One of the things I find…hm, I don’t know about all of this is how many people will respond to this with things like “corporations should provide better insurance for…” And we shouldn’t have to be stuck with an employer if we don’t want one. - ThreadSky

courtneymilan.com • 80 days ago

One of the things I find…hm, I don’t know about all of this is how many people will respond to this with things like “corporations should provide better insurance for…”

And we shouldn’t have to be stuck with an employer if we don’t want one.

Reposted from Courtney Milan

Next year we (2 people) will pay $12,461.28 for health "insurance," and this amount means my insurer will pay for the bare legal minimum of preventive care; anything else we need we will pay out of pocket, until I have paid an additional $8000 for me or $16,000 for the family.

Comments

sarag29.bsky.social•80 days ago

It was so fun for us to discover after paying basically my salary for family insurance coverage that once our oldest two aged out of our coverage our family insurance plan only dropped by like $60. Very cool system we’ve got here.

thelongshot2112.bsky.social•80 days ago

We shouldn't be at the whims of our employer as to whether or not we get decent insurance.

kimmstew.bsky.social•80 days ago

It’s absolutely nuts. And utterly barbaric

bearku.bsky.social•80 days ago

Untether health insurance from employment! It gives life-or-death power to employers.

rosesarehappy.com•80 days ago

Health insurance is one of the reasons hubs closed shop. It was no longer financially feasible.

haemishm.bsky.social•80 days ago

Back in the days when this sort of kind of made sense, it was when corporations provided things like good pension benefits & employees were expected to work their whole lives in one place. Corps washed their hands of all responsibility for employees long ago, & now most people move jobs constantly.

haemishm.bsky.social•80 days ago

The gig economy is just the evolution of corpos washing their hands of that responsibility. Workers are expected to be temporary & expendable (yet somehow loyal). The public sector should have stepped in long ago like they did for retirement benefits, but the insurance industry has prevented that.

courtneymilan.com•80 days ago

You should be able to be self-employed. You should be able to quit your job if it sucks without worrying about if you’ll be able to keep your doctor.

We should have single payer.

courtneymilan.com•80 days ago

You should be able to have excellent health care even if you work for a smaller business. If you decide to reduce your hours for whatever reason (child care, elder care, mental health) you shouldn’t lose health care.

courtneymilan.com•80 days ago

If you get laid off in a recession, you shouldn’t have to put all your money to trying to patch through COBRA, as you discover that oh shit that IS the actual cost of health insurance.

forfrodo.bsky.social•80 days ago

Not only is it the cost of the insurance itself but also the deductible, copays and even then having to pay 20-30% of procedures. It is stifling. Medical debt is awful.

courtneymilan.com•80 days ago

If you get so sick that you can’t work anymore, you should have health insurance. If you are disabled, you should have health insurance. If you need a break and you save up so you can have six months off, you should have health insurance.

courtneymilan.com•80 days ago

This is your reminder that we are ALREADY paying more in taxes, per capita, than most other nations.

This does not count private health insurance. Our PUBLIC TAX BURDEN for health care is higher.

malibukitty.bsky.social•79 days ago

work in out-patient physical therapy. Private insurance companies haven’t increased our pay us per service in over 20 years.Not just my clinic, all the small businesses. There’s nothing we can do about it except not take insurance. charge patients out of pocket. I don’t wanna just treat the rich

courtneymilan.com•80 days ago

Source:

https://www.statista.com/statistics/283221/per-capita-health-expenditure-by-country/

kedwards.bsky.social•79 days ago

I did the math awhile back and figured out that if universal healthcare raised my taxes 3%, I’d still save $10k/yr. This was when Warren was proposing universal lite with a .3% increase.

shablopligh.bsky.social•80 days ago

“US spends most on health care but has worst health outcomes among high-income countries, new report finds” 2023 https://www.cnn.com/2023/01/31/health/us-health-care-spending-global-perspective/index.html

barbscalgary.bsky.social•80 days ago

Just saw this chart. It's pretty telling.

scribblingninja.bsky.social•80 days ago

There’s a video somewhere comparing what patients pay in the US vs what the same procedure costs the NHS and the differences are disgusting.

lindaholmes.bsky.social•80 days ago

I think we don’t talk enough about how employers (especially the worst ones) have a huge incentive to be against any kind of insurance reform, because the current system is a potent weapon to interfere with people’s free choice about quitting their jobs.

lindaholmes.bsky.social•80 days ago

Like, imagine how it would rebalance the power of employers and workers if people could actually just think about whether they’re being treated well enough to stay.

sjgochenour.bsky.social•80 days ago

This is the thing I worry about — I have okay health insurance through my job, but my job is dependent on me staying able-bodied and certain issues not going downhill. There’s an in-between stage where I’m not yet fully disabled but I can’t get a new job with insurance as good.

sparkywolf.bsky.social•80 days ago

Health insurance makes up a huge percentage of school system and local govt budgets! Money that could go to funding better schools and local programs gets spent on insurance instead.

sparkywolf.bsky.social•80 days ago

In the rural areas of my state, it's not uncommon for one spouse to work for the school system and spend their entire paycheck on insurance for the family (health and other policies) so the other spouse can run a small business (often farming).

countmystars.bsky.social•79 days ago

My COBRA in 2012 was $600/month. $600! I don’t think I would have had half the financial difficulties I’ve had since then if I hadn’t had to pay that.

wendolen.bsky.social•79 days ago

My husband's COBRA this year to cover both of us is $1600/month. 🫠

kingdomfantasy6.bsky.social•79 days ago

https://youtu.be/-wpHszfnJns?si=VlXzva8J97e4SGUT
This thread is 100% right, and I have nothing to add aside from this humorous yet accurate take on health insurance that my adhd was reminded of.

Incidentally because the guy had to learn about Cobra and all that.

kellysinclair.bsky.social•79 days ago

💯

syzara.bsky.social•80 days ago

let's be real; you also should have excellent health care if you can't work for whatever reason

courtneymilan.com•80 days ago

YES

atticus59914029.bsky.social•80 days ago

I’ve long argued this should be the case for single payer that could - could - result in a bipartisan approach.

It’s a freedom approach. You can move jobs, choose to stay home, or start a business without fear of losing health insurance. Who wouldn’t want that?

legalminimum.bsky.social•80 days ago

The answer to that includes the US Chamber of Commerce. Take it from someone who has attempted to hold them to their “pro small business” rhetoric: they do not care about small business.

leonenglish.bsky.social•80 days ago

100%. Single payer would be a huge boon to small biz by allowing them to offer more competitive compensation without the economies of scale that afford big companies and easier time offering healthcare coverage. But for that same reason it would be bad for big companies...

leonenglish.bsky.social•80 days ago

...not to mention all of the companies in the massive healthcare industry who are also being represented by the Chamber.

mrose.ink•80 days ago

I’ve had some interesting conversations with “normie” Republican staffers over the years (yes, they do still exist) about this, and EVEN THEY can get behind single payer as an act of simplifying the administrative state.

wowbaggert.bsky.social•80 days ago

I believe this, and yet these people have somehow let the most extreme fascist demographic of their party slowly but steadily take command of their party, starting with Reagan and Gingrich. So what are we to conclude about them all?

mrose.ink•80 days ago

I mean, much like the left, it contains multitudes; there’s a huge amount of internal discontent with the current direction and leadership. Some folks want to hold on and outlive the current moment, and they’re in policy fields where that’s possible. Not passing judgment on it, just describing it.

mrose.ink•80 days ago

The rationale is generally: Liquidate most benefit programs, pay people the equivalent in lump sum cash as UBI, deduct some of that for single payer health care, send people on their way. Knocks out an enormous amount of bureaucracy and everyone comes out better.

mrose.ink•80 days ago

The debates are obviously over what programs remain, conversion rates from benefits into cash, fending off second-level fuckery, etc, but the core idea has solid bipartisan appeal.

emilybreunig.bsky.social•79 days ago

Living in Sweden for even 15 months drove this home for me.

deelaundry.bsky.social•79 days ago

You should be able to work part-time, if that's what is best for you, and still have healthcare.

You should be able to focus on your health instead of figuring out how multiple overlapping complicated bureaucracies work in order not to go bankrupt.

green-blanket.bsky.social•80 days ago

I have cancer. I am fortunate to have actually good coverage, but I was job searching before my diagnosis and now I am stuck at a dead-end job because it allows me to stay alive. I know I have it comparably good, but it is still frustrating to feel stuck on so many levels.

finnanhaddie.bsky.social•80 days ago

Same thing happened to me: cancer diagnosis just as the company I worked for was sold. I halved my postsurgical leave time to make sure I’d keep my job during the layoffs. Later they tried to screw me over taking time off for chemo infusions but backed down when I quoted the ADA at the HR flunky

green-blanket.bsky.social•80 days ago

My job has been incredibly accommodating. Truly fortunate. I just wish my insurance wasn’t tied to a job where I will never get a promotion and have to scramble for grant funding to cover my team. I hope you continue on a path of new-normal health.

finnanhaddie.bsky.social•80 days ago

Thanks! I eventually got laid off when that company was sold again but this was 20 years ago & I’m doing well, hope you get to say the same in 20 years

packingsmacky.bsky.social•79 days ago

Just THINK of how many people could start businesses if they didn't have to rely on an employer for health insurance. If we're going to bow own to business owners, as the GOP seems to think we should, then this seems like a slam dunk. But I'm a dirty liberal so wdik.

courtneymilan.com•79 days ago

Job creation is great unless you’re doing it for yourself.

silkyweineck.bsky.social•80 days ago

A decent public option would probably do (the hybrid system works somewhat ok in Germany and the single payer works somewhat not ok in the UK now)

jise.bsky.social•80 days ago

Public option not working in the UK is mostly about money.. And they are spending less than half of what US is currently spending, so doubling that per capita spending _probably_ would easily make a well functioning system.

silkyweineck.bsky.social•80 days ago

Oh absolutely it's about money -- it worked fine when the otherwise shitty Tony Blair poured sufficient resources into it. But that's the problem with single payer -- too much at the whims of government shifts.

jise.bsky.social•80 days ago

I don't think that there is actually that much difference between the systems, Germany and UK have similar amount of Private money going into healthcare, the difference is that Germany spends 1.5x what UK does on the public side.

So its more about choices made by the Gov, not about systems.

silkyweineck.bsky.social•80 days ago

isn't that what I said? that's why I'd prefer an established system less immediately subject to political shifts

9carol3.bsky.social•80 days ago

This is just wrong. 🖖🏻

gayerthanthou.bsky.social•80 days ago

I once casually opined to some family members that a for-profit healthcare system has an inherent conflict of interest that will never be resolved in favor of the patient and that, in any case, insurance is a dumb way to handle ordinary healthcare expenses.

gayerthanthou.bsky.social•80 days ago

And that is how I discovered my formerly favorite cousin is a raging right-winger.

emily-today.bsky.social•80 days ago

Privatized insurance is just rent-seeking all the way down. Handouts to insurance companies, to the big healthcare systems in league with them, and indirectly to the politicians guarding the set-up.

feralrobots.bsky.social•80 days ago

There's a fantastic speech on this in the early chapters of Jack London's _Iron Heel_ - TL;DR, but corporations use the lives of our loved ones as leverage to make us toe the line.

edfphotos.bsky.social•79 days ago

I have a chronic illness so we literally have to budget in January and February to plan to pay off our out-of-pocket max basically immediately. (And don't even get me started about my law school insurance.) While I appreciate getting no bills at all for the last 9 months of the year, it is a pain!

bwinter.bsky.social•80 days ago

Technically by percentage of income you're probably paying less than you would in Poland (9%), but then that includes zero co-pays, zero time wrangling prior authorization or bills, and prescription meds have negotiated prices. I needed a PET scan, I waited all of 3 days.

courtneymilan.com•80 days ago

No, I’m not. I’m already paying 2.9% of my income in taxes for insurance. Then add this, plus all the other costs.

bwinter.bsky.social•80 days ago

One thing I'm glad of is that there is enough recent Polish emigration to the US that occasional ideas to privatise our healthcare on a US model get no traction. It really is designed to stress the user as much as possible.

cubiclegrrl.bsky.social•79 days ago

I pulled out one of my U.S. paycheques after paying my first round of income taxes after moving to Canada. The amount deducted for my HMO brought the % I was taking home down to post-tax Canadian levels. But, like you say, I walk into the hospital/clinic and I get treated and that's the end of it.

bwinter.bsky.social•80 days ago

Okay the public option dental sucks, but a filling costs $100, I can deal.

rosesarehappy.com•80 days ago

Our dental coverage is nothing to brag about. And because it's so abysmal, many go south of the border for procedures that are a fraction of the cost from here.

raymistake.bsky.social•80 days ago

Well I just did the math and my health insurance plus copay for this year totaled up is 12% of my income, if you don't count what my employer pays to cover costs. If you do, then it would be 17% of my income... yes, I'm in the USA. 🥲

bwinter.bsky.social•80 days ago

And that's not factoring in the cost of time and stress.

flowstateneworleans.com•80 days ago

Oh, but I heard from my 5th cousin in Canada that if you get a cold and need to see a doctor in Calgary, they’ll make you wait until you’re dead from cancer first!

wolfjade.bsky.social•80 days ago

I have employer health insurance, but I just had to pay $340 oop for an office visit! No tests were done. And we’re in the health insurance industry (not a carrier, so don’t hate me 😅). If even employers in the industry don’t provide good insurance, what’s even the point? Give us universal now.

danielsand.bsky.social•80 days ago

“Corporations should provide…..” also HEAVILY favors gigantic corporations who can afford to negotiate.

How will a three person mom and pop have any leverage in an insurance situation?

So folks like me who desperately need good healthcare services are stuck with giant corporations.

michelecp.bsky.social•80 days ago

We need Medicare for all but we won't get it anytime soon.

jcaseydo.bsky.social•80 days ago

Also, I run a small business and my employee insurance is, if anything, more than big corporations can negotiate. My staff deserves good coverage and gets it, but someday we’re going to get priced out of that.

maryanndimand.bsky.social•79 days ago

It's more like a Christmas club run by a scammer, isn't it?

dmesh420.bsky.social•80 days ago

#MedicareForAll saves money and lives

lesterbut.bsky.social•80 days ago

M4A or a public option

saraenkay.bsky.social•79 days ago

This! for the love of humanity, thiiiiiiissssss #pursuitofhappiness

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