The issue isn’t that online dating apps suck, it’s that all of the loud voices giving advice to angry young men are giving advice that doesn’t help them, and almost certainly actively hurts them, but keeps them listening to the people giving bad advice. It’s a digital media problem. - ThreadSky

cooperlund.online • 56 days ago

The issue isn’t that online dating apps suck, it’s that all of the loud voices giving advice to angry young men are giving advice that doesn’t help them, and almost certainly actively hurts them, but keeps them listening to the people giving bad advice. It’s a digital media problem.

Reposted from Sharon ♨️🇨🇦

has anyone attempted deradicalizing young men by producing a dating app that doesn't suck

Comments

urbfuturistdem.bsky.social•54 days ago

The latter may be a bigger issue, but surely the former is pretty big all on its own. A precondition, even.

bostonjerry.bsky.social•54 days ago

Another example of The Power of Propaganda

artificialmcb.bsky.social•54 days ago

Young men ask all the time how to meet women & I tell them go out & do structured activities, prioritize building friendships, & you’ll likely find someone who shares your interests & values. They look at me like I’ve got 3 heads.

adjectivalnoun.bsky.social•54 days ago

…share?? When do we get to the part where I’m the dominant highest-value alpha who manipulates people like puppets?

I don’t know how we get people out of being enthralled to a nonconsensual power fantasy.

eaglesadvocate.bsky.social•54 days ago

Highly recommend alittlenudge
on Instagram for great online and early dating advice.

handle.invalid•54 days ago

What if I told you that young men are not finding mates because they have androids instead of iPhones

whpshw.bsky.social•54 days ago

We really didn’t think reducing dating and romantic relationships to an optimized spreadsheet wasn’t going to have downstream consequences? It’s part and parcel of the whole productivity obsession that has taken over ppl’s mindsets in almost everything and it sucks.

olliemcclellan.bsky.social•54 days ago

Cooper, would you be surprised to find out that an absolute shitheel I went to law school with transitioned from being a professional pick-up artist known in "the trade" as "t e n m a g n e t" to later being the President of the Jordan Peterson Fan Club? Coincidentally, never called to the bar.

cassidy-vare.bsky.social•54 days ago

The "dating apps sucking" problem and the "angry men being unsuccessful" problem are unrelated problems. Culturally, the problem is still that we are producing men who aren't emotionally competent or good partners.

incompetusrex.bsky.social•54 days ago

I think it’s an intractable problem amplified by our current social and digital media environment.

The good relationship advice is kind of boring. Listening, compromising, and being considerate of your partner is not as exciting as the fantasy that the manfluencer types are selling.

slepr.bsky.social•51 days ago

Everyone's only listening to the men that suck, and it paints a picture that men suck when that's a harsh overgeneralization that discourages decent men from ever interacting, further deepening the gap between decent men and women.

unlmtdbredstix.bsky.social•56 days ago

sure but they're actually right about the dating apps

ninjamonkky.bsky.social•54 days ago

Underlying it all, is that the digital community, has replaced the actual community, which was more or less destroyed by the industrial revolution (way we work), urban flight/sprawl (way we live), and now Cyber/AI removes human communication (way we communicate) it's deeper than angry little boy-men

502eire.lol•54 days ago

dating apps sucking is not an age dependent thing. the problem is not just young men by any stretch

cooperlund.online•54 days ago

The statement in question is specifically about dating apps radicalizing young men, though

urocklive1.bsky.social•56 days ago

I've no personal experience with dating apps, but I'd have to say that all the dating advice I've seen for young men online is very terrible, and pretty much the opposite of what guys should do. There must be a lot of very frustrated young men out there if this it what they're learning.

anthrodiva.bsky.social•54 days ago

I agree with you, but at the same time, as an older lady, my single friends report the older dudes being just as bad. And they are meeting them in more traditional ways. So it's neither the apps nor Andrew Tate, it's maybe just in the water?

lastgamerontheleft.bsky.social•54 days ago

The older dudes are listening to these guys as well. It just wasn't as impactful because many of the older dudes targeted were either happily married or already had an effective dating strategy. Guys like Scott Adams became vulnerable when they got divorced.

Then MAGA happened.

anthrodiva.bsky.social•54 days ago

Tru dat

handle.invalid•54 days ago

Well, if you poll a bunch of decent couples counselors, they're going to tell you the problem extends way further back and that Terrence Real correctly identified it in 2008's The New Rules of Marriage: Women expect partners now (because feminism), and men still want therapy/sex mommies.

artificialmcb.bsky.social•54 days ago

They also want their wives to be maids.

anthrodiva.bsky.social•54 days ago

Bangmaids

handle.invalid•54 days ago

Yes, I knew I said it better the last time I posted about this.

handle.invalid•54 days ago

Although upon reflection, I do think "mommy" is a fundamental part of the equation.

handle.invalid•54 days ago

That's lumped in under "mommies" because they expect their mothers to be maids too.

marypcbuk.bsky.social•54 days ago

Nick Kershaw, 1999, “Billy” absolutely nails this

https://genius.com/Nik-kershaw-billy-lyrics

handle.invalid•54 days ago

Wow, thank you—I'd never heard that. I have some quibbles with how much responsibility it puts on Sally, but this is it.

marypcbuk.bsky.social•54 days ago

Yes, that’s the only bit that bugs me, but otherwise it’s just so damn good (Kershaw’s later stuff when he got mad at creeps and politicians is really biting)

handle.invalid•54 days ago

I'd never really listened to him beyond hearing "Wouldn't It Be Good" on the radio, and I'm really enjoying him, so thank you for pointing me in his direction!

anthrodiva.bsky.social•54 days ago

AKA Fleshlights

handle.invalid•54 days ago

Except Fleshlights won't remember to send a birthday card to his actual mom or rub his back when he's sobbing for the umpteenth time about how he knows his business idea would work and he just wishes his dad had believed in him.

anthrodiva.bsky.social•54 days ago

Le sigh

handle.invalid•54 days ago

Apps and social media have exacerbated it, by turning dating into online shopping for a never-ending stream of product, and by stoking and directing men's anger, but they did not create the problem.

anthrodiva.bsky.social•54 days ago

Kind of like sports gambling apps. Fuel to the fire, but the blaze was already underway.

wonkish.bsky.social•56 days ago

I think there are also issues with how apps end up working as well though.

mezentine.bsky.social•54 days ago

Is the actual height filter thing true? I used Hinge and Tinder heavily up through fall 2021 (when I met my now fiancée) and neither of us recall being able to explicitly filter like that, did that emerge in the last couple years?

brandonbird.bsky.social•54 days ago

I think with most apps you have to pay to filter.

maxp94.bsky.social•56 days ago

We need to get the kids off the computer

realdealneiman.bsky.social•54 days ago

I've seen friends of all genders struggle on the apps due to the loud voices on all sides. The apps in fact do suck. They're supposed to suck. That's how they keep customers. There needs to be accountability not only for the trashy loud voices on the male side, but the female focused voices as well.

sikolnam.bsky.social•56 days ago

The Hinge subreddit is really enlightening here. A lot of male profiles are very low on personality and high on navel gazing, “moderate” politics, and the pursuit of “traditional” women. Then guys ask for profile reviews and are confused about what’s going wrong.

artificialmcb.bsky.social•54 days ago

“I’ve tried nothing & I’m all out of ideas.”

fat-teabskysocial.bsky.social•54 days ago

the "advice" is their worst tendencies are good actually and the women's fault for not liking it. the media is an issue sure, but let's not act like these guys are blank slates being tricked into this.

cooperlund.online•56 days ago

It’s the same dynamic as the dating apps - you don’t want to do a good job at giving advice because once someone doesn’t need your help they’re no longer a customer - but much more insidious because it’s selling ideas instead of a service

cooperlund.online•56 days ago

The whole point of Jordan Peterson is to keep you buying his shit, and you aren’t going to buy his shit if you aren’t angry and disaffected. That’s the real trap.

turtlebee.bsky.social•54 days ago

But there's no danger of a lack of shitty angry young men, even if Peterson could cure them with the magic of making their bed and eating beef.

cooperlund.online•54 days ago

Please do not make this a conversation about if dating apps suck, I am very specifically responding to a post about young male radicalization. That context is included in the original post, I don’t know how people are missing it.

kuuga.bsky.social•54 days ago

Well part of it is that people literally cannot read.

donjickson.bsky.social•54 days ago

It is hard to combat the message of "If anything doesn't go your way, use it as license to be an awful person and you'll be cool"

bobzchemist.bsky.social•56 days ago

~60% of young men want to get married. Less than 40% of young women do (usa numbers). It's just not possible to write a dating app that doesn't suck. It may not even be possible to give good advice

sl128.bsky.social•54 days ago

no, the structuring of every app around hookups because those provide the most return customers is definitely a big part of the problem. the grifter inputs just make bad landscapes worse.

parisien.gay•54 days ago

I agree that dating app sucking isn’t the reason why young men have a difficult time dating.

But it’s absolutely true that dating apps suck.

sh4desthevibe.bsky.social•54 days ago

As someone who is about as far away from Jordan Peterson's alphabro rhetoric as it gets, I'm here to tell you there are deeper reasons why dating apps suck that go beyond mere misogyny.

The entire dating app culture makes human beings disposable with just a swipe. It's inherently dehumanizing.

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