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owillis.bsky.social • 5 days ago

Yep

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Aaron Sorkin taught a generation of liberals that politics is just Speech and Debate where a well stated argument with citations means you win. The upshot being that so many lib/left people disdain having to actually *sell* their ideology. You either agree (smart) or don't (dumb and/or bigoted).

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sethlangner.bsky.social•5 days ago

When The West Wing aired, education levels and party affiliation didn’t correlate at all. Now the do. The less education one has, the more likely they’ll vote MAGA, aka dumb and bigoted. So yeah, cogent arguments matter not when more than half of Americans read at an eight grade level.

microblap.bsky.social•5 days ago

The comments to the thread on this are maddening - soooooo, many folks arguing "but 'to be fair' we are 'right'" . . .

goodfella18.bsky.social•5 days ago

Many of us don’t want to be sold with BS. Say what you’ll do and do what you say. I don’t need a sales pitch. If you talk about improving infrastructure, then just fucking improve infrastructure. I don’t need to watch another fucking book signing behind a little desk.

whereisourtr-mp.bsky.social•5 days ago

The rights “sales pitch” tends to invoke visceral emotion or relies on plain lying about reality. The “just dumb” conclusion is based on other’s inability to discern fact from fiction or their falling back on confirmation bias. The right has perfected demagoguery.

insideeyeroll.bsky.social•5 days ago

Yeah, project 2025 just needs to be sold and isn’t dumb or bigoted.

teerup.bsky.social•4 days ago

It’s not hard to disagree with someone who refuses to accept statistics and proven science to determine their beliefs. When beliefs are formulated based on pseudo science they are subject to criticism.
We can survive on different beliefs, we will struggle under different facts.

ecuamerican.bsky.social•5 days ago

Please be more lame and blame Aaron Sorkin for a little more, just to show off your smart brain lol

dctoedt.bsky.social•5 days ago

Contra: The West Wing taught me — previously a lifelong conservative Republican but increasingly uncomfortable about the positions and the people — that liberals could be smart and compassionate. So I'll watch anything Sorkin writes or initiates.

andhakari.bsky.social•5 days ago

Step 1: own a media empire devoted to entertaining lies that scare folk, but in a good way.

skylarkv.bsky.social•5 days ago

Or, TL:DR: pays to always remember people are human.

ajmtd.bsky.social•5 days ago

As opposed to “migrants are eating pets”?

wethepatriots.bsky.social•5 days ago

Today ur either democratic (with a small d) or RtwingNUT oligarchical fascist so u’d think American patriots would not have to sell that as an overt conman felon copying Hitler steals us blind (literally in Republicans’ case😵‍💫). Republicans are radicalized, Nazified, brainwashed, shameless fools.💔🤍💙

skatetigger.bsky.social•5 days ago

Wait let me understand this, we're blaming an amazing TV show for the fact that people bought into a con and still believe it over someone who gave them plans and did say how she was going to help them. Just stop. I get so tired of they should have said this or that. People believed lies.

davidantonovich.bsky.social•5 days ago

I guess I thought a well-stated argument supported with citations would sell itself. It’s the snake-oil salesmen who have to *sell* their ideology…

occamstorquewrench.bsky.social•5 days ago

True. But you would think that their ideology would sell itself. Realitytends to be self-correcting🤔

charlienetto.bsky.social•5 days ago

think this is a bit of an oversimplification of a show with over 140 episodes and a distinct showrunner / writer shift midway through -

i do think it does set up the idea often that if you can win the argument. that you can be right and basically prove someone else speechless.

adnil-resists.bsky.social•5 days ago

I agree. But does this mean we don’t know what to do now, faced with an opponent who has no interest in debating, much less ideas? And if so, how do we defeat the m-f***ers?

mememoreme.bsky.social•5 days ago

Well. Fact is there are a lot of bigots and misogynists who refuse to see themselves as such. But the problem from my POV is

It’s bullshit.

The courts provide a permission structure to deceive the electorate. NDAs, cash for defamation, no admitting wrong doing ALL INFLUENCES PUBLIC OPINION.

mememoreme.bsky.social•5 days ago

Imagine if Rupert got on the stand to say we knew Trump and Stop the Steal was a LIE. But we wanted the coup!

How about defrauding the electorate that proj 2025 was a dem hoax?

What is the GOP legit selling? lies intended to deceive the bigoted poor who they’ve TAUGHT to ignore critical thinking.

the92.bsky.social•5 days ago

Or you have a citizenry who does not know how their government works, have no knowledge of history and know very little about the world around them. They hate government and at the same time expect government to meet their every need. Racism and sexism are woven into the fabric of the country.

domtaylor.bsky.social•5 days ago

My objection to West Wing is gloomier than this - it's a desturctive narcotic. A soothing fantasy of urbane, well-inentioned ppl triumphing over ultimately trivial challenges - trivial compared to net-total of their fundamental goodness.
A candid historical survey makes plain the wilful fantasy.

jalex32x.bsky.social•5 days ago

Now tell us about the US health care system as revealed in the plotlines of Grey’s Anatomy.

rcoller.bsky.social•5 days ago

.
...the First Warmonger/ Academic/ Smarty-Pants President was University Professor Woodrow Wilson (2 terms -- 1913-1921).
.
Classic stuff. However, 'The People' have finally, after 112 years, decided not to be lectured-at by incompetent thieves and bureaucrats.
.

wholetree.bsky.social•5 days ago

Basically, it seems to boil down to the MAGA types feeling like: "My opinion is as valuable as your knowledge and expertise."

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