Opinions on “out of hours” emails? I work strange hrs (blame the Long Covid) & send emails out of hours, not expecting replies. Our department head just asked us not to do this as it causes some people stress. Horrified to think I have been unintentionally stressing people out. Thoughts please 🙏
Comments
9pm emails from students asking for help with homework, HODs expecting responses etc etc.
Actually my record for scheduling an email is a year in advance!
9:17 AM
9:32 AM
9:58 AM
10:07 AM
However, I don't feel it's fair to expect you to have to consider how others might be glued to their screen or somehow pressurised into a response when that's not your fault!
It is on your department head to give support and backing to all staff to ignore anything outside of their own working hours. Unless everyone works exactly the same 'core hours'
Those working flexibly are more likely to be ill, disabled, parents, or otherwise having a protected characteristic under employment law.
Yet HoD is now actively stressing those employees out by asking them to perform emotional labour on behalf of those who
Whatever time is agreed on as 'acceptable' for e-mails to start arriving will then become highly stressful for everyone, as a huge pile of emails arrives
This is a failure of management, not you!
It lets everyone know "My hours are weird, don't stress about this."
Alternatively, see if you can schedule e-mails, so they go out at 0800 or something.
“I sometimes send e-mails outside of normal working hours. In no way do I expect, or encourage, others to do the same.”
(I know it *can* be done, but not how. Sorry. My knowledge is wide ranging but 1 micron deep.)
I remember when I learned to “right click” using a mouse, I felt like a dope that it never occurred to but that right-clicking “was a thing!” 😄 (a loooong time ago!)
There are always new things to learn about computers/programs/protocols etc. … never ending!
I never respond to OOHs texts or e-mails. If the business can't survive that, too bad.
“out-of-hours” emails can wait for “in-hours”.
But also scheduling exists in most email services these days.
Sending or […]
Maybe I’m old school but I tend to think of email as mail, sent electronically, to be picked up and read at a time convenient to the recipient. Anything urgent, we have the phone, WhatsApp, Signal, etc. And I don’t have work email on my phone.
I added something like: "Due to family commitments, I work unusual hours. Please don't feel the need to respond outside your own normal working hours."
That is their boundary to set.
If your dept. head can't wrap their head around that, use the timed sending function to auto-send the emails first thing in the morning or whatever.
But I also think companies should make their employees feel and BE safe. So I both don't mind this rule AND wish you didn't have to mind the rule
I open my work laptop by 7 sharp, might miss something in the late afternoon with a half-hour - 2 hour delay depending on how busy I am (and how complicated the query is) but after 5, nope!
Haven't been "on call" in decades.
Quite a few people put a line on their emails stating that they send emails during their working hours and do not expect or want anyone to answer outside of theirs. Might be an idea?
If you're not expecting replies than scheduling them all to hit at 7am or whenever should work.
And while we're here - a huge wave to you and Raul from Edinburgh 🤗 Lovely to re-connect on the BlueSky!
Of all the things that create stress in people’s lives, I’d put “not answering email by return” a long way down the list, well below “management edicts adding to the complexity of life.”
Established + agreed this with my supervisors early on and let them know I was not expecting responses outside of their own hours.
Discussion with supervisors on this early on in PhD so we’re all on same page and no expectation to ‘reply now’ unless it’s indicated as urgent. Seems to work well for us.
I had to teach my employer that I do that, though.
If you get just a few precious nights of time on a massive telescope, then you want to be on hand in case there's an issue to make any quick decisions about e.g. changing target.
Of course this wouldn't apply to something like the JWST, right?
the mere fact that we can be sending across multiple timezones into future or past should make their existence outside rules of workinghoursetiquette indisputable imo
Calls could be anytime for 5am through to 10pm, though usually centered on core hours for the most important team members.
So I never worried about it
https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/office/delay-or-schedule-sending-email-messages-in-outlook-026af69f-c287-490a-a72f-6c65793744ba#PickTab=Classic_Outlook
You've got "astronomer" in your handle, so I'd expect you to work weird hours even without Covid.
Texting, no, but email, sure.
early-time-zone person finds a problem, emails it,
late-time-zone person gets it at starting time, works on it, replies,
early gets the reply when they start, tests it or sends more detail,
late gets that when they arrive, does stuff.
India even more so
Most people declare 'you don't need to answer, I'm just clearing my inbox' but (especially if combined with any status) it creates an anxiety to reply.
It's good etiquette (and very easy) to schedule a delayed send.
I first had a work related email account around 1998/99 which ended when I left in 2001.
I could access work related emails only on the pc on my desk.
Yes wfh was just starting back then and a few of my colleagues did so.
My thinking is, perhaps, the problem sits […]
It takes self-discipline to not look at or read email after hours, especially if it causes them stress. That's on them, not you.
When I remember I try to use the advice I was given - say at the top any expectations. I'll use that first line to say "when you are next in the office" or "next week" or "just for info" or whatever is appropriate.
This is easy to do in gmail and ensures they arrive during the normal work day and appear at the top of the inbox as people arrive to work.
I also ask my lab members to do this for me. People really like this system.
"I work flexibly and am sending this email at a time that suits me. I’m not expecting any response outside your own working hours."
I use this feature in Slack, too, and I appreciate it when I see others do it as well.
It lets those emergency after-hours comms stand out, too.
As a researcher - Collaborators are in many timezones so I reply at a time convenient to me and trust they manage notifications.
Especially since students tend to be local and colleagues tend to be all over the map!
But seriously, I used to think this requests to send emails were a bit too much.
Until I worked with someone who would message me on Friday night asking to see some plots and say “enjoy your weekend, reply when you can”
[…]
The stress was so high it was affecting my physical health.
What I’ve been told was that “weekends are for me to rest so I am at peak productivity again on Monday”…
Ahhhh academiaaaa always so full of nice people to work with!
:)
I think it’s a matter of how it is communicated.
Junior people can tell when the “answer in your own time” is said just to tick the box of acceptable behaviour and when is a genuine thing.
I think it’s a good philosophy, especially when people have different work patterns or work in different time zones.
I also previously worked with someone who would send an email, then follow up with a text to tell me to check my email, regardless of the time. Fun times.
PS - not only do you not have to reply, I might prefer if you didn’t so that neither of us has any more inbox pings today.”
(At least for internal things when you know everyone is on Outlook)
"Note: No expectation to respond outside your business hours." to my signature. Mind you, I've been living in Japan and the US for 10 years, communicating with people from both (plus the UK), plus astronomers work late, sometimes...!
But perhaps it's not just receiving emails that's the issue (?) Are some people sending emails with an expectation that they'll be actioned immediately?
You have mail
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Not texting people out of hours, fine, that's different
(though I wish I could send no-notification texts.)
and don't know that you're there well after 5pm,
and think returning to an office helps productivity.
No emails from you then?
Blimey, it's a minefield..
They should show some leadership & announce a policy for email *replies*.
BTW I’m a librarian who regularly gets email reference queries at ungodly hours & I have no issues w/ waiting.
But the realist says that we *do* expect people to check email at least daily. I should probably use the "send later" feature more often.
But if the department head is saying this, then they are setting a professional norm and it's probably best to go along with it.