That said - I'm not watching cable news (and Fox is going to show the same one burning car on repeat all day no matter what happens) - but looking at the front page images for the WSJ, NYT and WaPo, I think so far the protestors are mostly not giving Trump what he wants and that's good. - ThreadSky

bretdevereaux.bsky.social • 4 days ago

That said - I'm not watching cable news (and Fox is going to show the same one burning car on repeat all day no matter what happens) - but looking at the front page images for the WSJ, NYT and WaPo, I think so far the protestors are mostly not giving Trump what he wants and that's good.

Comments

bretdevereaux.bsky.social•4 days ago

Fundamentally 'how does this impact the struggle' is going to come down to: is the majority understanding - the *image* - of LA protests (a) a building set on fire by 'looters' or is (b) an ICE agent clubbing someone's grandma or tear-gassing someone's kid?

If (b), you win.

claycopper.bsky.social•4 days ago

We literally have videos of the LAPD shooting people and press with rubber bullets at close range and every outlet ran burning Waymos this morning. Perfectly peaceful protests are far less important than a strategic communications effort spearheaded by...I dunno, an opposition party?

bretdevereaux.bsky.social•4 days ago

You will not get any argument from me that many elected democrats are being pretty feckless here. I assume they're worried about the backlash if they back the protests and tomorrow someone sets fire to a Walmart, but that's not really an excuse.

bretdevereaux.bsky.social•4 days ago

The unfair part of that strategic conundrum is that the media will *prefer* to run the burning building over the ICE agent brutality.

So you can't give them that choice: supply them only with the images you want them to show, *only* state violence.

That's how you win.

gulbanana.au•4 days ago

No, that's how *you* win. The goal of protesters is not to preserve the America of 2023 as though it were a perfect society.

irredeemablebunny.bsky.social•4 days ago

Ok, what is the goal of the protests then?

gulbanana.au•4 days ago

I'm not there, but surely
a) an attempt to stop their families and neighbours from being dragged away by racists
b) failing that, to express anger at this and the generations of racist leadup.

They are not angry because they love America, or because they think "America is better than this".

irredeemablebunny.bsky.social•4 days ago

So, one goal is absolutely minimal, nigh inconsequential alleviation, and another goal is a tantrum.

Damn guys, you're so screwed.

sandehalynch.com•4 days ago

Search on here for:

"Here's your LAPD when they think no one's looking"

Though you may have seen it by now.

seancj.bsky.social•4 days ago

Look at how CNN are referring to the (reported / intended) deployment of Marines to LA though: "are being deployed as a show of force against U.S. citizens" !

If this is the tack things take, you're on pretty safe ground.

https://bsky.app/profile/acyn.bsky.social/post/3lr76cgcuap26

seancj.bsky.social•4 days ago

Since we can't really influence what (some) people on the ground are doing, I think the more important part is to communicate as strongly and clearly the (b) part that is happening:
Here, towards media, and also by putting pressure on elected Democrats not to run with Shiff's shitty ...

seancj.bsky.social•4 days ago

... "need to stay peaceful" line, but with Harris's and Newsom's clear: this is a provocation, and even so, protests have been largely non-violent.

Pointing out protests that are springing up elsewhere in solidarity - in Boston, Chicago, San Fransico etc. is certainly also a good thing!

joshsteich.bsky.social•3 days ago

That’s impossible without significantly more coordination

wonderfulstarfish.bsky.social•4 days ago

One would think "police filmed shooting journalist on air" would foot the bill.

drtomyoung.bsky.social•4 days ago

They're going to create the visuals they want. They will air them on both Fox News and MSNBC. Controlling the narrative and imagery is always going to be a losing fight when both the government and the media are opposed to your project. The people have to find other ways to win.

koubitz.bsky.social•4 days ago

Sharing clips similar to that Australian journalist getting shot by the non-lethal bullet is one of the best things we can do imo. Just sharing all of those kinds of moments relentlessly. It can force media to cover it since it is "all people are talking about." https://bsky.app/profile/luckytran.com/post/3lr5amqrwlc2j

radgen.bsky.social•4 days ago

Impossible to do. This is not an organized group protesting.

greenclock.bsky.social•4 days ago

Everyone reading this can personally try to hold back. And mostly its going fine so far

khayyat.bsky.social•4 days ago

But we know that they'll escalate regardless of what visuals they have. They've been recycling footage from 2020 already.

The question isn't just political anymore, it's strategic. What will they do in the next city, and how do we respond?

bretdevereaux.bsky.social•4 days ago

And the answer is, 'bait them into overreacting while denying them the burning Walmart they need until the public understanding of this moment is 100 photos of ICE agents beating American-flag holding grandmas with sticks' because that is what gets you helpful public fury and that gets results.

bretdevereaux.bsky.social•4 days ago

And to be clear, those 'results' might be mass street demonstrations, Euromaidan-style (they might also be within the political process), but we are nowhere close to the level of public support and fury we'd need to do that.

waterloowellington.bsky.social•4 days ago

That scenario is a kind of awesome power. The only thing that can stop such a thing by brute force is soldiers with live ammo, mere police/security forces won't cut.

bloorugby.bsky.social•4 days ago

What I hear you saying is what I saw some doing in LA - Non-stop dancing.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3SGSmhoQffc

eafirstlast.bsky.social•4 days ago

They'll just burn the walmart down themselves and claim the protestors did it.

magos-dominus.bsky.social•4 days ago

The purpose of effective protest is not to punch the cops in the face, its to get punched in the face by the cops while on camera.

maaruin.bsky.social•4 days ago

I‘m not so sure about that, tbh. A significant part of Trump‘s base loves cruelty and despises weakness, and it is not (b) that makes Trump look weak, it is if he fails to prevent (a) often enough.

bretdevereaux.bsky.social•4 days ago

You aren't fighting for his base, you're fighting for the loosely attached folks who are why you won by 5 in 2020 but lost by 1.5 in 2024.

Like, I can't stress enough: the country is not 50% MAGA base and 50% progressive - there are a lot of 'persuadables' and you need them angry at Trump.

bretdevereaux.bsky.social•4 days ago

I've found it helpful to think in terms of the polling profiles in the Hidden Tribes report (https://hiddentribes.us/profiles/), which broke it down in 2018 as:
8% Progressives
11% Liberals
15% 'Passive' (disengaged) liberals
26% politically disengaged
15% moderates
19% Traditionalist conservatives
6% MAGA

bretdevereaux.bsky.social•4 days ago

You aren't going to reach the 25% conservative base, but you *can* engage the 'passive' liberals and move the moderates and disengaged off the sidelines, which is what you are trying to do.

throwingschlitz.bsky.social•4 days ago

I mean Bill Kristol is on here posting like a resist lib and anecdotally I know a few people IRL that fall in to the “traditional conservative” bucket who are seriously pissed about what has been happening.

I think the unreachable group is probably quite a bit smaller than 25%.

maaruin.bsky.social•4 days ago

I‘d have to ask what the theory of victory for this is, though. Trump loses the 2028 election? Impeachment after the midterms? Trump orders ICE to stand down because of public disapproval? (The TOV for making Trump look weak to his base is: he doesn’t want that and will chicken out, not escalate.)

Comments

Posting Rules

Reply