I feel like literally every time someone suggests a fix, no matter how minor, to basically any problem, there's always someone there to tell you that there is no solution and there's nothing we can do.
Comments
Log in with your Bluesky account to leave a comment
if you only spent 5 minutes in the shoes of a man trying to solve a woman’s problem that she complains about for an hour to you while you listen, you’d see the former part of your statement only puts us as part of the problem every time while somehow erring on the side of doom does not
The only solution to every problem is believing in yourself and proving everybody else wrong. Keep faith and your belief in yourself. It's sufficient. Nobody is really rooting for you to win. They are just waiting for an opportunity to drag you down. So be mindful.
I know you're talking about society but YouTube videos have taught me you can fix a surprising number of things with very little effort, and maybe there's an allegory there.
Yesssssssss. A lot of things that look hard really need a can of WD-40 and a guy who knows how that thing can be disassembled and replaced with a $2 part.
I spent months bemoaning that my kitchen sink sprayer thingy was dragging and no longer fitting in the faucet itself and wondering how I was going to ask my landlord to fix it and it turns out it was a 5 minute fix there's a weight down there, I just needed to move it.
The old dudes that work at ace hardware are the most amazing resource for this too. Screwhole gotten too big for the screw on your cabinet? Stick a toothpick in there with the screw and it will tighten. Strip the head of a screw and can’t turn it? Put a rubber band in between the head and screw.
Every Ace Hardware employs a dude (or person) that has learned all the lessons of life. Sometimes asking another human with more experience is the way.
and if the screw head is mostly gone, you can get left handed drill bits, which will pull the screw out for you! or, if you don't need the attachment point, you can take a nail set and hammer the screw in till it's flush.
Circling back to climate change: one problem is that part of the solution is to just consume less but its not how we're oriented even though a lot of us could consume less without notable lifestyle changes (I'm specifically talking about the US). I'm weirdly obsessed with the
I Will Teach You To Be Rich podcast and his philosophy is spend richly on the things you value and cut back on the things you don't and it's always really interesting how often couples realize they are overspending on stuff they don't even like that much.
Am now...a handyman. Work with art for 20 years and end up a handyman? How?
1. Few folks in their 20s-40s use tools
2. Tons of stuff in your house/apt. is wrong. Set up wrong, installed wrong, incorrect parts
Handy part of my business ⤴️ 300% now. It's a thing.
Also sometimes you just have to ask the right person and they will do it for you for free? I've needed my windshield wipers replaced or six months and couldn't figure out how to do it and finally I just asked the guy to do it when I had a tune up and it was free cause I provided my own blades
And sometimes I watch a YouTube video and am like, "well I don't want to be doing all that," and gratefully pay people what they are worth because I know the labor.
It’s equally useful to know when something is actually way out of my league! Like it doesn’t matter how many videos I watch, I am never going to touch anything under the hood of my car
The vast majority of repair/remodel projects can be done by amateurs with a little willingness to tinker. Tiling? Installing a sink or a filter? Building a wood screen door, or a windowseat? Not rocket science...not even close.
But I will NEVER sand floors again—those folks don't charge enough!
I feel like, particularly in climate, people always manage to say "well this one thing won't save climate"
No shit, every sector of every industry needs to be transformed. But we aren't going to get anywhere by transforming NOTHING. We have to start transforming everything SOMEWHERE.
Brings to my mind one of my favorite quotes by Helen Keller. (please no one come at me with "but Helen Keller..." I know about the sliver of information shared [out of context] on Tik Tok and social media that does not delve into the entire complex human and her broader views, beliefs & ideals.)
i understand what you're saying but we should be STARTING with the military industrial complex, not working up to it. why is the american public allowing the dod to spend almost a trillion dollars failing audits and polluting the globe and letting veterans go homeless? that's a lot of work to do.
There's an organization I support that's cleaning up plastic from the ocean. At one point I read an article complaining that they'd only cleaned up 20 tons of plastic (or something like that) instead of the amt they'd thought they'd get. And I thought, "20 tons is a LOT. Let's be happy about this!"
I also feel like many people want that One True Thing to do and aren't as happy when you tell them, 'well, you probably have to do a bunch of little things that may not have the great big shiny effect you're going for.'
Yep, those of us who work on climate know that the rest of our lives will be in the messy middle between "all is saved" and "all is doomed" but there's a lot of people on both extremes wanting a simpler answer (both of which would then require far less effort)
There's this widespread embrace of perfection/doom as all there is, and since perfect solutions are out of reach in the short term, all is doom. In the real world,people adapt & things get fixed but not perfectly and permanently. Global temp WILL go up,climate is changing,but there ARE things to do.
Every sector of civic society doing whatever they can is worthwhile.
One of the =best things= the average individual can do is educate others, and remind =them= that whatever they =can do= will help. Empower and encourage =your friends= to change our societies in the direction of sustainability.
I think this is part of why Obama was so popular—he gave people that optimism (Yes We Can, Hope, Change). He didn’t always deliver but he did get people who want a better future jazzed up.
I feel like we made it to 2016, then a bunch of people just decided to stick their fingers in their ears and fantasize that their "side" was going to survive, so fuck everyone else.
With the corollary that when you have a complex problem, there’s always someone who will suggest a fix that sounds good to them and is completely unworkable, then gets mad when you explain that no, growing all our staple crops on the side of skyscrapers is not gonna work out.
*nods* " Every complex problem has a solution that is simple, easy, and wrong. "
I've just started asking people if they were good at math in high school. Yes, it's intolerably smug but otherwise I waste time on the latest version of Solar Freakin Roadways or something.
Yeah, there's a big difference between the person who has a non-solution being told it's unworkable, and the person who says that all solutions are unworkable.
Overall, when it comes to minor stuff, though, I tell myself “This is a solved problem. I do not need to assemble/whittle/sew a solution from first principles. Someone has done it already and it’s on Reddit, YouTube or Amazon.”
Then ya get the No Perfect Solution folks."This is flawed because it does not solve the problem in all cases, therefore it is useless and shouldn't be done."
Crops maybe not but I've been the opinion that the bare flat rooves (roofs?) of tall buildings could be used for plants to make cities a bit cleaner/ less CO² laden.
I think that would not be too unrealistic to also care for.
No, no, that’s already being done with green roofs in a lot of places. Not quite a panacea—they require rather more care than a normal roof and depending on the height, wind starts to become a significant problem, but they’re already in use.
Probably the biggest problem facing wholesale adoption is actually weight. Wet soil is HEAVY. Most roofs just weren’t structurally designed to support even the small amount you need for sedums, and people don’t want the expense of structural reinforcement.
As someone who has worked in this area, doing a white flat roof to increase albedo is probably the better choice over green in most instances. There are also reflective asphalt shingles, and even red tile roofs, are all eco-conscious choices.
In NYC most roofs are designed for, 10psf dead, wet soil is what, 20-25psf? So the roof would need to be able to support 30-35 minimum, and that is a fuckload
There's a community garden on the Upper West Side that's above the entrance to a parking garage. The garden even has a few trees in it. Now, I'm wondering how differently they had to design the structure to accommodate that. (The space was designed to hold the garden when they built it.)
I'm not saying that (I hope I didn't give the impression that I was) but tbh. With problems as complicated as this nothing is the panacea as you said in the beginning but everything we do is a good thing.
My understanding has always been that large-scale vertical farming solves the problems that agriculture doesn’t actually have - it saves space, which there’s plenty of, at the cost of more water/energy/fertilizer, which are the things we don’t have enough of.
I suspect some people see weird fancy giant buildings in Dubai and ask ‘why can’t we do that with PLANTS’ and don’t pay attention to the horrible public infrastructure problems in Dubai
How would you harvest? And water? And fertilize? And what if the crop needed deeper roots? And where would we feed the livestock? I HAVE SO MANY QUESTIONS
And wind! And soil weight! And…look, some people think that because you can do lettuce and basil that way, potatoes and wheat must work exactly the same way.
I *think* it was stacked floors with grow lights, but still. Lettuce can grow hydroponically, I'm not sure about potatoes, wheat can't. Plus we eat a LOT more wheat than lettuce! And you can harvest lettuce when it's four inches tall, not four FEET!!
… I truly wonder how many of those people have spent their adult lives doing Keto, and thus only think of “farming” as “growing greens”.
I don’t think it’s all of them, but I think there’s a non-zero component.
Oooh yeah. Those folks. "But I *gave* you a solution, and you're not even *trying* it, therefore you must not *want* to solve the problem."
They get to be smug and smart and 'right', without actually having to care about the problem.
And then there's Tech Bros, who will solve something that wasn't a problem with something "new" and try to brand it as "like uber yeah, but it travels a set route and takes more people and has fixed stops", or "sort of a vending machine building, but with a person there and more stuff"
The latest Hexagram issue has an article on 'killer kudzu'...
(more seriously, 30 storey Hong Kong skyscraper scaffolding uses bamboo. It seems to work.)
When I personally hear people excitedly discuss this the plants are like… on balconies. You open the door from your home, an office, a pool room, etc. (bc these are community buildings, vertical cities) & you’re on the balcony and can harvest stuff. They aren’t like hanging off the building.
Which… you can’t feed a whole city this way! That’s an out of touch dream!! And those balconies would need a HUGE weight rating, all that heavy wet soil!
But the fantasy of self sufficient green in a city is tantalizing.
Also like… more new multistory apartment blocks with actual balconies that could support, like, an herb garden, two lettuces and a tomato plant (instead of glass-walled million dollar condos where no windows open) wouldn’t be a BAD thing, but it doesn’t actually solve the food issue
...I'm now imagining a city just constantly filled with those little ledges as a whole staff go around planting and weeding and harvesting all day every day and it's making me feel kinda dizzy.
Not to mention the effects of street pollution on those crops.
The people who owned my house before me planted raspberries in an area where lead paint flaked onto the ground. No thank you, I will not be eating those.
The Perfect Solution Fallacy. Both a way to enforce learned helplessness AND cool discourse as everyone gets discouraged that there isn’t an immediate, cheap, perfect solution to the problem. Never let Perfect be the enemy of Good.
If people really want to do nothing, it becomes very important to them to establish that nothing is worth doing. *Doomerism is a relaxation technique*. It eliminates the stress of knowing there's something you should be doing and aren't.
I feel so many people literally don’t know the difference between short term goals and long term goals. Those types of people won’t be happy unless it happens immediately
UBI? Good healthcare? Solve the climate crisis? Cool, awesome!
It’s stunning how many progressives, even well meaning ones, think all of this can be solved with a stroke of a pen. If someone is gonna be an activist, I want to know what your ideas are and how we can achieve them.
Otherwise it sounds like an idealistic society that strays from reality.
Been seeing a lot of this discussion on here the last couple of days. The dooming has been around for awhile. But the current response that "I can't really argue through the depression that you seem to be suffering, I'm just a person on the internet" seems to be inching closer to a sort of consensus
It's talked about a lot as being correlated with depression, but I also think there's a significant amount of mechanical thinking expressed as arbitrary application of boundary conditions.
Like they have an example of how that process doesn't work in another case, or in their personal experience.
That Ursula K LeGuin quote "We live in capitalism. Its power seems inescapable. So did the divine right of kings. Any human power can be resisted and changed by human beings."
I hate this too. I believe that, collectively, we have vastly more power than it seems like we do, because part of how the dominant systems of current society work is to obfuscate the possibilities available to the species. There's great cause for hope, though it's somewhat shrouded at present.
I hope I live long enough to see an effective therapy for depression. Every single doomer I talk to in any depth turns out to fit that profile - I'm talking about the real doom-generators, not the handpuppets. And it's so sad to see them projecting harm and misery 360 and 24/7
Doomer mentality is a defense mechanism. It’s an admission of being unable to deal with the complexity of the world and its problems and a license to shut it all out.
Basically, the world is fucked, I can’t change anything and if we’re all doomed anyway it doesn’t matter.
And they never attempt to "shut it down" themselves, they're always just sitting there waiting for someone or something to make it happen, to bring either armageddon or revolution on a silver platter, because they simply can't be bothered, it's truly a pathetic, pitiful, loser world view.
Comments
There was a valve thingy that needed to be opened all the way.
Am now...a handyman. Work with art for 20 years and end up a handyman? How?
1. Few folks in their 20s-40s use tools
2. Tons of stuff in your house/apt. is wrong. Set up wrong, installed wrong, incorrect parts
Handy part of my business ⤴️ 300% now. It's a thing.
Maybe research is an undervalued skill
But I will NEVER sand floors again—those folks don't charge enough!
https://youtube.com/@dadhowdoi?si=tegJGqi2sXJSmfDM
What is the POINT in complaining about things if not to stoke yourself up about how much better things could be?
There is so much potential in the future!
No shit, every sector of every industry needs to be transformed. But we aren't going to get anywhere by transforming NOTHING. We have to start transforming everything SOMEWHERE.
No, let's try by increments to reduce the carnage, though. Just a bit of friction for those with murderous intent would help.
As long as they’re not sold as a panacea, we should celebrate them for what they are. Steps in the right direction.
ONE PIECE AT A TIME.
One of the =best things= the average individual can do is educate others, and remind =them= that whatever they =can do= will help. Empower and encourage =your friends= to change our societies in the direction of sustainability.
Because businesses have forgotten that sacrificing profits is literally how businesses grow
It's like a group of toddlers hating on vegetables, then all wishing their tummy didn't hurt
"so, who's gonna try some real food now?"
All her plans meant she was thinking about a better future and mapping out concrete ways to get there
I’m still mad that people saw this as pedantic lecturing instead of hopeful anticipation
Of course, I seem to recall how much anger there was in response to plastic bag and straw bans.
- H.L. Mencjen
I've just started asking people if they were good at math in high school. Yes, it's intolerably smug but otherwise I waste time on the latest version of Solar Freakin Roadways or something.
I think that would not be too unrealistic to also care for.
(I can't see why it wouldn't, but as you specified flat I'm curious!)
cf:cybertruck...
🙄
Have you no mercy?
I don’t think it’s all of them, but I think there’s a non-zero component.
They get to be smug and smart and 'right', without actually having to care about the problem.
(more seriously, 30 storey Hong Kong skyscraper scaffolding uses bamboo. It seems to work.)
But the fantasy of self sufficient green in a city is tantalizing.
Leafy vines tumbling down from a balcony? Pretty! And helps control heat.
The people who owned my house before me planted raspberries in an area where lead paint flaked onto the ground. No thank you, I will not be eating those.
Not foof related, but I have always been inspired by the trees that have been trained to be bridges in Meghalaya, India:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1H0qTm7wNjk
The less-common flipside is being certain that everything will work out somehow, which can also be an excuse for not doing anything.
UBI? Good healthcare? Solve the climate crisis? Cool, awesome!
…How do we get there?
No one has an answer to that.
Otherwise it sounds like an idealistic society that strays from reality.
For example! The majority of oceanic microplastic seems to be from tires. To some, the solution is obvious: Delete all the cars.
(Instead of the more workable: reformulate tires.)
gl7 j
O k7 o9oooto lo
Like they have an example of how that process doesn't work in another case, or in their personal experience.
Negative, passive people will never say anything worthwhile.
Basically, the world is fucked, I can’t change anything and if we’re all doomed anyway it doesn’t matter.
That’s how I see it.