Watching all the fringe Twitter lefties all-but-openly cheer Trump’s abandonment of Ukraine is a good reminder that these people pretty much need to be taken behind the shed if there’s any chance of progressives or liberals ever being relevant again
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I don't know what fringe Twitter lefties you're following, but I've seen very little of that, if any.
Tankies tend to be the loudest assholes in the room, but they're not worth giving oxygen. They thrive on arguments and attention from the rest of the left-of-center ecosystem.
I know the people you are referring to. I see far more inaccurate accusations about them, including this post, than I see them doing the things accused of them
I've seen no one on the left praising Trump’s right-wing policies. Question the values & credibility of anyone claiming a left identity & posting celebrations of Republican policies on Musk’s nazi cesspool app. Also, please take a look at your own horseshoe theory confirmation bias.
You are delusional and ignorant. Red-brown mainstream left was a problem Ukrainians told you about since 2014,not to mention 2022. They are literally a majority in terms of influencers, control of orgs (see most of DSA, DSA IC) and broad left support.
This. lol There are bots that pose as leftists to 1. Make them look bad. 2. Try to turn them far right 3. Conquer and divide. And people keep falling for it.
I've been seeing what I call Chomsky Cognitive Dissonance, wherein someone's politics begin and end with "America bad. Adversaries to America good." Very much struggle with America suddenly being buddy buddy with Russia.
I'm happy some are defending Ukraine finally, others are just mask off tho.
The problem with your statement is that it is not based on fact. One unintended outcome of the current events has been unity. Leftist and far-right separations are not working anymore.
Divided by party, by design, the people have no power. United, a revolution against billionaires is happening.
The far left is just as bad as the far right, shouldn’t forget about that even if they mask their bloodthirstiness under the guise of justice and equality
putin infiltrated extreme right & left of many countries w/moles & active agents.. master of asymmetrical warfare.. & ex-kgb senior executive: knows his stuff.. extreme right: easy target w/low IQ & level of education & lack of critical thinking.. for extreme left, dates back to soviet times...
Fringe Leftist and known Tankie Keir Starmer is working with French Tankie Marcon to advance the Tankie position that Ukraine should stop fighting and surrender land lost for a cease-fire.
Must have blocked these deplorables because even the few marxist academics I follow are sad about Ukraine being abandoned. Like seriously who are they so I can preemptively block them 🤦🏼♀️
So by that logic, as long as MAGA exists, we can find no common ground with traditional conservatives? They’re all just…to be ignored, due to their proximity? Cuz that’s a bunch of bullshit, right there. Big ShitLib here, BTW.
I’m not cheering anything but if liberals ever want to be relevant again vis-a-vis foreign policy I am certain that it will involve doing fascist disappearances of some leftist agitators online and not any kind of reconciliation with the trail of millions of dead bodies it is responsible for 👍
Most far leftists seem to not care about this issue at all and have thoroughly tuned out of politics. Definitely not cheering. The ones you are seeing on Twitter may in fact be working from an office in Saint Petersburg.
A lot of these folks either can't or won't be reasoned with. You are looking at a group that genuinely believes that "America bad, therefore Russia good".
It's either bad faith trolling or delusion. Either way, dealing with them means ignoring them and ensuring they have no power.
One thing threads like this prove, just how completely in denial the left is about their own history. It's like what counts as the left is rebooted every year and every prominent figure and position taken from before that point cease to exist
I’m not on the site formerly known as Twitter any longer, but frankly have no idea what “fringe lefties” you are talking about who support abandoning Ukraine. Come with receipts please. Otherwise it looks like you’ve been interacting with paid trolls.
given that a not insignificant amount of US GDP is defense contractors and aerospace firms building the missiles and vehicles getting sent there, it seems additionally idiotic to announce that you're cutting them off when implementing tariffs and other measures all but certain to induce recession
As a leftist, I've never seen a group worse at gaining electoral political power than American leftists. Just inept at every turn. Somehow, despite organizing being a key part of leftism, they are AWFUL at organizing.
But Asov, will. Asov proved every man, woman and especially the children are nazis. Also some weird hatred of Victoria Nyland. It has NOTHING to do with hating their moms don’t say they are mad.
Lots of people in this thread saying they don’t know what you’re talking about even though they have likes and reposts of the exact people you’re talking about.
They are NOT Lefties. They are plutofascists who quote Marx to justify the genocides of Putinism and Xiism. They only pretend to care about Gaza, while gleefully celebrating Assadism's genocide of Syrians. They are scum, pure and simple.
These people are figments of the social media algorithm. Demolishing the platforms is necessary for a lot of reasons and once it happens their entire ‘movement’ will cease to exist.
Dude. There are *maybe* several thousand of those people in the US, out of the entire Left. They might be loud and annoying but I don’t think they’re the problem here lol
Personally I want Ukraine to win but I’m far more concerned as an American with our current state of affairs. I work for a company that makes sensors used for tracking climate change and my wife is a case manager nurse for a rehab clinic funded by grants. IDC about Ukraine when our house is on fire🤷🏻♂️
If you cannot stand up for those who need your help because of your own narrow focus on yourself, then you are no better than an animal and you should be treated with contempt
Really dude? You can care about more than one thing at a time, and Ukraine being attacked by the same people in a foreign country who Trump is buddy buddy with shows how closely this is all connected.
This is a two birds one stone situation though. Because our government is now aligned with Russia, protesting for Ukraine is also protesting against our government.
I don’t disagree at all. I don’t think Ukraine is a non issue but it’s not particularly important to my life given the chaos at home. I’m far more concerned with my marginalized friends here and the fascist take over. We need to fix our own house before we worry about Europe.
It’s the same fascist takeover. It’s not a separate movement. Again, two birds one stone. So if you protest for “our house”, you are automatically protesting for Europe.
Yeah if Ukraine falls to Russia or not has no bearing on my rent, heating or grocery bill. I support Ukraine but care way less about them than I do Americans sleep walking into fascism. Why should I care about Ukraine when my livelihood is at stake here?
ukraine is another symptom of the same disease. it would be silly to ask you to prioritize ukraine over your own life and liberty - but it would also be silly not to pay attention to those other symptoms in order to understand where the disease's progression currently is
I agree but right now my “life and liberty” comes first. I understand the global repercussions but do I care about Ukraine more than my rent and stability? Nope.
oh for sure. neither do I. I'm trans, trump admin wants me dead. coincidentally azov was running pogroms on gay and trans people before the war started. so my sympathy for ukraine has always been rather muted because I understand the importance of them standing, but I also didn't forget who they are
Buddy it's gonna have a lot of bearing on a lot more than your grocery bill if Ukraine falls to Russian takeover, they recruit all the fighting age men into their army at gunpoint, and march onward to assault the rest of Europe and start WWIII because they can't let go of their imperialist fantasies
We’ve been in WWIII for a couple decades now. What do you think the “war on terror” post 9/11 has been? The dismantling of our already insufficient social safety net is my main concern. I’m not going to worry about Ukraine when my house is in fire.
It’s sad that the horrors on the right cause people to ignore the failures of the left, and vice versa. No matter how bad it gets, we keep manufacturing excuses for people to polarize themselves, while effectively doing nothing about either.
I'm an anarchist, and I support Ukraine. I don't see a point though in punching left. Most of those tankies are captured by blatant propaganda like the grey zone. They are not representative of the "far left".
They don't need more visibility from Will because they already have more visibility than him. Even offline they torment ukrainians on campuses, they organize marches under russian flags, they are superspreaders of disinformation and propaganda on all levels. I've seen that for the past 3 years.
Are you on glue? The left, liberals and all decent humans are fully supportive of Ukraine; and Trump is aligned with Putin. What are you talking about???
I think a lot of them are bots or Russians. I ran i to 2 today, one mistranslated Kool aid as spiked fruity drink while he was saying that the dems were at fault for Trump.
There are strong liberal arguments - both moral and practical - for supporting Ukraine. Anyone who claims liberal values and denies those priorities is at best simple.
I don’t know if I have this correct but I interpreted “fringe” to imply that Will believes willingness to abandon Ukraine is abnormal behavior relative to a larger group of non-fringe twitter leftists.
I am a leftist who cares about ukranian lives for the same reason i care about palestinian lives. Russia speaks about ukranians the same way israel talks about palestinians: they don’t exist, their nationhood is fake, they are all terrorists, etc.
Then you're not the leftist that they're talking about. You don't need to go #notallleftists when it should be painfully clear that NO leftists should be supporting Trump or Putin
I don't watch CNN, but I know enough Russians to know that killing gay and trans people and anyone who opposes the regime does not align with leftist views about human rights and self-determination. Sure, there are self-proclaimed leftists like Joe Rogan who hate women and minorities, but fuck them
Based on recent polling 28% of dems think we shouldn't provide military aid to Ukraine. These people exist in relatively large numbers. Sticking your head in the sand doesn't help.
The thing is that Stencil never give names when he throws this generalization. Single out those people is much more productive that write his boilerplate post.
I won't argue with terrible that, because I don't know this guy and it's my first time seeing his name. Twitter leftists does describe a particular group to me and it's not AOC or Bernie or indigenous people fighting for their survival. It's the same demographic that are horny for Elon
Except that this isn't a thing that can be done. You can't make them shut up. You can't make the mainstream stop associating them with Democrats. We have to learn to deal with this problem, not fantasize about being rid of it.
They’re very few in number and if we all agree they’re a pathetic clown show they’ll stop mattering. They derive influence from the way so many progressives are determined to see no enemies to the left
He does fall afoul of that sometimes, but not here. You can comment on bad behavior - just don't QT or otherwise direct attention to the person seeking attention.
I’m not on much social media so idk who these people are but if they are not in support of Ukraine- F em. They must be pretty small group? Can I find a clique of them on Reddit? Guess I can look myself 🙄
He's intrinsically linked with stop the war coalition and o lying a cursory glance at their position on the Russian war in Ukraine shows you that they primarily have Russia's interests at heart (e.g. opposed to sending arms to Ukraine to defend itself)
Unfortunately it's group like that that do just as much damage as the right wing nutters in charge of the US (and UK for a while). It stifles any robust response to dictators through being either naievely or maliciously "pro peace" (no coincidence it mimics trump's approach)
“fringe Twitter lefties”
coming from the clown who failed to win some local Democrat primary. People like you are hated by both sides and for good reason.
It makes sense if you are not hiding under the rock from reality. Left is notorious for supporting authoritarian regimes if they are anti-us in nature. They are also notorious for not supporting US-aligned countries no matter what. Same goes for right-wingers. The only difference is economic stence.
Well, I *am* a centrist. If you looked at a diagram if the Overton Window, you'd find me about a half-inch to the left of the dot in the center of it. I'm making no argument about the moral standing of either side, I'm just pointing out that the closer you get to the ends of the spectrum,
I'm no longer reading twitter, but last time I was there were a set of "lefties" who were rather blatant Russian troll accounts, and another that cheered anything if it was bad for the US. We need those voices separated from the US left, IMO, before deciding to take the US left "behind the shed"
That’s the idea of the shed. making fringe western commies/lefties who have a weird allegiance to China and a non-existent USSR a part of the out group.
There are Russians and Russian bots on here trying to sow division on the left. I ran into 2 today, so I think a lot of the more aggressively virtue flaggers may be Russian
I don't know how to convince them. If they don't care about Ukrainian lives, and I struggle to believe they care about American lives, I don't know what bargaining chip we have.
They value their clean conscience and ideological purity over any kind of pragmatic progress.
I think a lot of leftism frames itself in opposition to institutional power (See: Horseshoes); if they accept or align with institutional power, they become part of the problem.
Saying Biden was good on renewable energy is to condone genocide in Palestine, maybe.
A lot of leftism frames itself around its core values, which is more important than anything else. Biden was indeed good on renewable energy, but his promotion of genocide of the Palestinians is far more important because of the harm it does. Israel got everything it wanted, Ukraine got by on scraps
It should be noted I did vote for Harris, but the entire frame of this election we had was an insane and painful choice. Both Trump and Biden were supporters of Israel's genocidal campaign of the Palestinian people. Harris had a chance to differentiate herself and didn't do enough. So it came to...
Choosing between someone who will continue supporting the Israelis and generally not hurt us at home, or someone who will continue to support Israel and do tons of harm at home. It is a painful choice for a lot of people, and because of that I do not blame them for not wantng to vote period.
Joe Biden restored foreign aid to Palestine and Yemen, repealed Trump's sanctions on the ICC, withheld shipments of 2,000lb bombs to Israel, built a fucking sea pier to get supplies into Gaza, and negotiated a ceasefire with Hamas.
With respect, voting for that shouldn't have been painful.
Who are you and Max even talking about? This is a sincere question. I haven't witnessed anyone advocating for any position of your or Will's description.
I haven’t seen any recently tbh (blockity block block) but they’re definitely out there.
There seems to be one flavor that is “all US military action or deployment of US weapons is always unconditionally bad” and another that simply likes Putin/authoritarians.
Having said all of THAT (my other two replies) anything happening on Twitter, whether it claims to hail from the left or the right, has a very decent chance of being either or both of
1) a bot-farm Russian psy op
2) a MusKKK psy-op
So 🤷♂️
What really needs to go out the airlock is Twitter itself
Having purged #1 from my feed I’m not going to go looking for them but I assure you they’re there. I even met a few IRL. They are very young, in every way.
As for #2, I’m very sorry to be the one to break it to you but authoritarian leftists are definitely a thing. You ever heard of “tankies”?
I am a leftist who cares about ukranian lives for the same reason i care about palestinian lives. Russia speaks about ukranians the same way israel talks about palestinians: they don’t exist, their nationhood is fake, they are all terrorists, etc.
Then I'm begging you to help us drag less like minded horses to water, because a lot of the leftists I've interacted with see anything a lib supports as being worth opposing.
"Scratch a liberal and a fascist bleeds," and as a liberal it fucking hurts me to abandon Ukraine and discuss invading Gaza.
Maybe I've just run into a long, nearly unbroken string of assholes, I'm willing to consider that, but a lot of leftists (seem to) refuse to listen to liberals for virtue of the fact that we're liberals.
I dont like it because im as left as they come and havent seen it. Im saying this as someone who was banned from the Ukraine subreddit for pointing out nazi tattoos and badges in Ukraine war footage videos and pictures.
Ukraine has the same right to oppose occupation that palestine has.
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Tankies tend to be the loudest assholes in the room, but they're not worth giving oxygen. They thrive on arguments and attention from the rest of the left-of-center ecosystem.
https://international.dsausa.org/statements/no-war-with-russia/
Ukraine has a neonazi problem, but theyre no longer the primary force opposing putins invasion, if they ever were.
https://x.com/Pinko69420/status/1895843517316153594
Because the left has been calling for Trump's blood for weeks.
I'm happy some are defending Ukraine finally, others are just mask off tho.
Divided by party, by design, the people have no power. United, a revolution against billionaires is happening.
just like trump is no Christian and the GOP is not a party with family values... Even though they say they are ..
PADME: And then build something better, right?
LEFTISTS: ...
PADME: And then build something better, right?
US shitlibs are convinced they have some sort of moral compass, it's just amazing.
"Guests should not beat their hosts"
shortly before giving both the Tartars and the Germans a very hard time ?
https://vvattsupwiththat.blogspot.com/2025/02/climate-of-war-three-years-downstream.html
https://bsky.app/profile/nytimes.com/post/3ljfqwqp7gk2u
It's either bad faith trolling or delusion. Either way, dealing with them means ignoring them and ensuring they have no power.
Asov, but Asov.
If you cannot stand up for those who need your help because of your own narrow focus on yourself, then you are no better than an animal and you should be treated with contempt
If Putin is not firmly resisted and stopped, the world will be a world of hurt.
The world economy will be shit, politics will be shit, and our military will be fighting Russians.
We will never be "with" Russia
In local politics these guys ostracize themselves. They can't build coalition and paint themselves into ideological corners.
It's just negativity bias at work. Most "far leftists" aren't that loud.
There are strong liberal arguments - both moral and practical - for supporting Ukraine. Anyone who claims liberal values and denies those priorities is at best simple.
https://bsky.app/profile/whstancil.bsky.social/post/3ljes6k3e7s2a
if you stopped shadowboxing the left online you might free up the time to learn something about Ukraine that wasn’t handed to you by a CNN anchor
That's why they're called "fringe" ...
You just insist on amplifying them :-)
The first rule of the internet is to not respond to trolling.
My feed constantly has neo Nazis content from twitter because Will likes to screen cap it and post it here for engagement.
If I wanted that, I would just use that site.
Not sure this requires any futher action, and Will has a right to vent — but no meaningful insight here that I find.
He's intrinsically linked with stop the war coalition and o lying a cursory glance at their position on the Russian war in Ukraine shows you that they primarily have Russia's interests at heart (e.g. opposed to sending arms to Ukraine to defend itself)
coming from the clown who failed to win some local Democrat primary. People like you are hated by both sides and for good reason.
They value their clean conscience and ideological purity over any kind of pragmatic progress.
Many are just Arab supremacists
Of course antisemitic people exist but that's not who we're talking about here.
A lot of these folks see voting as complicity in a corrupt system, and so in their mind abstaining from voting is a moral act.
Except that's not how any of this works.
Saying Biden was good on renewable energy is to condone genocide in Palestine, maybe.
Fuckin' Tankies.
With respect, voting for that shouldn't have been painful.
And in the present context that makes them enablers of fascism and the useful idiots of a Nazi regime.
There seems to be one flavor that is “all US military action or deployment of US weapons is always unconditionally bad” and another that simply likes Putin/authoritarians.
2. By definition, that second group isn't on the left. In fact, authoritarians, including Putin, are on the right... You know that, right?
Another example of "everything I don't like I call 'left'"
1) a bot-farm Russian psy op
2) a MusKKK psy-op
So 🤷♂️
What really needs to go out the airlock is Twitter itself
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nolan_Chart#/media/File%3ANolan_chart_normal.svg
As for #2, I’m very sorry to be the one to break it to you but authoritarian leftists are definitely a thing. You ever heard of “tankies”?
"Scratch a liberal and a fascist bleeds," and as a liberal it fucking hurts me to abandon Ukraine and discuss invading Gaza.
We need allies that leftists will listen to.
Ukraine has the same right to oppose occupation that palestine has.
But also Romani and Muslims had to worry about them too.
This article does a pretty good overview of the org. I would say, as i have said, i support the right of Ukraine to oppose occupation and invasion. I dont support nazi orgs, even "reformed" ones.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.cnn.com/cnn/2022/03/29/europe/ukraine-azov-movement-far-right-intl-cmd