Not to put too fine a point on it, but when the Nazis first started sending Jews and other victims to camps, they called it deportation, and the camps were technically in other countries.
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"Deportation" during the Holocaust was always to sites under German governance with German administrators, German guards, German slave masters, and German killers.
Yes. That was absolutely not my point. My point (as a deportee's grandchild I do know something about this) is that from our perspective in France it was all deportation, and called thus
Exactly. The first phase of the Holocaust were "search and destroy" missions. Most perpetrators were either SS Einsatzgruppen, or Police Battalions (mostly made up of middle-aged draftees who weren't even party members).
What we euphemistically call "deportation" was from a later phase.
Ok, am going to mute this because it's pretty annoying to see people missing the point that much. It depends where and when and whatever. Deportation is an extremely darkly connoted word in many countries in Europe (e.g. France) and it's synonymous with death camps. Not an euphemism
The first camps were in Germany (e.g. Nohra in 1933). Deportation outside of Germany proper only became possible after 1938 after the annexation of Austria (Mauthausen).
And they could draw from experience with the deportation camps for Eastern Jews and Sinti and Roma created by the more democratic Prussian government in the 1920s. Good lesson from that, do not build democratic detention camps, this will just lead you down a very bad road.
Some people taking issue with details here. The first camp (Dachau) was indeed within German borders, but my wording was deliberately vague to make the point that deporting people to a foreign prison to labour and die is *literally* what Nazi Germany did to victims of the Holocaust.
It's not that what's happening in the US now is "like" the Holocaust: they're actually doing the exact same thing. Calling it deportation, doing it some place where the laws are more malleable, that's how the Nazis did it too. The same rhetorical and legal sleight of hands were used.
A lot of people will claim - months or years from now - that they didn't know what was happening, that it all seemed pretty uncontroversial at the time, that it was just deporting criminals to a prison somewhere else. We make these points to show that we are clear-sighted about these events.
Please my friend Jonathan don't ignore me 😭 Please help my family survive we are dying of hunger here every day, please treat me like a human for once 🙏🙏😭
After Nazi Germany was defeated, many people said they'd just assumed their neighbours were being relocated to places that were safer for them, where they would be given work to do. Historians have spent a long time wrestling with how true that really was.
They'll do it - it's already begun - but there will be no pleading ignorance when the dust settles. If you let this happen, if you were satisfied with the explanations you were fed, know that we knew perfectly well what was going on, and we told you, and if you chose to ignore it, that's on you.
I mean, a dipshit libertarian like Bukele does not exactly rise to the top of a "democratic" process in Latin America organically, much less for a judicial coup and unconstitutional second term, without at least a little assistance from some 3-letter agencies
If we want to be historically accurate, a better analogy would be the disabled. The Nazi’s first victims were disabled German children. “Aktion T4” quickly evolved into mass executions of disabled adults. It was how mobile gas chambers later used for the “final solution” were developed./1
In the case of Aktion T4, people did know and some (parents, church officials) protested against it with little success - killing continued only in secret. But that required that police and judges did not prosecute, so they became complicit when the minister of justice briefed them accordingly.
Again, let’s not sugar coat. There was a global Catholic backlash about Aktion T4, but the medical establishment and those administering institutions were complicit - from late 1938 to 1945.
I know. The (psychiatric) hospital were my parents worked, while it did not planned killing of its own, was a collection station for the transports to Hadamar (did not get a public memorial until late 1980s). There wasn't even a possible pretense that people "did not know" is all I am saying.
I reacted to “in secret”. As you note, everyone knew. Just like now. Trump is boasting about the cruelty. No one really believes the half asses excuses.
Here in AZ there a very real chance that in April the program that specifically is meant to fund care for people “at risk of institutionalization” will be without funding for two months. Also very possibly that the program will be cut altogether - with federal cuts as the justification. It’s bad.
I’ll add some historical analysis. At first German people were convinced to send their loved ones to institutions - told it would be better. It was optional. When preparing for war caregivers who could work were expected to send their loved one away and work. Eventually it was no longer optional.
What infuriates me is that cruelty is the only point. Community based care and inclusion doesn’t just improve the lives of the disabled community, it costs taxpayers less money.
Basic rights to access and societal inclusion for the disabled really have only existed since 1990. Trump gets away with victimizing them because we have a deep eugenics history.
Forced sterilization, like the Nazis, occurred here until 1979./3
Fascists always start with communities that are already marginalized. That, more than hair splitting about legal phrases, is how it gets normalized./end
Also, it's a network, so if you need the historical framing for some reason, it would be more analogous in also considering the for-profit incarcereal complex and detention facilities like Otay.
Yup: Poland.
Today, the USA disappearing people to a hell hole jail in a third country without due process or notification is NOT 'deportation'.
It's rendition.
With prejudice.
The word, in Nazisprache [Nazispeak] is "Entfernung," which means to remove, to put at a distance, to extirpate, eliminate, meaning: to fully execute the process of dealing with a foreign [i.e., Jewish] element.
There is a great book (they thought they were free), written in the 1950s when the war was fresh in people's minds. Milton Mayor is the author and he chronicles how the process was slow and confusing for everyone in Germany.
It's available on paper and audiobook and worth every minute.
Also, even at the time, it was a bitter joke among the common people. Mussolini claimed he made the trains run on time, when he didn’t, which is what you’re getting at with the propaganda. :)
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These were not to any foreign governments.
Half the dead were killed at their homes after all.
What we euphemistically call "deportation" was from a later phase.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nazi_concentration_camps#Early_camps_(1933%E2%80%931934)
Not yet anyway.
From day 1 the administration has been driving the disabled from the workforce and is now dismantling special education./2
Forced sterilization, like the Nazis, occurred here until 1979./3
It began with opposition parties such as the Social Democrats, Communists, Centre Party, etc. in order to create one party rule.
Also, it's a network, so if you need the historical framing for some reason, it would be more analogous in also considering the for-profit incarcereal complex and detention facilities like Otay.
https://edition.cnn.com/2015/01/26/world/nazi-death-camps/index.html
As she rightly says, they were *Nazi* camps, in Nazi-occupied Poland.
And now Poland is shaping up to be Europe’s most powerful army, because Not Fucking Around Any More might as well be the national motto. 🇵🇱
Today, the USA disappearing people to a hell hole jail in a third country without due process or notification is NOT 'deportation'.
It's rendition.
With prejudice.
It's available on paper and audiobook and worth every minute.
Christian Nationalism = Fascists for Jesus
These people are basically speed running Nazi shit.