question for lawyers: what legal right do private security companies have, if any, to forcibly remove a person from a public event who is accused of disruptive speech, but not of touching or harming anyone? even if specifically hired to do so, do they have ANY legal footing, or is this kidnapping? - ThreadSky

jelenawoehr.bsky.social • 19 hours ago

question for lawyers: what legal right do private security companies have, if any, to forcibly remove a person from a public event who is accused of disruptive speech, but not of touching or harming anyone? even if specifically hired to do so, do they have ANY legal footing, or is this kidnapping?

Reposted from Laura Jedeed

Nobody seems to have any idea who the men who detained her are

The sheriff was apparently in attendence and did nothing. Maybe they were his guys. Maybe not. Maybe it doesn't matter anymore

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jelenawoehr.bsky.social•19 hours ago

additional lawyer question: if a woman uses lethal force against a man who refuses to identify himself, is not a law enforcement officer and is attempting to bind her with zip ties and forcibly remove her from a building, refusing to say where he’s taking her, does this qualify as self defense?

jelenawoehr.bsky.social•19 hours ago

I feel very fortunate to live in a place I don’t have to make the call about whether or not to bring a weapon simply to attend an elected official’s town hall but I think if I were a woman going anywhere in Idaho this would become a very pertinent question for me after seeing this video

jelenawoehr.bsky.social•19 hours ago

i think a lot of women would probably prefer to take their chances with a jury than with three guys displaying the body language in that video, hired by guys displaying the comfort with verbally abusing women the sheriff and his emcee display in that video

ghostpalmtechnique.bsky.social•19 hours ago

(I am not a lawyer, but I did used to work in security. This may vary by state; I know VA.)

Unarmed security can only observe and report. Armed security may have arrest authority, but, like the police, you must identify yourself. You can't just bag somebody without showing ID.

jelenawoehr.bsky.social•19 hours ago

thank you for this information, that matches my vague understanding of this in CA as well—I imagine there’d be exceptions given in an “imminent threat” scenario but there’s no argument here that they didn’t have time or safety to identify themselves, she was seated with her hands visible

thebystander99.bsky.social•18 hours ago

A decent answer would take a lot more space than available here, but, in CA, deadly force requires reasonable belief of imminent (not future) deadly or serious injury. If you look up CALCRIM No. 505, you’ll find the jury instructions. Some info in the notes about how to start defining these terms

litigator53.bsky.social•19 hours ago

Generally speaking, a private person has a limited right to use force in self defense or the defense of others; and in many states, may use reasonable force to effect a citizen’s arrest for certain crimes. Doesn’t appear that this incident would qualify for such a justification for a use of force.

jelenawoehr.bsky.social•19 hours ago

agreed, I don’t think hecklers yelling over someone in a public meeting would even be charged as a crime if it happened during the state of the union, so hard to see a justification for citizen’s arrest or self defense / imminent threats there 😬

jelenawoehr.bsky.social•19 hours ago

(And thank you for the expertise, I hadn’t considered a citizen’s arrest angle)

kevinlikesmaps.bsky.social•19 hours ago

it's concerning that a huge crowd of people saw a woman essentially being kidnapped and did nothing. Those guys should have been stomped. Would they really shoot up a room full of senior citizens?

jelenawoehr.bsky.social•19 hours ago

Unclear if they were even armed, though in Idaho they probably were. I’d absolutely have thrown hands but I’m an idiot with no flight response and that’s why I take boxing lessons—seemed like most of the men in the room were loving seeing her assaulted, and the women were outnumbered dramatically

kevinlikesmaps.bsky.social•19 hours ago

yeah true, it's Idaho so I'm sure the majority were in favor of seeing a lib get owned.

I worry they'll face continued harassment. It's a small city. I bet a lot of people in that room know each other.

bgcanuck.bsky.social•6 hours ago

Hey internet sleuths. Can anyone id & out these goons? Their faces are very clear in the videos that are on-line.

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