It’s possible to hold the following two ideas simultaneously without erupting into a fireball : “the guy who killed the CEO was a murderer” and “health insurance companies make many folks’ lives miserable and deserve to be punished”
It's also possible to hold both of those ideas, as well as a third idea: "Some murderers are good people, performing a positive social service, and shouldn't be punished."
I agree with you in the sense that no one deserves to be murdered but this has touched such a nerve with people and the horror stories of denied coverage have pushed people over the edge. It is a sad commentary on US healthcare.
but was the victim complicit in the deaths of some customers? for sure the shooter is a murderer, we have evidence of the act. the firm for whom the victim was ceo also has some evidence ...... as do other firms and perhaps various govt depts/levels as well
we are not - and i hope we don't see copycats - tbh, the level of excellence that the murderer has shown, to evade capture, won't be possessed by any copycat - however, the same population that elected trump cud easily have a jury that lets the suspected murderer go free
i also think the health insurers in the usa are weighing the cost of increased security for executives (how many, what quality, for how long?) vs cost of allowing more claims and marketing their improved ratio - private sector healthcare shd not have insurance at all and be only for the super-rich
Exactly my fear. Celebration of this "hero" is a signal to crazies on the Right that it's okay to knock off people they think are guilty of legislative murder. Countdown until someone takes a crack at Fauci, for example.
Murderer? Yes. Also, an individual who was pushed too far by a health-services model that is blind to the healthcare needs of its citizenry. I don’t condone his behaviour, but I do understand why he killed the CEO of an unethical health insurance company.
Anyone who kills another human is a murderer whether it is legal to do so or not. There are plenty examples where it is legal to murder: soldiers, police, executioners, doctors (assisted suicide). Society decides whether the murder is legal. Society also decides who is a hero.
Yea, vote.
The Americans government is the one who made these insurance companies necessary and keeps them profitting with their business plan.
And yet, no one is popping off politicians. See the shorted sighted vigilantism ?
And he still won. Dems have done a crappy job and thrust a crappy candidate into an election and paraded billionaires on stages to attract voters.
Biden could have stacked the Supreme Court - Obama too.
Look inward and see the Dems are a huge reason Cheeto is president.
I don't know, I think we're just recognizing that most Americans have more in common with the shooter than the CEO, and therefore more empathy towards him.
I can empathize with someone and still acknowledge they did something wrong
Which of the parties was running on the promise to scrap private health insurance or overhaul the industry?
I don't see how voting would change things if none of the politicians running were willing to take on the health insurance industry. This wasn't an election issue for any American politician
Dems have been in control 12 of the last
16 years, they could have done it before, but didn't. And why wait for an election to do it ? It was a ploy for votes. The deficit is too high to redo healthcare well.
Maybe that's your take home message. My take home message is that failure to condemn murder masquerading as justice results in vigilantism becoming the norm.... especially for ideologies that you and I do NOT support. The French Revolution was not an enlightened time, despite what social media says.
Given the events so far, I don’t think you can take that message home. I get that it’s a concern about what *could* develop. But I don’t think anything like the French Revolution is even remotely likely.
If an engineer designs a faulty bridge and it fails causing death; the engineer is held criminally responsible. Why is it not the same for persons making policies causing death?
True, it is. Vigilantism is wrong, and to have a civilized society, we must condemn that action. Do you think the CEO would've been assinated if the laws were such they'd been held responsible for the deadly polices they enacted?
Who knows. But I suspect the man who killed him would have found someone else to pay for other perceived/real injustices in his life. I am 100% concerned that someone is going to try to kill Fauci because they perceive him to be responsible for something he's not responsible for. This is insanity.
A valid concern for sure. Sadly, I believe this is only the beginning. The heat is being turned up downstairs... it's only a matter of time before that pressure cooker explodes.
The assassin as murderer: this is objective truth, a fact of law. The assassin as hero: this is personal opinion, a judgement call.
It's an interesting observation of cultural morals and values.
The CEO who killed millions of Americans by mandating Delay, Deny, DEPOSE on insurance claims was a MASS-MURDERER.
CEO's can kill people legally.
That's the disparity thing.
Agree. The masses do not understand that killing a CEO does not change the industry. Legislation and governance are the answers. It's a sad place where retribution, at any cost is acceptable, even while not solving the issue. An eye for an eye mentality.
God, those ignorant masses, how can they not see that the politicians taking massive donations from the health insurance companies that are denying their coverage for cancer treatments actually have the masses best interests at heart, and are protecting them from the evils of being too healthy?
100% correct. Putting aside the moral travesty of taking a life, the assumption that somehow this act helps anyone is infantile. It's much cheaper --by many orders of magnitude-- for CEOs to buy private armies to protect them than it is for them to stop their harmful but profitable practices.
We have the most expensive and least effective healthcare system; preventing violence requires upholding the social contact by not crushing the populace with monopolies that bleed is dry and leave us to rot.
There is no gray area here. So many keyboard warriors want to sound tough on this issue. Murderous vigilantism is not heroic, nor will it result in any positive change.
I, for one, am not arguing the case for vigilante justice. I'm saying I FEEL the intense anger of injustice on the receiving end of 42+ years of being screwed over by insurance companies. Why? Because I have Type¹ Diabetes & a host of its sidekicks. We're chronically in debt bc of medical expenses.
To be clear, I too do not condone violence or vigilantiism. However, unless you are blind, this did result in Anaheim walking back time limits on their surgery coverages. Also, massive increases in approved claims all around since.
Just saying.
Sad it came to that.
Another way to look at it is, again sadly, it took this level of frustration to a waking up of the insurance providers to understand (if they really do) the cold, heartless damage they have been inflicting on those that need help the most. They sure are not going to be legislated by trump & cronies.
The USA on average sees 20 people per day who are victims of homicides where gun is weapon. Four days have passed since he was killed. Which news organisations are writing stories about the other 79 ?
I'm guessing that you haven't gad the misfortune of having to deal with health insurance issues. People can talk about laws and legislation, but when nothing is ever done about health care besides using it as a political football, people die. No sympathy for the greedy
Well, no one is jailing them for killing people. Killing people in a suit with a pen still results in a death. A mourning family. Let them live by the same rules. I bet he felt just as helpless as a family denied. I have walked into a forest with a rope. I know what their policies are designed to do
Comments
This also does not cause fireball eruption.
When the system is rigged in favour of corporations over people, eventually people are going to fight back
The Americans government is the one who made these insurance companies necessary and keeps them profitting with their business plan.
And yet, no one is popping off politicians. See the shorted sighted vigilantism ?
And if you think Trump is facist, you might as well move. It's a privileged comment.
Biden could have stacked the Supreme Court - Obama too.
Look inward and see the Dems are a huge reason Cheeto is president.
I can empathize with someone and still acknowledge they did something wrong
I don't see how voting would change things if none of the politicians running were willing to take on the health insurance industry. This wasn't an election issue for any American politician
16 years, they could have done it before, but didn't. And why wait for an election to do it ? It was a ploy for votes. The deficit is too high to redo healthcare well.
It's an interesting observation of cultural morals and values.
Granted, we don't know the killer's motives, hence my question.
CEO's can kill people legally.
That's the disparity thing.
Also, SUPPORTING MURDERERS IS SO FREAKING WRONG.
Society is starting to crumble.
Thx for staying your opinion.
Just saying.
Sad it came to that.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_folk_heroes
It depends how history decides to frame it in the coming decades.