So @stevevladeck.bsky.social’s write up of the FedSoc ambush upon him is well worth reading. He’s more temperate about it than I would have been. /1 www.stevevladeck.com/p/109-things... - ThreadSky

kenwhite.bsky.social • 107 days ago

So @stevevladeck.bsky.social’s write up of the FedSoc ambush upon him is well worth reading. He’s more temperate about it than I would have been.

/1

https://www.stevevladeck.com/p/109-things-fall-apart

Comments

dfs4114.bsky.social•107 days ago

Would yours have started off with "These motherfuckers..."?

mr-ceebs.bsky.social•107 days ago

surely you don't expect anything that restrained

j4years.bsky.social•107 days ago

He still gets an accurately piquant footnote in at times

sniffit.bsky.social•107 days ago

Jones has been a kkkristofascist kkklown from the get go and nobody should be at all fooled about that. FedSoc and its KKKlergy are nothing but Southern Strategy and part of the plan to obtain permanent kkkristofascist MINORITY rule.

lenbanco.bsky.social•107 days ago

I watched the entire video. It was an ambush performed by a biased, misinformed judge. Why was she even there??

kaiserbrown.bsky.social•107 days ago

She has in her hand a list of 205 names belonging to the Communist Party.

lauraapollo.bsky.social•107 days ago

"If we’re just going to be props, then it seems like we should pass."

Definitely pass.

Also, 97-year-old Federal Circuit Judge Pauline Newman? 😳

She refused to cooperate with an investigation into her fitness after staff raised concerns about her mental health??

princessjemmy.bsky.social•107 days ago

That was easily the most disturbing part of it all. There should be judicial term limits. For ALL judges.

lauraapollo.bsky.social•107 days ago

At least a set retirement age, below 90. 🤦‍♀️

tennesseegreg.bsky.social•106 days ago

You and me both. Hilarious that she thinks what a law professor said about a federal judge, is the reason the judge, who oversees many cases with many litigants, had death threats against him. Yes the general public is really tied to a law professor's forum shopping critiques. Cue the pitchforks!

kenwhite.bsky.social•107 days ago

/2 I appreciate that Steve directly confronts an important question — is there value in engaging “the other side,” and if so, what is it? — directly, neither rejecting it nor taking it as a given. I think that’s the right approach. I’m suspicious of people certain of the answer.

boboinparadise.bsky.social•107 days ago

As an amateur historian, I have found that folks mostly behave as expected to.

rogerailes.bsky.social•107 days ago

There is no substantive value in engaging the other side when, as in Steve's case, or as in the case of Free Press v. Radley Balko, one side controls or demands to control the terms of engagement. It's like arbitrating your case before an arbitrator on your opponent's payroll.

404apathy.bsky.social•107 days ago

It seems to me each encounter needs to be taken on its own merits and dealt with according to its assessed value.

kenwhite.bsky.social•107 days ago

/3 Whatever I might say about FedSoc as an institution, the membership is varied, and my sense is many of them are embarrassed by the petulant and entitled display by Judges Jones and Ho, who did far more damage to the legitimacy of the system than critics of the system.

boboinparadise.bsky.social•107 days ago

Looking back, the retirement by the youthful, spritely 77 year old Judge Trump is more notable than it seemed to many observers then.

hollylecraw.bsky.social•107 days ago

Anyone in FedSoc who's embarrassed by anything at this point needs to work to clean their own house.

bobgenghiskhan.bsky.social•107 days ago

Even despite the great perks of membership, you are allowed to resign your membership when your beliefs and those of the organization fall into disharmony. All they'll do is keep emailing you every now and then and occasionally hit you up for money. Unless they've changed policy since 2002.

hollylecraw.bsky.social•106 days ago

The house is FedSoc. Don't just leave. Speak up.

"You're allowed to leave": this is so low it's not even a bar.

bobgenghiskhan.bsky.social•106 days ago

I wish I had, but I just peaced out when it became plain that they had no issues with torturing people, that their idea of impermissable restrictions on liberty mainly involved paying taxes.

pat4cats.bsky.social•107 days ago

It’s doesn’t matter if they are embarrassed if they aren’t willing to do anything about it.

tawnikondo.bsky.social•107 days ago

Sounds like Senate Republicans (now of yore).

kenwhite.bsky.social•107 days ago

/4 I think it’s important to remember that judges are human, that being a judge (particularly an appellate judge) can be isolating, and that judges can become grumpy cranks as surely as anyone else can. Ideally a system accounts for that and puts checks and balances into place.

boboinparadise.bsky.social•107 days ago

Yukyuk

rickehling.bsky.social•107 days ago

“Ideally”…there’s the rub.

snoozebuttonben.bsky.social•107 days ago

Pretty clear that the only reason he was invited in the first place was for Jones to put a hit on him.

ianbratlie.bsky.social•107 days ago

I will say I've had interesting experiences in front of federalist Trump judges. Some I've been impressed by, they knew the law and the record, were pretty neutral, kept up on the case. Others, not so much.

ianbratlie.bsky.social•107 days ago

Without putting too much analysis into this, I think the one thing that is more likely true than not is that federalist judges are less likely to learn areas of law that they didn't already know. I'm not sure it's laziness so much as confidence that they are already the smartest person in the room.

ravenonthill.bsky.social•107 days ago

This was a dress rehearsal for a show trial. Eventually it won't be a Federalist Society panel; it will be an actual panel of judges with the authority to penalize the person who appears before them by scripted charges.

myndmaven.bsky.social•107 days ago

Despite not being a lawyer, pretty sure even I could shoot a thousand holes in Shanmugam's eye-rolling opening statement in a debate. The idea that the Conservatives haven't been twisting the law to match their predetermined political outcomes is absurd on the surface. "It's all just coincidence" 🙄

ellawbr.bsky.social•107 days ago

One problem with judges is that they aren't used to direct criticism. Everyone tells them they're right, everyone laughs at their jokes, everyone tells them they're important, ect. Not healthy.

various-threnodies.bsky.social•107 days ago

I was astonished to find out that one of the hills these folks are dying on is that a 97-year-old justice should still be hearing cases. I can't believe that anybody that old is still actively serving as a judge!

musicincolor.bsky.social•107 days ago

https://www.propublica.org/article/ruling-on-murder-case-by-judge-suffering-from-dementia-will-stand-court-says

musicincolor.bsky.social•107 days ago

There was a couple of cases where a judge apparently was in serious cognitive decline (early dementia) in NYS, thus the now official age requirement of maximum 70 yrs old then the judges have to get recertification every 2 yrs…

lauraapollo.bsky.social•107 days ago

She refused to cooperate with an investigation into her fitness after staff raised concerns about her mental health.
🚨

nerdylawyer.bsky.social•107 days ago

Newman is legendary in the patent community, particularly as a "great dissenter" (she's viewed it as her duty to get the opposing side on the record). So there's a natural reluctance to tell her to leave, plus skepticism of the accusations of medical issues (not a doctor so I can't comment on that).

various-threnodies.bsky.social•107 days ago

Appreciate the context. It seems like we need age limits for judges if you can be 97 and still actively working. That just boggles the mind.

jig.bsky.social•107 days ago

it's actually NOT about her age. she's refused to disclose a debilitating medical event, her clerk has pled the 5th when asked who is writing her opinions, and her performance in completing her current work is orders of magnitude worse than her peers' AND her own metrics prior to the medical event.

jig.bsky.social•107 days ago

she is absolutely correct that age by itself isn't disqualifying. the issue is that she's refusing to recognize that she's failing because she is no longer able to meet the physical and mental demands of the job (which, among other things, require work be completed in a reasonable time).

auntfritz.bsky.social•107 days ago

I can't believe that anyone that old *wants* to still serve. Like, get a life, you don't have much time left.

petetoemmes.bsky.social•107 days ago

Well...if only RBG had thought like that before her (predictable) passing... Full discloser: I was/am a fan of RBG, but the "hanging on" seems to not be just with Justices/Judges of one "assigned ideology".

xelkelvos.bsky.social•107 days ago

That is their life.

tfuller3.bsky.social•107 days ago

Why more-so for appellate judges?

kenwhite.bsky.social•107 days ago

Trial judges have more interaction with lawyers, witnesses, parties, etc. Appellate judges have a more insular practice that’s also more based on a paper record. More of being in a black box.

tfuller3.bsky.social•107 days ago

You’re saying they’re the “well actually” nerds with no friends?

cliodunn.bsky.social•107 days ago

📌

squorch.com•107 days ago

Are they voicing their feelings?

If not, they may as well not exist

And we’re back to deplatforming

kovarsky.bsky.social•107 days ago

I'm going to do a longer thread on this, but you're correct in identifying two very different levels of discourse. One with the principals and then one with the future clerks/judges/movement lawyers in the audience.

kovarsky.bsky.social•107 days ago

IMHO at least.

bwsnorth.bsky.social•107 days ago

Good Faith, is so important in all areas of life.
Smart folks that value Good Faith are the best folks.

theprestige.bsky.social•107 days ago

Judges are human AND have politics. The idea that they're "independent" of their ideology is just silly at best. This is why the judiciary must be checked in our system. But it's hard to do that when the legal profession itself implies it's above politics when it so clearly is not.

riskymanag3ment.bsky.social•107 days ago

Sometimes I think damaging the system is part of the plan.

neuroid99.bsky.social•107 days ago

As a unhumble internet troll sans law degree, it sounds to me like Fedsoc know they've won, and are going to enjoy torturing the people dumb enough (in their minds, with apologies to @stevevladeck.bsky.social) to engage with them in good faith. How long until they move to censure him professionally?

irateoverlord.bsky.social•107 days ago

Judge Jones be like

cliodunn.bsky.social•107 days ago

📌

cliodunn.bsky.social•107 days ago

Judges should remember they are fiddling with respect for both the law and their profession.

cliodunn.bsky.social•107 days ago

. @jamesfloveiv.bsky.social
This is good.

apolloseyes.bsky.social•107 days ago

Feels like we have to assume that the the ideological curse is set and whatever human the GOP movment used to be is now wholly vampiric. I for one refuse to get bit.

rexipsaloquitur.bsky.social•107 days ago

I would pay to see you participate in such an event.

ander517.bsky.social•107 days ago

This GIF is great https://substackcdn.com/image/fetch/f_auto,q_auto:good,fl_progressive:steep/https%3A%2F%2Fsubstack-post-media.s3.amazonaws.com%2Fpublic%2Fimages%2Fb66a2c96-6495-48e0-964e-c5c05fdde4e2_498x281.gif

uhjustin.bsky.social•107 days ago

Based on how poorly Jones came across to external observers, it seems to me that the entire exercise was not one meant for external observers. Rather, it seemed to be a pep rally aimed internally as the FedSoc project is leading to worsening public perception of the judiciary. A compounding problem.

wender16.bsky.social•107 days ago

📌

mktsutherland.bsky.social•107 days ago

📌

chocolatetarte.bsky.social•107 days ago

that was a pretty amazing read.

geezwillthiswork.bsky.social•107 days ago

Just wow.

corpkiller.bsky.social•107 days ago

The Federalist Society invited me to be on one of their panels once. Here is what I told them:

doctorvulpes.bsky.social•105 days ago

I am shamelessly and blatantly going to steal this response from you the next time I'm asked to serve on an advisory panel for a pharmaceutical company trying to bolster some cred behind a new product they are pushing.

corpkiller.bsky.social•105 days ago

Ha ha. Our communications director was a little *disappointed* in me for sending that but it was worth it.😆

billyo516.bsky.social•106 days ago

Not all heroes wear capes.

inspectacles.bsky.social•107 days ago

In part III.3, about chilling speech; how should that be distinguished from the 'preferred first speaker' concept that you usually lambast?

mmderp.bsky.social•107 days ago

Your "intemperance" is why I follow you and not Steve.

kenwhite.bsky.social•107 days ago

I submit that’s a mistake. Steve knows his subjects exceptionally well. And his judgment calls are well within the realm of reason, even when I disagree.

mmderp.bsky.social•107 days ago

Sure but I don't care much about the Inside Baseball of law. I see you as clever snark with a side of law. Sorry 😱

kenwhite.bsky.social•107 days ago

Well it’s true Steve is not your man for content relating to taints and the snorting thereof

rschneide.bsky.social•107 days ago

A quality review!

talos-xliv.bsky.social•107 days ago

I've always thoroughly enjoyed following/reading both of you, which is why I'm delighted to be able to follow/read you both again regularly here on Bluesky.

You do, however, have an edge when it comes to personal storytelling. (Not everyone almost gets raised by a gas station attendant😉)

jasper33.bsky.social•107 days ago

I require taint coverage in my legal analysis. I ask for so little.

mmderp.bsky.social•107 days ago

ps THANK YOU for all the years of "content".

margobuckingham.bsky.social•107 days ago

He is talented at IMPLIED irritation. You do better with outright snark.

munson.land•107 days ago

Reading that the FedSoc pays conservatives but not the people asked to be their interlocutory chew toys really does give away the game on how serious they are about "principled debate"

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