They’re incredibly useful discussions actually. The Democratic Party, as we know it, is irreparably broken and must be destroyed and rebuilt with progressive.
Progressivism and its future in the Democratic coalition is absolutely a live topic (IMHO: get rid of the gerontocracy, let the young[-er] progressives lead).
"Bernie would have won" is sour grapes that makes the speaker sound unserious.
What makes you think a very progressive candidate and platform will win nationally? Our last 2 2 term democratic presidents, Obama and Clinton were centrists. Would love for a progressive POTUS and congress but it won't fly in many battleground states. Nominate the next "McGovern" see what happens
And by the way Biden was seen as a centrist, but after a lot of progressive legislation and executive acts his approval rating suffered. Maybe didn't hurt him but certainly didn't help either.
To be fair, Biden promised student loan forgiveness & a public option. He shut up about the public option after winning & then means tested the student loan forgiveness into a lost lawsuit. Run a candidate who voters believe will actually fight for them. We got burned with credit card Joe.
Bernie's got great policies but he's never been able to generate meaningful support for his legislation. His colleagues don't like him. This was true when he was in the House, before you ever knew his name, and it's truer now than ever.
No, the game of not tweeking the nose of voters he really needs in battleground states - the voter who doesn't live and breath politics and is leary of what will be called "radical" ideas by Republicans.
Sanders was too radical for like 80% of voters, even for many Dems. Good policies, but sudden change doesn't go over well with voters even if it's a net positive.
Do you insufferable liberals read what you write? A guy just won on the platform that he’s going to round up people and put them essentially in concentration camps.
Maybe the “radical” policies that BENEFIT people will be what wins!!!?!?
Isn’t it maybe possible the centrism is what loses?
I imagine they have to win over the centrists in order to get enough votes. Republicans are all unified under Trump for one reason or another (some are raging cunts, others are hoping for cheap groceries). Bernie hasn't become POTUS by preaching solely to the most progressive Dems.
Well she got damn close in the popular vote. She didn't win but you can't dispute that she got farther with a center-left platform than with the far-left one Bernie's running with. Dems making big changes has historically been during recessions (FDR in the 1930s, Obama in '08, Biden in '20).
You’re not reading what you’re writing are you? You do understand she didn’t even have to run in the primary and the last time she ran out of primary… She lost.
Pretty much every Trump voter I’ve talked to says they like Bernie’s policies. Hell, they even like Bernie, but they’re repulsed by every other Dem candidate. Trumpers also laugh at me cuz they know my party hates me cuz I was a Bernie supporter. Lol! Oh well. Authoritarianism it is.
100%. He had a stance on Israel, one that aligned with the ostracized youth in their college years. That would drawn a hefty amount. He also has good ideas and inspires confidence. Apathy would have been lower, and blue would have had a huge turnout.
Instead we got “well I’m not Trump 🤷🏽♂️” and lost
People will say “she only had 100 days” “you’re sexist if you don’t support her” “she has a good platform”
She… didn’t really speak on a majority of the pressing issues, essentially said “boys will be boys” about Israel/Gaza and reiterated “we can’t let Trump win. Why? Because.”
He may have, he may not have. It would've great if he has given he chance. What happened to Jeremy Corbyn in the UK, where he was ratfucked at every turn during the general election by both the media and his own party, I would imagine that the Dem leadership and its media arms would've done the same
They did and that’s why he didn’t get the nomination. I think in the general he would’ve done fine against Trump. Trump was running against fake populism and what Bernie was running with was real honest populism. What would’ve shown through more than anything is that Bernie wasn’t full of shit.
No he wouldn’t have. He never courted the base of the party: Black folks. He never campaigned in the Deep South and certainly not with Black voters. He expected them to hand over their votes for nothing.
Black people don’t want universal healthcare too? Seemed like he was courting anyone tired of not having their basic needs covered while rich people get richer.
He ran and lost. He had great ideas and I supported him but he’s also a jerk to everyone else in Congress, which was a mistake. Trump is the same but they still fall in line behind him because they’re scared of him.
I wish he was a better politician because I’m closest aligned with his ideas.
Pretty sure there was no proof Biden cheated. However Hilary had a plain as day email colluding with the DNC and us Democrats and independents did nothing about it.
You are joking, right? She hasn’t run president yet. If you don’t think the knives will come out for her if she ever runs, then you’re not paying any attention. Pelosi is already trying to take her committee assignments.
Exactly, AOC went along to get along, and lost leftist cred by doing so. In return Pelosi is rewarding her by treating her oversight committee bid as a threat.
The party will not allow the status quo to be challenged. The people that have been in for decades have built up too many favors.
Molly, he lost because every Dem candidate dropped out of the race after the Nevada primary and rallied around Biden heading into South Carolina. Dem establishment saw *this* map and decided to screw him over.
(Love you and your baseball coverage but you can't even see Biden on the map.)
This map was rather early in the primary and nobody has ever denied that Bernie had lots of donors. He'd already run for president after all and had a list of millions who'd already donated to him once. Other candidates had to buy lists (or had a large donor buy them) or build them from scratch.
Biden's base was more poor or working class than Bernie's, more minorities and less involved in politics. Of course it would be more difficult to get them to donate.
Bernie never tried to win over anyone's supporters. That's why he lost.
Maybe Pete had a marital spat prior to thoughtfully saying he’d be straight if he could be. His thoughtful quip did not appear mindful of his husband. Veteran Pete has universal healthcare for life; so, he thoughtfully doesn’t mind the rest of America being denied coverage.
It's worth looking back at the 2019 Nevada primary and seeing just how well Bernie performed with Latinos and Culinary Union workers, who actually voted for Bernie overwhelmingly despite Union leadership actively campaigning against him.
As a Vegas resident, I was pretty proud of my city and it was probably the single most hopeful day I ever had in relation to the future of politics in the country. I remember sitting in a bar in California watching the results from South Carolina and feeling exactly the opposite.
I’ve had two “team Pete” and one “K hive“ reply today. Either they’re real and the Libs are here (god help us all!) or Musk/Thiel have started his next psyop campaign.
I mean, how can you tell the difference anymore? Dems are so stupid at this point it’s hard to discern psyop from their dumbassey
It’s almost like there’s a reason Bernie has “enemies“ within the Democratic Party. God forbid he questioned the sanctity of the pharmaceutical and health insurance industries.
Clyburn is the same guy who just said Joe Biden should PARDON Donald Trump. So if he’s a person you want to have as a “friend“ in Congress, the Democratic Party is truly lost.
He is deeply, deeply unpopular in his own caucus because he’s an asshole. I support him. I agree with his views. I think billionaires are amoral and health care should be free.
Had he been a better politician he would have won.
But he’s an asshole and it crushed him and us.
That's not why he's unpopular. Its the fact that he supports non-corporate money contributions and they love being millionaires so much they sell the public down the river without a paddle.
And look, that’s fine! Sometimes assholes win if they can scare people, like Trump. Bernie had no allies because unlike Trump he isn’t a professional bullshitter and grifter.
He’s just gruff and obstinate and nobody wants to work with him.
He ran and lost bc the Democratic party didn't really support him bc Hillary was apparently a safer pick. They thought Bernie was extreme which I don't really see
Comments
But alas these are not useful discussions here in 2024 on the eve of Trump 2.0.
We have a present and [hopefully, with a lot of work] a future we need to be focused on.
"Bernie would have won" is sour grapes that makes the speaker sound unserious.
The sour grapes are the people still acting like somehow Bernie didn’t campaign hard enough or endorse her early enough. As if that’s why she lost.
(By the way, he campaigned for her relentlessly)
Bernie's got great policies but he's never been able to generate meaningful support for his legislation. His colleagues don't like him. This was true when he was in the House, before you ever knew his name, and it's truer now than ever.
Big deal. Those require almost no cooperation from others. Members routinely vote no in voice and yes on roll optics.
And Sanders was getting lapped by Leahy twice over when you look at overall amendments.
https://bsky.app/profile/axios.com/post/3ldgpqqfljk2w
Maybe the “radical” policies that BENEFIT people will be what wins!!!?!?
Isn’t it maybe possible the centrism is what loses?
Instead we got “well I’m not Trump 🤷🏽♂️” and lost
It’s amazing that didn’t win!!!
She… didn’t really speak on a majority of the pressing issues, essentially said “boys will be boys” about Israel/Gaza and reiterated “we can’t let Trump win. Why? Because.”
I mean, what an asshole for wanting seniors to have hearing aids under Medicare.
I wish he was a better politician because I’m closest aligned with his ideas.
You also are aware that she completely changed her politics since those days?
Portland is full of them
The party will not allow the status quo to be challenged. The people that have been in for decades have built up too many favors.
(Love you and your baseball coverage but you can't even see Biden on the map.)
Bernie never tried to win over anyone's supporters. That's why he lost.
He's obviously not very good at math.
Do you have anything mote substantial to add?
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/elections/2020/02/22/nevada-caucus-bernie-sanders-scores-huge-victory-and-other-takeaways/4830409002/
https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2019/08/02/us/politics/2020-democratic-fundraising.html
Can you please realize that people like Pete, Kamala, Pelosi and Biden, etc. are the reason we’re so fucked right now?
I mean, how can you tell the difference anymore? Dems are so stupid at this point it’s hard to discern psyop from their dumbassey
Democrats are racist against White people.
Had he been a better politician he would have won.
But he’s an asshole and it crushed him and us.
Biden knew how to compromise, something manybin Congress don't, especially knowadays.
He’s just gruff and obstinate and nobody wants to work with him.
It fucking sucks.
https://bsky.app/profile/axios.com/post/3ldgpqqfljk2w