I for one kind of wish people who use phrases like "trans advocates" shut up forever permanently instead of trying to be helpful, but what do I know. - ThreadSky

dov.bsky.social • 12 days ago

I for one kind of wish people who use phrases like "trans advocates" shut up forever permanently instead of trying to be helpful, but what do I know.

Reposted from Grizwald

Even if trans advocates conclude that they're not, I wish they would consider how much of an anchor the trans sports issue is on the trans rights movement generally.

This might be a situation where, after the current generation of activists retire, the next gen will quietly abandon the issue.

Comments

grizwald.bsky.social•12 days ago

Not much, it turns out.

mrbtx.bsky.social•12 days ago

jesus christ

like yes trans kids in sports is the biggest hurdle for folks esp in the US to get good on, but you fix that by changing the valence of the issue etc not w/e that person wants

lines.snail.skin•12 days ago

frankly it's not even an issue "activists" have pushed. they did this!

mrbtx.bsky.social•12 days ago

right! it's just the one part of the whole "issue" that actually has some vague purchase with normies

fornbirkibeinn.bsky.social•12 days ago

Except insofar as being trans makes you an "activist" to those people who wish to drive back trans rights.

lines.snail.skin•12 days ago

quite so

dov.bsky.social•12 days ago

It is really easy to tell when someone is weighing in because they Read About The Issue In A Magazine, as opposed to, you know, those of us who care about trans people because that category includes our friends and family, and I really do think the former should stop offering unsolicited advice.

dov.bsky.social•12 days ago

I'm not a "trans advocate" or a "trans activist." I'm just a person who has multiple friends who happen to be trans and I am violently and very furiously sick of the hyperpoliticisation of their life. If I can tell by your words that that's not what it's about for you, maybe shut your mouth.

grizwald.bsky.social•12 days ago

Or, hear me out, maybe take a step back from this wildly narcissistic attitude and consider the impact that your demands have on others.

malavolpe.bsky.social•12 days ago

You do not even know what the word "narcissistic" even means.

grizwald.bsky.social•12 days ago

I suspect you're a textbook example of it.

calliopeanim.bsky.social•12 days ago

Says the dude who think he knows better than all trans people about an issue he has 0 experience with or stake in.

erichluepke.bsky.social•12 days ago

If the issue really is blown out of proportion then I'd be fine with both sides dropping the issue and just leaving whatever policy is in place now in place. Right now it's the bigots who are staking over a hundred million dollars of federal funds on two athletes. We didn't ask for that escalation!

erichluepke.bsky.social•12 days ago

This is the same playbook as the abortion rights attackers. They start with horror stories about late third trimester abortions, pick out a couple "horror stories" that prove their point, and then when the coast is clear, immediately pivot to banning all abortions. We don't give them an inch.

grizwald.bsky.social•12 days ago

I don't think it's either wise or virtuous to let the tail wag the dog. You should speak the truth, and embrace a reasonable position based on the truth.

grizwald.bsky.social•12 days ago

Respectfully, I don't accept the existence of a binary choice between "support what Trump is doing on the subject or accept the progressive orthodoxy on it".

crzwdjk.bsky.social•12 days ago

I am not a trans advocate either but I am involved in sports and know trans people who participate in sports, including women's sports. And the (democratically run!) governing body of the sport has made its policy on that very clear: they're not in the business of deciding who is or is not a woman.

grizwald.bsky.social•12 days ago

A variety of governing bodies across North America are coming to different conclusions on this issue, and the only conclusion that I will categorically state is dumber than fuck is the governing body of a women's sports division deciding that it's not their problem who is or is not a woman.

crzwdjk.bsky.social•12 days ago

That's what the women who participate in the sport and via their voting representatives from each club decided. Do you want to tell these women that they're dumber than fuck? That you know better? Is that really the position you want to take here?

azery.bsky.social•12 days ago

they weren't 'demands' so much as seen as entirely OK until a few years ago where a shitstorm was astroturfed into existence.

grizwald.bsky.social•12 days ago

This is either a shameless rewriting of history, or you're young and ignorant and don't know better.

Trans advocates fought very hard for years and yes, made "demands", to arrive at the status quo of a few years ago that you apparently took for granted.

azery.bsky.social•12 days ago

I'm well aware that there is a long history of Trans folks fighting hard for their rights; my point is that this recent backlash wasn't caused by them pushing for something 'radical' in the past couple years so much as a largely astroturfed campaign by the media and other elites

dov.bsky.social•12 days ago

This person is starting from the frankly idiotic delusion that it is anything other than a thin end of a wedge designed to split the most gullible of those nominally opposed to transphobia away from those more strident about it. Which he can't see because he /is/ those gullible people.

grizwald.bsky.social•12 days ago

You, on the other hand, are suffering from the even more idiotic delusion that it isn't visibly obvious when trans women athletes have retained a physical advantage after transition, and what impact that visibly obvious fact might have on public opinion.

dov.bsky.social•12 days ago

It's funny they're accusing the rest of us of thinking we're above these conversations but the truth is that they are the only person here who is delusional enough to think that there can be a nice pleases-everyone compromise with a demand that transphobes started because they hate trans people

priznat.bsky.social•12 days ago

Even if you don’t personally know any trans people it should just be The Right Thing To Do. (Ensure they are treated fairly, with respect and dignity)

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