P.S. State and federal charges are not mutually exclusive under the dual sovereignty doctrine (and it looks like MN is seeking charges). Personally I think state has greater interest here and should go first - ThreadSky

asharangappa.bsky.social • 1 day ago

P.S. State and federal charges are not mutually exclusive under the dual sovereignty doctrine (and it looks like MN is seeking charges). Personally I think state has greater interest here and should go first

Reposted from Asha Rangappa

Boelter is apparently facing federal charges. Which opens to door to a presidential pardon if convicted (if not before). There should be a state prosecution here to make sure justice actually gets served (and so evidence re motive is not selectively presented to conform to predetermined narratives)

Comments

ourhaus.bsky.social•1 day ago

He's just been charged by Hennepin County/ MN State who got in before Fed charges. Agree State should go 1st.FYI here in UK you can be charged with contempt of court for commenting on a case once charges pressed. So no SM comments on motive, guilt or innocence, evidence, theories. V diff approaches.

cathostage.bsky.social•1 day ago

That's terrifying.

ourhaus.bsky.social•1 day ago

UK contempt laws? Just a different judicial system. Poss easier to get unbiased jurors, & think public discussion on SM newspaper etc may stop somebody from getting a fair trial & affect a trial’s outcome. It feels wild to me to see so many opinions on his guilt, motives etc post charges.

cathostage.bsky.social•1 day ago

The problem--at least in the US--is that wrongful convictions are rampant. Often public attention is the only reason that gets fixed. In Illinois (nowhere near as bloodthirsty as some states), more death row inmates were exonerated than executed between 1977 and 2000 (when the death penalty ended)

ourhaus.bsky.social•1 day ago

Same in UK - lots of wrongful convictions. We all talk about it once trial ends. If a case is then appealed - we have to keep quiet again until appeal is over. Glad we no longer have death penalty. Not claiming UK has better system btw - but v different. Brief info here:
https://www.gov.uk/contempt-of-court

cathostage.bsky.social•1 day ago

Thanks for the link. I know there are downsides to our way, too, like constant calls for impeachments or recalls of judges just for reaching a decision some group didn't like.

bigdaddylipscomb2.bsky.social•1 day ago

We're in a new world now. Where if someone commits a crime "in the name of Trump", they must be charged stateside. Because Trump's liable to pardon them.

dbc105.bsky.social•1 day ago

That is why why the Feds filed charges, just so Trump can pardon the guy.

cherylbrown30.bsky.social•1 day ago

I didn’t even consider a possible Presidential Pardon if Federal prosecutors go first. I really hope MN goes first now!

ab9rf.bsky.social•1 day ago

under current law it doesn't matter who goes first, both state and feds can have their own separate trials. however, this relies on a doctrine (called "dual sovereignty") that has been subject to challenge in the past and could be challenged again. i expect the feds to do _exactly_ that

jtdjr55.bsky.social•1 day ago

where are the terrorist charges..?????

arkstfan.bsky.social•1 day ago

Darn hit the replies to find people to block. Assuming you hid them because the temptation of incorrectly correcting a woman seems like blood on the ground to draw insects.

origwolfepack.bsky.social•1 day ago

Get him on the state murder charge...secure that...dont even give TACO the ability to pardon him

knewsy.bsky.social•1 day ago

Derek Chauvin had both state and federal charges. State went first and it was televised. THis needs to be televised.

opus17.bsky.social•1 day ago

Very likely if the perp finds both Jesus and a million bucks, he can get a Trump pardon. Probably just the latter.

cathostage.bsky.social•1 day ago

Or he could just say something mean about the left.

searinglyaaron.bsky.social•1 day ago

Agreed
I want this pos to be accountable to me as a Minnesotan, through the system my taxes pay for. This guy did harm to all Minnesotans.

edithenz.bsky.social•1 day ago

How is this decided? Whether state or federal charge?

sariahmarier.bsky.social•1 day ago

Will Trump pardon him?
Will that make you angry enough to Stand Up?

Asking for 12 Million Friends

With State and Fed charges. How we (and they) handle this Legally and Constitutionally matters.

It's Urgent that we recognize, Federal Authoritarianism as it Stands in Contrast to State's Rights. 🌟

gr8writr.bsky.social•1 day ago

And that felon WILL pardon him🤯

lisasantos512.bsky.social•1 day ago

He will be prosecuted in both. Keith Ellison is Minneaota's AG and he isn't going to let Trump reward this guy for killing Democrats.

ruckus.bsky.social•1 day ago

can believe pardon is possible. or put differently, if it were, things would be impossibly fucked up, and I believe the mental competence of the pardoner would be a violence-making dispute

jimclausen.bsky.social•1 day ago

I think Kieth Ellison can be relied upon to do what is right.

gacyclist.bsky.social•1 day ago

Isn't it stunning the we actually have the real possibility of trump pardoning a political assassin? I never imagined that in this country.

better-2be-kind.bsky.social•1 day ago

Think the State should so trump can’t pardon him.

somelighttreason.bsky.social•1 day ago

State must bring charges! Trump pardoning this monster is a real possibility.

suzannewinland.bsky.social•1 day ago

... & trump can't pardon state charges.

winter0104.bsky.social•1 day ago

Got to be state charges first TACO will pardon the SOB.

bbkayaker.bsky.social•1 day ago

I told my friends that MN will file murder charges and they shouldn't be worried about fed taking over and a Trump pardon. Can the petite' clause have a play here?

tmurp1953.bsky.social•1 day ago

Yes!

icuk.bsky.social•1 day ago

J6 was”Antifa” then why the pardons. I don’t trust Bondi

docwest.bsky.social•1 day ago

Feds cannot be trusted to prosecute.

jaoswald.bsky.social•1 day ago

They could be trusted to prosecute. They can't be trusted to do a good job of it, they can't be trusted not to tank it if Trump demands it, and Trump absolutely cannot be trusted not to pardon the guy when the nutjobs clamor on his behalf.

vero1986.bsky.social•1 day ago

Don't believe surprised if trump pardons this murdering moron. He loves these murdering fascist as long as they support him. They are his people.

nwconservationist.bsky.social•1 day ago

💯 - to Minnesota having a greater interest and going first.

marygoodtrouble.bsky.social•1 day ago

I'm definitely concerned FOTUS will pardon him.

drtcsmith.bsky.social•1 day ago

Terrorism is a nice add on.

patfmil.bsky.social•1 day ago

They are seeking 1st degree murder charges. The 2nd degree charges were filed early in the investigation so neighboring states could hold him if captured on the MN charges

concerned2.bsky.social•1 day ago

Totally agree

politically.bsky.social•1 day ago

I mean, pardoning an obvious mass murderer would be political suicide for any President. But this is the new America

ronduplantis.bsky.social•1 day ago

Trump already crossed that line when he pardoned all of the J6ers.

Sure, we all know Trump is a lifelong fraudster.
So his recent pardons of other fraudsters is not a surprise.

But the J6 pardons … those people committed sedition (Proud Boys, etc), injured almost 150 CapCops, and are responsible…

ronduplantis.bsky.social•1 day ago

… for the deaths of Sicknick and others suffering from PTSD on that day who committed suicide.

ab9rf.bsky.social•1 day ago

i agree that federal charges do not mandatorily preempt state charges, but i also expect the Administration to attempt to force MN to drop/defer state charges while they conduct a sham federal prosecution that ends in a pardon, then attempt to use that as an excuse to block further state charges

cathostage.bsky.social•1 day ago

I suspect that MN is not in the mood to be strong-armed by this DOJ, particularly since the feds taking the lead in this case would be far outside the norm.

ab9rf.bsky.social•1 day ago

we are already "far outside the norm" at this point, so expecting further behavior to be "outside the norm" is reasonable

cathostage.bsky.social•1 day ago

We are, yes. And the federal regime will likely behave outside the norm in this situation as they do in all situations. But MN doesn't have to defer to that, and the standard practice is that the lesser federal charges are pursued only after the state case.

ab9rf.bsky.social•1 day ago

ultimately it's going to come down to whether trump and his cronies want to spend political capital to protect this guy. my guess is not: he's not that wealthy and he has no meaningful influence. but they spent it on rittenhouse, so who knows...

wallydad.bsky.social•1 day ago

Ala George Floyd’s murderer.

bluedotinaredspace.bsky.social•1 day ago

That we can no longer trust our Federal law enforcement agencies to be unbiased and not working towards a predetermined narrative or outcome is indeed terrifying.

darthburkie.bsky.social•1 day ago

Can’t trust the feds

ca-nc-galady.bsky.social•1 day ago

This is good because, as has been mentioned, 🍊🧀🐡 will just pardon him and then give him a freaking medal.

slick-50.bsky.social•1 day ago

Bondi is completely untrustworthy

alli-ward.bsky.social•1 day ago

As if the horror of this isn’t great enough without adding to it our knowledge that we can’t trust the U.S. Department of Justice.

Minnesota unequivocally should get to go first.

dreadedbouncer.bsky.social•1 day ago

GJ will prolly find 1st degree murder is appropriate charge right?

ellsammie.bsky.social•1 day ago

But why would they pardon a Marxist? /s

bterrier71.bsky.social•1 day ago

Especially since Trump will pardon him on the federal charges

ab9rf.bsky.social•1 day ago

the whole strategy is bring federal charges, bully MN into suspending state charges, conduct a sham trial, pardon, and then argue that the federal trial creates double jeopardy. at the far end, supreme court abolishes dual sovereignty doctrine and bars MN from trying him on state charges

gacyclist.bsky.social•1 day ago

Chauvin was convicted state and fed.

ab9rf.bsky.social•1 day ago

not saying otherwise. all this hinges on the dual sovereignty doctrine, which does not have reliably solid support on the court. the last time it came up, in 2019, there were two dissents to keeping it, one from the left one from the right

ab9rf.bsky.social•1 day ago

i totally think MN should try him under state law without regard to what the feds do, but i also expect the feds to do everything they can to interfere with his trial

dwjohnson.bsky.social•1 day ago

Recall Derek Chauvin.

nationalsecuritylaw.org•1 day ago

I imagine the scope of the federal investigation will carefully scrutinize every mention of a progressive cause or person in his browser history and issue several press releases about the disturbing evidence they found that he once donated to an animal shelter where a democrat worked.

dagies.bsky.social•1 day ago

truth, it will be a different picture than we'd get with a state prosecution

miguel-sittkus.bsky.social•1 day ago

Don't let dictator trump get his ugly mits on this crime.

scottferatu.bsky.social•1 day ago

The fact that this entered conversation is so fucked up

tj505-2.bsky.social•1 day ago

I was hoping that wouldn't happen

ohmsparty.bsky.social•1 day ago

Yep. We don't need another Rittenhouse.

susieqoualum.bsky.social•1 day ago

State charges! @governorwalz.mn.gov @schiff.senate.gov

lucchat.bsky.social•1 day ago

Never thought we’d need to even think about a murderer being pardoned by a felon president.

kaphka.bsky.social•1 day ago

Is there any way that the DOJ could somehow blow the state case, assuming they decide that they want to? Maybe conceding on a constitutional issue?

onecommonsensemom.bsky.social•1 day ago

🎯🎯🎯

swisscheese.bsky.social•1 day ago

I can’t believe we are even discussing pardons. This is nuts

mt1072.bsky.social•1 day ago

This is where we are in this country. Truly stunning and disturbing.

terencecanada.bsky.social•1 day ago

The pardon business, unique to the US, is a can of worms. It creates more problems than it solves, esp. with tyrants like Trump, and it should be done away with.

gacyclist.bsky.social•1 day ago

Federal pardons should be determined by committee. clearly trump is abusing pardon power.

bryanfichter.bsky.social•1 day ago

If the accused is convicted on federal charges I see a presidential pardon in his future

grobielauren.bsky.social•1 day ago

Charges about to be upgraded in 3, 2, 1....
https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c4gdeeqv724o

catsforpeace2.bsky.social•1 day ago

As a Minnesotan I agree 100%.

dreamchaser4ever.bsky.social•1 day ago

Agree!

pamsohan.bsky.social•1 day ago

Trump will pardon him if there are federal charges and probably give him a medal

used2balawyer.bsky.social•1 day ago

And you can’t rely on the US attorney there, appointed by the FASCIST-IN-CHIEF, not to tank the proceedings and violate criminal procedure laws to prevent later prosecution in state court.

used2balawyer.bsky.social•1 day ago

I agree.

lezbreal87.bsky.social•1 day ago

State should convict because Trump can’t pardon a state conviction, at least thats what I understand.

retiredwhitelady.bsky.social•1 day ago

Well murder isn't a federal crime, so don't see how state DOESN'T get involved. Seems like federal crimes are usually charged when state doesn't get a conviction.

bselena.bsky.social•1 day ago

Absolutely- if guilty make certain Trump cannot pardon him

chewy2152.bsky.social•1 day ago

I agree, Minnesota if first in line with the State charges

onerottencore.bsky.social•1 day ago

Derek Chauvin situation is directly on point

greysky209.bsky.social•1 day ago

State should go first and fast. Chump will give this nutter a pardon if he coughs up the going rate.

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