All those arguments are valid and they exist, though this entirely says all the different "kinds" of sexual phenotypes above are the result of deficits/defects. So the original argument that XX is female and XY is male still holds true? The meme suggests that the above is very common, though.
Yes. Xx and xy are the norm. But the point is that biological sex isn't binary, it's bimodal, exceptions exist. Most people exist at either a or b, but plenty don't. Trans people are 1% and lie in between the 2 since their brains are different. Trans femme people have a section missing that cismen
this is the kind of thing that would instantly shut down any of these dumbfucks who pull "the tranz" out of their fucking asses all the time. so tired of hearing self-assured losers spit at everyone about how right they are lol
There are at least 18 genetic variations on the theme of chromesomes, which, incidentally have no specific role in dgneder determination beyond that actual genes of which they are comprised. And this says nothing what ever about how a person might "feel" in terms of their innate gender
I notice that the vast majority of people who complain about genders are typically aggressively uneducated, and those who accept it are often highly-decorated academics or specialists in their field. I’m siding with the experts
What's wild to me is I learned this back in 10th grade in a goddamn deep south Arkansas biology class. Like this isn't new at ALL, these fucks just either got failed by the education system or they are just lazy hateful shits
I knew someone with Kleinfelter Syndrome where the male characteristics were far less developed than the female ones, even looked and sounded more like a woman than a man. Something that most transphobes don't even know exist.
Kleinfelter can be really interesting like that. I'm XXY, and characteristic wise I have a pretty even split, although slightly more masculine leaning.
Transphobes don't know a lot exists. I'm intersex and you'd NEVER know. Only found out from a random asf dna test I took back in high school. He couldn't tell me (Something something big trouble) but I knew something was up and did the same test again in college biology. Interesting times.
If reality doesn't align with their beliefs then obviously reality is wrong and can be ignored. All of the variations that can occur naturally are fake news and thus not worth any consideration.
I have had to explain to people that the basic in basic doesn't mean "Indisputable fact" but rather a basis for understanding. It is meant to introduce the topic, and be the basis for learning.
I respect the sentiment, but biological essentialism is bunk. A trans person shouldn't need a combination of genes to be seen as valid any more than a cis one.
As a molecular geneticist and a trans person this hits the mark.
For example: no one has any idea how many downstream targets there are for sex hormone. It’s still biology and it plays a role in sex or gender, so who knows?
"Unfortunately leftist, my argument that there's only two sexes holds up, just so long as you don't bring up the many, many exceptions. So pretty please stop bringing them up or I will cry."
Could apply this logic for why trans people are using extremely rare cases to justify why they exist over just existing. If you're natural no reason to explain it anyways. All of the listed things are medical defects.. trans people aren't a medical defect so not the same .
1:500 men are born with an additional sex chromosome. Then only 1:10000 of these men will actually develop or show symptoms that they have a mutation. That's completely different from a man deciding he wants to be a woman, and demands to be treated like one. Can't prove a delusion.
At least they knew the basics. Listen the word mutations is here to describe the abnormalities of humans around the world. That is why I love the human body it messes up badly and still makes it work somehow
in general people who are XX and XY are usually assigned and socialized female and male from birth; intersex people are a very small percentage of the population
Hi! I identify as a very small percentage of the population. My height, sex assigned at birth, and a single fact about my eyes makes me less than 1 in 200,000, which is an order of magnitude less common than CAIS.
My point is people act like rare things never happen. And then states do silly things like constructing legal definitions of sex that define people with CAIS as men, because they apply some biological definition where it’s inappropriate.
None of us want to give the government gamete samples.
I have no idea what you're talking about now. It's not silly because people with obvious hermaphroditic sex conditions are generally assigned one or the other at birth, and until recently they needed to be effectively castrated at birth in order to have a hole to urinate out of.
My state is considering two laws that would legally define people with CAIS—who are universally assigned female at birth and unlikely to even be diagnosed as male until puberty—as men.
Only one of them would even offer a partial exception for intersex people.
It’s 2025 and people still don’t understand the concept of gender, sexuality, and sex all being different things. Also unless you’re a biology nerd you’re probably unaware that not even every cell in your body share the same sex chromosomes and that your sex is mostly just hormones.
I only know some really basic stuff. But I'm deadass sure we had an XYY calico cat. "She" had an awful lot of male features in a calico format. The vet looked at her chart and said she agreed with me. It was before all the at home pet DNA tests, though. 💕 you Bung. You were an excellent little cat.
The worst part of that error is that is studied this stuff in school, thinking I'd go into genetics for a little bit. I mean, my science teachers and profeasors were like "Why are you a music major?" So I've done them all proud.
Hmm. This is a great question. Never thought of these differences visually before. I presume different spectrums are composed of different trends. So A might be true of one data set, but C might be true of another. My presumption is that C is correct for biological sex. Happy to be taught otherwise!
The point you make about different traits or measurements is a good one. This is not meant to be a real scientific graphic, just a way of thinking about it.
thats a disorder tho, its not a good thing and a person with swyer syndrome is INFERTILE due to testicles or overies being A GOD DAMN USELESS SCAR TISSUE, people with swyer syndrome suffer many many many issues, thats not a reverse uno card to pull out for transphobes
that makes you a no better tho, you deal with realisation you're using a disorder for your own worthless gains in a culture war that makes no god damn sense, so you can feel better than people you dont like
They are still people that exist and MAGA needs to be able to account for them. They will NOT get a free pass from me. No matter how much you virtue signal for them
MAGA insists there are only men and women, but the Swyer syndrome ALONE proves that is wrong. I don't give a shit if you do not like it
I saw a Catholic commentator, who has a point of view but is not stupid, saying that he's never found good answers to problems raised by queer theorists, and admitting that 'XX means woman' is circular: first you decided who was a woman, and then noticed the XX among the people you'd already picked.
The chromosome argument is very dumb because, unless you get a test, you have no idea what your chromosomes are and you sure as hell don't know other people's
moreover, the prevalence of 'intersex' is about 1 in 500 while the number of kids transitioning was recently calculated to be 1 in 1000 in america so obviously they arent directly related or we would see at least double
I am almost certain that my chromosomes are XY. The chance they are not XY is negligible. I don't know with 100% certainty, but 99.99% is good enough and nothing is 100% certain. We need to accept uncertainty. Otherwise, life would be unbearable.
They’ve done brain scans on trans people and their cerebral structure is identical to that of their identified gender. Also not all your cells have the same sex chromosomes and gender is mostly decided by hormones anyway both in gestation and puberty. Tbh the Y chromosome may not be a sex chromosome
I may have misspoke/misremembered, I can’t find exactly what I’m looking for. It was almost a decade ago when I read it before this was a national conversation so it may be out of date. What I’m seeing now is there are similarities but their cerebral topology may be completely different from either
Nature and pub med have tons of articles about it. I am having trouble finding the pre transition data. I read it in like 2016 and the thing about the chromosomes was like in 2022 but I think it was a pbs short or something. I do know one factor are residual cells from your mother
They chose parents who invited Palestinian terrorists to use their home as a base to attack Israel. They chose poorly. The Ham-Ass terrorist pigs can still choose to surrender unconditionally. Until then, swine are slaughtered.
Being scientists, they do that through IRBs, peer review, tenure, professional society capture, and the like. It's another form of using power to stifle dissent.
There isn't a single societal issue, economic problem, policy idea, or even fucking video game that people can have an adult conversation about; without some RWNJ coming out of the woodwork to make it all about immigrants or LGBTQ, scream "I hate you!", and pretend they're noble martyrs or something
My original reply was to a cartoon featuring trans activists beating a gender-critical person, which is not artificially making an issue be about TQ people. (Conflating LGB with TQ was done by trans activists to leverage the live-and-let-live attitude towards gay people.)
So they are just supposed to accept the hate and violence from dipshits like you and not fight back? Got it. How about you leave them alone and they will leave you alone, you goddamn child.
That's actually a really good analogy, because languages typically start out with just light and dark, and gain more nuanced ways to talk about color over time.
They always try to smooth out all sex differences into 2, but tell them "guns kill people" and they'll do a forensic deconstruction on a per incident basis 🤡
What gets me is when they think height or wearing jewelry is a sex difference. Like dude, I know plenty of cisgender guys shorter than 5ft5 and I've also met a dozen cisgender women who are above 6ft. I've met several who were even taller than 6ft4 in thin ass sandals.
I met several women back in my hometown and the surrounding area who were TALL asf. Couple times, I thought "this lady's wearing high heels" because I didn't even come up to her shoulders. I looked down and nope! Thin sandals. 2 of said ladies were 6ft5, if not 6 ft6. Dutch heritage shows.
THIS ^. Legit had a bigot come up to me and tell me I couldn't possibly be a man. Her reasoning? I like to wear necklaces. That was it. That was the ONLY thing she had. Like lady, men have been wearing jewelry for millennia. Gold cufflinks anyone?
It’s like explaining that ‘gravity is the force that make stuff fall’ and later explaining that gravity is actually a force of attraction that all large objects inflict on smaller objects. It doesn’t make stuff ‘fall’, it attracts them to bigger objects.
Well yeah, in everyday life however, when we talk about something "falling" it's not incorrect to say that it's due to gravity. Therefore I don't understand the idea of making fun of people who explain things in a superficial way. It doesn't necessarily make them arrogant.
If we’re talking about funding NASA for space exploration, and people with overly simplified understanding of gravity argue that we shouldn’t fund Mars exploration because gravity will make Mars fall towards us anyway, we have a problem.
And no, it is, at least in most cases not wrong to explain things simple. It becomes a problem when the simple minded fail to see the whole complex topic, denying any further debate on a topic because ~they~ don't know shit about it and refuse to learn.
1, it's "nearly" correct. 2. It's what people thought as we were exploring genetics, though we now know the sry gene can turn it off and on, regardless of X or Y chromosome. 3. Explaining gene expression and hormones and hormone reception, etc ... is hard a x complicated.
It's perfectly reasonable to expect people to /not/ go around trying to demand other people alter their lives because of a bad understanding of simplistic explanations of science. It's perfectly reasonable to be unhappy with the idiots who do so, anyway.
Well, Republicans are trying to decide what medical care trans people are allowed to have. They're trying to decide who gets to play sports. None of this shit was a problem until they pretended it was. Now they want to alter trans people's lives. So ... that.
It's called lies for children. You can't start complex, and for subjects taught in school dividing between male and female was enough.
There is also the problem of people thinking in absolute truths. For example: I learned this, so it must be true, while missing that science doesn't work that way.
Again. I can't speak for America, but in Australia we still discussed swyer syndrome and other intersex disorders and discussed how that changes biology. This was late Hugh school. Like grad 10 and then came back in the final exams. So they do a good job over here
I once read a blog post by a guy with dual PhDs in the biology, and genetics of gender expression. He explained in great detail why the "gender binary" was nonsense, scientifically. Scientists don't often contend that there are 8.2 billion genders only because it's not experimentally useful to do so
Yes. Found that out in college. There's some thing where you can have the Y-chromosome and thus show up as XY but still have female characteristics. Forgot what's it called though. Biology may be simple on the ground level, but once you start digging it gets WEIRD. All sorts of stuff.
Comments
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straw_man
Gender is a simple binary, except when it isn't, which means it's not a simple binary.
for french speakers, a great summary
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OE-ONN6eVgs&list=PLuM_FOFR0-2Ttioy4G6C62FjbLZfwRryX&index=25
For example: no one has any idea how many downstream targets there are for sex hormone. It’s still biology and it plays a role in sex or gender, so who knows?
That’s just one example.
Ugh
Analog is pretty much a spectrum by definition....
Seems simple to me.
Note that I'm not saying he was right, just that he said it.
Sex is biology. Gender is a social construct. Bringing these into the conversation at all is just ceding ground to the transphobes.
Staying on the right side of that distinction is essential.
How about be whoever you want, but if you want to be an annoying idiot and use the wrong bathroom, accept the consequences of being who you are.
-Laughing at people while ganging up on them and beating them up is the ideal way to express disagreement.
None of us want to give the government gamete samples.
Not inappropriate.
Only one of them would even offer a partial exception for intersex people.
That’s why it’s silly.
Because I clearly exist.
What's sadder is they dismiss the very concept of advanced biology, afterward.
A "MAN" giving birth!?!?!
And it IS a reverse Uno card and I just played it. Deal with it.
MAGA insists there are only men and women, but the Swyer syndrome ALONE proves that is wrong. I don't give a shit if you do not like it
https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC8955456/
congrats on being the worst thumb alive
I think you maybe looking at this meme wrong
Science - a famously simple subject.
From an enemy's rhetoric to a discipline too complicated to discuss easily.
That's how they think, when they actively are thinking.
--anti-trans logic
😍
… you are supposed to either learn the more complex stuff, or to understand that you only learned the basics, ergo the ‘simplified’ version.
It’s true in a majority of cases.
It’s like explaining that ‘gravity is the force that make stuff fall’ and later explaining that gravity is actually a force of attraction that all large objects inflict on smaller objects. It doesn’t make stuff ‘fall’, it attracts them to bigger objects.
Same with the trans debate.
There is also the problem of people thinking in absolute truths. For example: I learned this, so it must be true, while missing that science doesn't work that way.
It's just a stepping stone to get them interested. Also i can't speak for America, but it definitely wasn't that dumbed down in Australia