I'm not going to engage anyone directly, I am too tired and cranky for that. But a thing about "liberals and leftists must learn to work together to defeat the right"... Any liberal who will sacrifice any of us is "the right" and must be defeated. - ThreadSky

alexandraerin.com • 23 days ago

I'm not going to engage anyone directly, I am too tired and cranky for that.

But a thing about "liberals and leftists must learn to work together to defeat the right"...

Any liberal who will sacrifice any of us is "the right" and must be defeated.

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alexandraerin.com•23 days ago

Because I know there's purity politics and predators and other problems on the left, but my memorable recent experience of liberals trying for a big tent approach is "Look, it is too important that we defeat the right for us to let you stop us from putting you into the woodchipper."

alexandraerin.com•23 days ago

You want a big tent?

YOU MAKE THE FUCKING TENT BIG.

That's both obvious and non-negotiable. It's just basic reality.

alexandraerin.com•23 days ago

A big tent does not mean we leave room for people who want to kick others out of the tent.

It means we don't let the kickers in.

alexandraerin.com•23 days ago

There are tons of liberals who are open about the limits of their tolerance. (Immigrants, trans people, etc.)

Maybe some of these liberals think it's worth making common cause with the left.

That can *only* work one way: you drop your bigotry. All the way. Period.

alexandraerin.com•23 days ago

Because if you cannot drop the bigotry... if you cannot fully repudiate transphobia, racism, xenophobia, etc., for the sake of a political alliance... I mean, the point of the alliance is numbers. Right? Strength in numbers? You see how this goes?

alexandraerin.com•23 days ago

You want to defeat the right through political alliance, you shut the fuck up about whatever you think is the "reasonable limit" of racism or transphobia or homophobia or sexism. The limit is zero. Whatever you feel in your heart, your new political stance is not that.

edcote.bsky.social•23 days ago

"You're not a player on either team. You're the ball." That's from the Alt Right Playbook, episode title is Cost of Doing Business

miasma667.bsky.social•23 days ago

I really think liberals want fascists to destroy trans people so they can go back to their self-absorbed little lives and not have to make themselves uncomfortable pretending to defend us.

making a defense against racism, xenophobia or any bigotry is energy they don't want to spend

malakim2099.bsky.social•23 days ago

Please define "liberal."

Because I've defined myself as a liberal for most of my life, and I've never wanted that. But go on and keep telling me what I'm like. I'm dying to know more since you clearly know me better than I do.

malakim2099.bsky.social•23 days ago

Liberal in the sense of "American Liberal." I.e. pretty much left of center and not any sort of center-right in the sense that Europeans tend to mean it, anyway. At least, that's how /I/ use it. YMMV.

liamchristenson.bsky.social•23 days ago

Also understand that the term liberal means right wing of the GOP position of politics in my country. As Bluesky is an international app you may’ve gotten responses from that context.

katyrex.meatjacker.social•23 days ago

I think perhaps the disconnect here is the one you allude to but are still offended by, that you are using the same word to mean different things. If you know someone else's definition is different, they obviously are not claiming to know you personally? This did not need to be hostile.

malakim2099.bsky.social•23 days ago

Considering I've had people claim that if you're not advocating the destruction of capitalism you're a "liberal" not a "leftist...."

(And no, that's not hyperbole, I was actually told that by someone here on Bluesky.)

My patience starts wearing thin when I see immediate attacks/presumptions.

katyrex.meatjacker.social•23 days ago

I can't stop you from being hostile, evidently, but please know that it continues to not be necessary in what could otherwise be a productive conversation about ways forward. You can take what other people said out on me and other unrelated people, obviously, but it's not really doing anything.

malakim2099.bsky.social•23 days ago

No, and you're right, I was snippy and vitriolic in the initial reply. But after getting poked by the right for decades for being liberal to suddenly have the Left using it as a slur is like "Wait WHAT?"

Not an excuse, but an explanation. Though now I do have clarification, so that helps. Pax.

ladyaranea.bsky.social•23 days ago

That's... just definitionally true. If you're still defending capitalism, you might be moderate enough to ALIGN with the left, but you're not left.

katyrex.meatjacker.social•23 days ago

My experience is that while labels and definitions have specific meanings, it tends to be unproductive to try to convince people about which ones apply to them personally tbh

sloanefragment.bsky.social•23 days ago

okay. are democrats liberals?

bcos those ppl. we mean those ppl. we mean ‘resisters’ who spend all their time making racist, homophobic, transphobic jokes about republicans.

those ppl.

malakim2099.bsky.social•23 days ago

I wouldn't call "resisters" liberals. I call them centrists. Or con-artists. But definitely not liberals as I use the term.

Honestly, if you asked me who was "liberal" in the current Democratic party? AOC. Certain governors and others on the state level. Bernie is independent otherwise yes.

malakim2099.bsky.social•23 days ago

And see, THIS is why I get cranky. Because I'm used to using Liberal in the older vernacular where it basically is "leftist" and too many are using "liberal" like it's effectively "centrist."

Freaking Overton windows.

sloanefragment.bsky.social•23 days ago

yeah i basically mean ‘centrist’. ✌🏻

filbi.bsky.social•23 days ago

You gotta consider the possibility at this point that you're not a liberal

I used to insist I was a liberal until I realized that 99% of the Democratic establishment had nothing in common with me, but socialists and anarchists did.

malakim2099.bsky.social•23 days ago

Damnit, this means I am old, I gotta change everything and I'm cranky about it. 😜

katyrex.meatjacker.social•23 days ago

The people who have been making "Elonia" jokes and tell us we're no better than Republicans when we say it's transphobic, yes! The people who call female politicians whores and claim they're justified because it "hurts them" and they don't care that actual sex workers are asking them to stop!

katyrex.meatjacker.social•23 days ago

The people who have been in my mentions for weeks, even though I ALSO VOTED FOR HARRIS, for not falling in line with every thing she has said, for having objections to the things the Democrats have also said and done about trans people, about undocumented people, and about Gaza. Those liberals.

malakim2099.bsky.social•23 days ago

If you saw my reply, you would note that I do NOT consider them liberals. At all.

They are, at BEST, centrists, from my point of view. Or con-artists, more likely. Resistance grifters that preach change and go with status quo with no convictions.

And I hate those fuckers with a goddamn passion.

randomjeweler.bsky.social•23 days ago

Yea I'd be like " maybe those people have a good point " and liberals would be all " you're making us lose' like it was a middle school kickball game

thegonzalez.bsky.social•22 days ago

Neighbor, might just be you're not a Liberal. This would be a good thing.

thegonzalez.bsky.social•22 days ago

If you don't want that, you might be more if a Lefty than you thought. That's neat!

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