When somebody introduces themselves into a situation, entirely exposed, where other people have to take full responsibility for their welfare because they are unprotected, people get angry at the imposition. UK roads are largely too narrow for multiple speeds of travel.
What about the ‘culture war’ between cyclist and pedestrians? For my own safty i often walk with an umbrella in London, it’s very useful when a bike comes against you at high speed on the pavement 😊
I'll say it again....this is still a problem of too many cars.
That street has been made one-way: to calm traffic; reduce congestion; coz the road is too narrow for two cars side-by-side; increase safety for pedestrians crossing it.
Whatever the reason, it's been done specifically because of cars!
Not quite - a cyclist is quite capable of causing injury and death (the Richmond park case I think from memory) and the Ubereats lime bike riders are a downright menace.
Paul you are literally having to cite 1 death of a cyclist from 18mnths ago (&he fell off his own bike) because there are so few incidents, &then state working riders are a menace, but haven't even given evidence for that.
It’s genuinely terrifying. We were cycling to Sainsbury’s at the w/end and a woman (also going to Sainsbury’s), edged into the curb in her giant SUV to stop us passing on the inside of stationary traffic. I don’t get it 🤷🏼♀️
Is it worth killing someone to stop them getting to the apples before you?
Capitalism innit.. no profit in cycling.
Loads of profit on cars.. and fuel.. and parking... and drive thru (sic) takeaway coffee and out of town shopping Malls
I mean, I take your point (and I'm both a driver and a cyclist). But the situation is not equally weighted. It sometimes feels like roads are entirely designed for cars, and every time I cycle my life is put at risk by the behaviour of some driver. Every single time.
Just go on YT and take a look at any of a large range of videos that show cyclists, not just jumping but actively ignoring Red lights, going through crossings with people on them, riding on the pavement, the wrong way, no lights I could go on but space doesn't permit
Or go to the news to take a look at any of a large range of stories showing drivers killing people, causing major damage to buildings and infrastructure and ruining the lives of the families of all involved.
There's a reason only 1 of these things is on the news, & the other is on YT.
The only person quoted is a bike lobbyist who suggests we need 'fewer cars'. That thinking leads to lane amputations for empty bike lanes. Fewer lanes lead to more congestion. But bikes are useless for so many transportation tasks & miserable in bad weather. Urban planners pit drivers v bikes.
I don't own a car or bike so no bias here. To say no cyclists want this culture war shows an utter lack of research. A quick glance online will show you several anti car accounts as well as people like cyclingmikey. On the flip side there are loads of anti bike accounts. So it comes from both sides
The difficulty for us is that cars are literally killing machines, lorries more so. The lack of infrastructure giving independent cycle routes that are not attached without barriers to roads (and in fact, just serving to make the roads slimmer) is the initial problem here. Anger is result.
Don't disagree. Just commenting on an omission in the article. Our road layout is pre bicycle (I live in London).(Correct) efforts to create cycle lanes often impinge on road space. This immediately causes conflict on both sides. Doesn't help at all. Not sure how you square that circle.
I always come back to what happened in Amsterdam in the 1970's: Medieval city with whacky London-esque road system; protests over cycling deaths; whole city updated road system in a very short time, & fault laws, to the extent that cyclists are now basically safe. What did they actually *do*?
They don't "impinge" on road space. You have nudged into bias here by presuming that the roads are predominantly the domain of the motorised vehicles and how dare the cyclists expect to have some of that space. The "conflict" you mention is the same as the white male "privilege distress" (cont)
or "equity backlash" - it's a reaction against the efforts of a minority to level the playing field... usually played out as being unfair to those who previously held the advantage (the car drivers). Road layouts aren't "pre-bicycle" - they are "pre-car" - (cont)
the road network in London predates cars by centuries - being accurate, they were designed primarily for horse drawn traffic and pedestrians. Cars have been *prioritised* which is different and wholly unfair.
"how dare the cyclists expect to have some of that space." - where did I say that? I tried to be concise in limited word space and you have put words in my mouth. I'm checking out of this conversation now. As I say I am a pedestrian. I neither drive or cycle. I have no favour of either side.
I think I may have missed how you're used the "(correct)" - did you mean that you think the installation of the cycle lanes is a correct one? I read the sentence as it being an impingement on the space for others and that causes conflict - (cont)
The only thing that cyclingmikey does is shine a light on dangerous drivers who are breaking the law. He isn't the problem, he's just exposing what the problem is.
Tbf bike people have every reason to be anti car. One 'argument on the road' and the bike won't be able to go home that same day. Bikes already dont have much going in terms of urban planning that forces buildings further and further away that inconvenient everyone else but those with cars.
It's a 'culture war'? Really? The Guardian's favourite strategy for high handedly dismissing genuine conflicts of interest. Bad, lazy journalism. You can do better than this Zoe.
The problem is bigger than just a war between cyclists and car drivers. We are all set up to fight with each other over absolutely everything what we find "different" in the others, from following football teams, supporting different political parties to religions.
I happily pay for the guardian because it has been a shining light in a grim media landscape and unparalleled in its commitment to reporting on climate catastrophe. The words culture wars just triggered me.
I was just mouthing off. I meant the journalist wasting space on culture wars. It's what the right do all the time to distract from their agenda to give tax cuts to the wealthy and empower billionaires.
I didn't read it. The headline pissed me off. Yes above affects me. I drive an electric vehicle and ride a bike. But at this point who gives an f about culture wars. There are real things to worry about.
there are plenty of cyclists who try to kill themselves by undertaking/overtaking a signalling car, riding too close to vehicles, riding the wrong way down a road...
My experience is that those cyclists have been somewhat radicalised by being physically endangered by dangerous drivers. Trying to do the civic-minded thing and meeting with poor infrastructure & aggressive car users does tend to provoke a response.
Yeah that's fair. I am not a cyclist myself but can totally appreciate the fear in central London. Do you think drivers actively want to harm cyclists though?
There does seem to be an us against them mentality on both sides, which can only be a bad thing.
Comments
That street has been made one-way: to calm traffic; reduce congestion; coz the road is too narrow for two cars side-by-side; increase safety for pedestrians crossing it.
Whatever the reason, it's been done specifically because of cars!
What a waste of time.
Drivers kill an average of 5 ppl a day.
Every 17mins someone is injured.
Obviously cars are far more dangerous but what you said was simply incorrect whatever the figures are.
Is it worth killing someone to stop them getting to the apples before you?
Thank you for pointing out my horrendous error 😂
Loads of profit on cars.. and fuel.. and parking... and drive thru (sic) takeaway coffee and out of town shopping Malls
There's a reason only 1 of these things is on the news, & the other is on YT.
https://paleofuture.com/blog/2013/7/22/the-invention-of-jaywalking-was-a-massive-shaming-campaign
Because it’s a revenue earner.
Assholes drive cars.
Assholes ride bikes.
However, when I've been driving a car I've never felt like a cyclist was trying to kill me, but not vice versa.
There does seem to be an us against them mentality on both sides, which can only be a bad thing.