?sca_esv=1d586943b81c7f12&tbs=qdr:y&q=cyber+skills+%22shortage%22+veterans+%C2%A0site:.edu&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjCtLrthpiMAxV7k4kEHZ_tOnQQ5t4CegQIGBAB&biw=447&bih=744&dpr=3

hacks4pancakes.com•8 days ago

I would take a moment to appreciate what types of institutions are targeting which vulnerable groups with this wildly inaccurate messaging about junior jobs.

d1ngbat.bsky.social•8 days ago

Training institutes with articles like “Is it worth pursuing?” and making mention of 4.8 Million open positions globally as a good thing is a wild grift.

hacks4pancakes.com•8 days ago

I really feel like it’s time for our pals at @404media.co to seriously cover this because I’m about to lose it.

hacks4pancakes.com•8 days ago

Friends, does this wildly optimistic sales pitch on cybersecurity junior markets reflect your current hiring reality? Share your opinions here!

seemsgood.lol•8 days ago

My current job search, with 7 years in security and 14 in tech, I'm finding that I'm unqualified for junior roles, when I can find them at all. The farthest I've gotten with any employer is "we'll pass your resume to the manager." (That org has since suspended all hiring)

petrsp.bsky.social•8 days ago

Locally (central Europe), the junior market has corrected from hype to "normal" - jobs exist and there is surplus of candidates but not at crazy ratios. Top senior experts market is mostly frozen - everyone is comfortable where they are and if you want to get them, you must pay premium.

petrsp.bsky.social•8 days ago

Mid-senior market (say 2-5 years of security experience) is by far the highest in demand. The only challenge here is, they sometimes misread the top market and ask for the same premium - making them lose opportunities on price.

wildpark.bsky.social•8 days ago

I think the hype is dragging reality by about 7 years. 10+ years ago companies were spending silly money on security because most didn’t know what they needed. They responded to FUD by over hiring, same as FAANG did for devs over COVID. Cyber budgets were protected while others were cut. 1/2

wildpark.bsky.social•8 days ago

Now firms are more mature. They’re cutting hiring everywhere and cyber budgets and headcount are going along with everyone else because the sky hasn’t fallen. Few companies have gone under post breach. And the more expensive folks are being pushed. That puts a downward pressure on the market 2/3

thesle3p.bsky.social•8 days ago

Not just for juniors, the security bubble has burst.

sagastar.bsky.social•8 days ago

couldn't say about cybersecurity but the junior SWE market is dead as hell and the mid/senior side is hurting.

sharkticon.bsky.social•8 days ago

My long, long, running theory is that this has less with wanting to sell something, than it is significantly cheaper to say you are hiring than actually hire someone, and it gets the same compliance check mark.

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