it's always funny when gamers / general game devs get into visual novel dev and 1) shoehorn game play into VNs because it "needs" it 2) assume VN players hate reading?? it's so painfully obvious they don't understand the essence of visual novels when they think we hate reading & *need* gameplay - ThreadSky

arimiadev.com • 109 days ago

it's always funny when gamers / general game devs get into visual novel dev and
1) shoehorn game play into VNs because it "needs" it
2) assume VN players hate reading??

it's so painfully obvious they don't understand the essence of visual novels when they think we hate reading & *need* gameplay

Comments

adudeski.bsky.social•109 days ago

Its literally a virtual picture book, like come on guys

monsoonmike.bsky.social•108 days ago

Visual Novels aren't really my cup of tea, but I get what you're saying here. It's like "What if we made a fighting game, but without all that punching and kicking?"

soilent.bsky.social•109 days ago

YEAH
Umineko is really popular in vn space and it literally just reading lol

mikanbox.neocities.org•109 days ago

well, with EP8 that's not *entirely* accurate, though tbf the gameplay in that is basically just answering wordplay and logic puzzles

soilent.bsky.social•109 days ago

I mean yeah.... but like
For 99% of it it's very much kinetic

mikanbox.neocities.org•109 days ago

yeah for sure! mostly just brought it up because I actually enjoyed that part a lot

decoster.bsky.social•109 days ago

It reminds me of when someone develops an RPG and assumes they *need* Paper Mario style mini games or to have all grinding removed.

seanathanseastar.bsky.social•109 days ago

You know what, I'm actually fine with that, I hate grinding in JRPGs and I love Paper Mario.
The only thing is it has to be done well and with intent.
You shouldn't just shove interactive elements in your turn-based game because you think JRPG combat is boring.

seanathanseastar.bsky.social•109 days ago

Don't get me wrong, I don't hate JRPGs, some of my favorite games are JRPGs, I just don't like excessive grinding.

madicienne.bsky.social•109 days ago

This also feels like they are maybe just BAD at writing, and trying to distract with something else. Like don't know how to make an engaging story/characters, meaningful choices, etc, so just insert mechanics 🤷

It's like ONLY rolling dice in D&D

cenobiteyami.bsky.social•109 days ago

I love a good VN! My most favorite recently has been AI Somnium Files Nirvana Initiative. I can't remember if there was any gameplay though. But I loved the story.

aspiring-nobody.bsky.social•109 days ago

Agreed

arimiadev.com•109 days ago

obviously not every general game dev that shifts to VNs does this, but you can tell warning signs such as:
"we're giving players a break from reading"
"gameplay lets the player interact instead of reading"
"we don't want to bog the player down with lots of words"

hint: VN players WANT TO READ!

badendingsfound.bsky.social•109 days ago

I always want to scream when they do this. They fundamentally don’t understand the genre.

And if you’re including mini games, make them optional. Nothing I hate more than trying to work out an arbitrary puzzle to get more of the story.

adirosa.com•109 days ago

please let me skip the 'gameplay'.... i loved jack jeanne but it's hard to get all the dialogue options between the stat raising and forced song plays... i liked it all one time only...

arimiadev.com•109 days ago

minigames and hybrid gameplay can really work well with some visual novels, but just like any other kind of game you have to tailor the gameplay to the narrative. gameplay isn't a stand-in for forced interactivity. it should accentuate and help elevate the story.

ruruss.bsky.social•109 days ago

so many of us are okay with not even having choices... tbh i don't care about gameplay that much but i know a few people who would not play the game if it has more gameplay than just clicking sometimes. some of my friends can't stand ace attorney and danganronpa's style because they want to read

mariarose.bsky.social•109 days ago

One example I'd bring up is Danganronpa.
The gameplay segments in that not only serve the narrative, but the *style* of gameplay (Ace Attorney courtroom discussions by way of a first person shooter) fits not only the game's style, but also the pace and narrative from the VN segments.

mariarose.bsky.social•109 days ago

All of the other mini-games also require a certain amount of deductive reasoning/reading comprehension.
Say what you will about DGR as a series, but I still hold it up as one of the best examples of incorporating "gameplay" into a visual novel.

opheliamazing.bsky.social•109 days ago

And another piece of that is Ace Attorney itself. You actually need to think logically about your case and win a not guilty verdict.

justajustiguy.bsky.social•109 days ago

Saying "we're giving this visual novel audience a break from reading" is like saying "we're giving this fighting game audience a break from fighting."

Like yeah, sure, MAYBE some people will get really invested in your Fall Guys knockoff, but that's... not why anyone is buying your game...?? 😭

runa-liore.itch.io•109 days ago

It's very funny because it reminds me of stories I hear from my friends in traditional publishing,
about authors who don't read romance and don't like romance as a genre but try their hand at writing romance by removing all the things that romance genre readers love.

badendingsfound.bsky.social•109 days ago

Thissssss!!! This x a million!

arimiadev.com•109 days ago

"I want to write a romance where everyone is unhappy and dies at the end"
"you mean a tragedy?"
"no its a romance"

xlatrina.bsky.social•107 days ago

Please, it always bothers me when some devs say that 😭 like that’s the point, my guy… it’s a **Visual Novel**!!! We are readers, we expect to read!!

xlatrina.bsky.social•107 days ago

I think 2nd to devs who say things like that (as if reading is just the most horrible thing in the world or sumthin 🙄) are non-VN players who act like four or five sentences is just OHH SOO MUCH to read. Like… BRUH be so ffr rn 😭😭

deathbyempathy.bsky.social•109 days ago

I’m not a big fan of games that put a lot of exposition in book, especially at the beginning of a game. Short log entries are fine, but Cyberpunk over did it were most of the side missions you had to read some data pad to understand what was happening, really disliked that.

drakecukeo.bsky.social•109 days ago

Doing gameplay in VNs is somewhat hard ngl, it doesn't fit all the time
Danganronpa is a series that does it really well, so does AA

snailery.bsky.social•109 days ago

it's always funny in sillydelphia

drdoorknob.bsky.social•108 days ago

Don't know if I agree with this. 100% pure VNs get pretty boring to me, and it's nice to have pace breakers; though I respect gameplay will never be too intricate. I think creatively managing it well, engaging the player with presentation, and fitting the theme is a worthwhile challenge.

izein.bsky.social•108 days ago

?? Who do they think their target demographic is if they decide to commit to developing a vn

dinosprout.bsky.social•109 days ago

the thing is there is space for cutscene heavy games where movement consists of walking around to talk to people and there’s mini games. i call this “night in the woods genre” because idk if there’s an actual name for it.

they’re just not VNs.

horrorbro.bsky.social•108 days ago

please enjoy this 10 minute puzzle that doesn’t move the story forward in any way

drawkward.com•109 days ago

If I'm giving developers the benefit of the doubt, maybe they're making the choice because they'd like to see innovation in the space?

I have found most devs are not motivated to make "XYZ but with vampires". So maybe they're trying something different and hoping it resonates.

matchuthematriever.bsky.social•109 days ago

Yes, perfect example of "know your audience". There's nothing wrong with experimenting of course, but removing or disrupting the "core" of the game is often a bad idea.

zandow.bsky.social•109 days ago

Can we have voice acting? I mean slay the princess without the voice acting?

yeli5.bsky.social•109 days ago

Imagine Slay the princess without the voice acting. God it adds so much to the game! But there are cases where letting the player imagine the voices might be beneficial too

zandow.bsky.social•109 days ago

Yeah but I always see VN especially Japanese ones as anime’s that didn’t get enough funding. AI somnium gives me that feeling a lot

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