Apart from the argument being silly, politically, these numbers are wrong. There are about 25k youth mobility visas a year [with 80k places on offer). About half of all visas are from Australia [using up roughly a quarter of Australian quota of 45k, averaging 10k/year] bsky.app/profile/did:... - ThreadSky

sundersays.bsky.social • 7 days ago

Apart from the argument being silly, politically, these numbers are wrong.

There are about 25k youth mobility visas a year [with 80k places on offer). About half of all visas are from Australia [using up roughly a quarter of Australian quota of 45k, averaging 10k/year]

https://bsky.app/profile/did:plc:refbwihhzcqqfulwhcou44sr/post/3linfdbdswc2c

Reposted from Sunder Katwala (sundersays)

Times has muddled up its youth mobility (Australia) data.

The cap is 45,000 (annually) for Australia, but that cap has never been filled. Report implies 45k visas were issued.

2008- June 2024, 158,000 people came to Australia (average: 10k/year)

2023: 9,000 from Australia (23k all countries)

Comments

dune400.bsky.social•6 days ago

It all just comes down to racism & English language cultural barrier. Aussies are white & semi British anyway according to Yvette Cooper's mind. But those Europeans some aren't white & speak forrin like that nasty Polish or Bulgarian.

sundersays.bsky.social•6 days ago

UK govt isn't publicly owning its willingness to negotiate a scheme that resembles existing UK schemes with Australia, Canada, Japan. The EU27 Commission proposal is significantly different (and unrealistic in some details). This may take some time to lock into a negotiation
https://bsky.app/profile/davidheniguk.bsky.social/post/3lio7afiqpc2g

sundersays.bsky.social•6 days ago

It would be interesting to see whether or not the April 2025 White Paper on immigration included any broad principles about the UK government's approach to existing youth mobility schemes and/or future extensions of them. That is how the UK could signal its view of what youth mobility is for

sundersays.bsky.social•6 days ago

Actual youth mobility numbers for 2023 and first half of 2024 (up a bit) vs the quotas (which are undersubscribed, except for India 3000, Hong Kong/Taiwan 1000 each). Canada well short of the 8k quota

sundersays.bsky.social•6 days ago

San Marino has a very generous quota of up to 1000 places but only 1 person on the scheme in first half of 2024! There were 4 people from Andorra, where the quota is 100

politicanimal.bsky.social•6 days ago

That’s some impressive negotiating by San Marino. To fulfil their quota, they would need just under one-third of 18-30 year old Sammarinese to be in the UK in any given year.

anthonyzach.be•6 days ago

Looking forward to some corner of west London being dubbed "Little San Marino" with its unique extremely-similar-to-Italian cuisine.

sundersays.bsky.social•6 days ago

*if* an EU27 quota was as generous as San Marino (1000 for population of 33,0000), it would have to be 13.5 million (!). To match the actual take-up, divide by 1000: so it would be 13,500. The Times does not seem to have stumbled on a meaningful way to consider the shape of a future policy!

francesconicoli.bsky.social•6 days ago

I am sorry but youth mobility is such a nothingburger. I don't know which concessions starmer expects to get but if there's anything it's going to be minimal.

susanseekshope.bsky.social•6 days ago

Youth mobility should certainly not be less favourable with EU than Canada, Australia et al.

sundersays.bsky.social•6 days ago

Similar principles is straightforward. Australia is a big outlier on size of the unfulfilled quota of 45k (with take-up just over a quarter of that). Canada quota is 8000, but is undersubscribed

catiomiles.bsky.social•6 days ago

When we say the EU proposal is “unrealistic in some respects”, are these respects related to U.K. politics and the unwillingness of the UK government to face down the far right media?

sundersays.bsky.social•6 days ago

Not just that no. Lots of people in the EU agree that the inclusion of home student fee status was unrealistic.

This is a novel EU27 proposal, because youth mobility has currently been a national competence with every other third country. See the Germany & Spain bilateral programmes.

sundersays.bsky.social•6 days ago

Its OK to replace the "treat the UK like any other third country" principle with "treat the UK differently to any other third country on this issue" if thats the political consensus of the members to negotiate collectively. It makes it a novel bespoke negotiation, as the EU precedents are national

sundersays.bsky.social•6 days ago

EU27 proposal was broadly considered a maximalist opening negotiating gambit

It may be that there are objections in practice to UK/EU schemes that resemble the principles/practice of the existing German, Spanish and British youth mobility schemes (because EU see UK as a different 3rd country)

catiomiles.bsky.social•6 days ago

Thank you.

The student cost can be negotiated.

labcoatjoe.bsky.social•7 days ago

gosh! I'm surprised those numbers are so low. I went to Oz in 2004 on what was then the Working holiday visa and assumed there were loads more available in both directions. My employer offered to sponsor me but I came home. As most did. I find the govt opposition to this bonkers

rosieniven.bsky.social•6 days ago

A lot of Australians have traditionally had second passports from the UK and Ireland so would not need a working holiday visa. However, I suspect this number is dwindling due to democratic change now so uptake of these visas might increase.

rosieniven.bsky.social•6 days ago

Demographic not democratic!

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