A jury has awarded $83.3 million to E. Jean Carroll in her suit against Donald Trump. For Trump fans, that’s the equivalent of 640.77 porn stars. - ThreadSky | a Reddit-style client for Bluesky

kenwhite.bsky.social • 395 days ago

A jury has awarded $83.3 million to E. Jean Carroll in her suit against Donald Trump.

For Trump fans, that’s the equivalent of 640.77 porn stars.

Comments

ptonlaw.bsky.social•395 days ago

Was this number or something close always baked in after the first trial? If he and his lawyers had behaved themselves during the trial, how much less of a hit could he have gotten away with?

joegordon.bsky.social•395 days ago

I mean, if he had stopped defaming her after trial 1 then he’d have had a pretty good defense?

jbminn.bsky.social•395 days ago

A-

statesongxprt.bsky.social•395 days ago

Fascinating implication that income can be measured in Stormies per Mooch

rogerailes.bsky.social•395 days ago

Cool cool.

paladinzero.bsky.social•395 days ago

Trump is trash, but does this mean people who deny culpability in public have to worry about being sued for defamation? Seems like a dangerous precedent to set, but maybe it's all in the specifics of Trump's denial as opposed to the denial alone?

blackcatcrosses.bsky.social•394 days ago

That isn’t exactly what happened.

paladinzero.bsky.social•394 days ago

This goes to the heart of my questions. The articles I've read mention his denial of culpability without citing which statements, in particular, were found to be defamatory (summarily, by the judge). I am mostly wondering how this principle might be applied in other civil cases involving denials.

prufrock451.bsky.social•395 days ago

Assuming four tablets a day, this is equal to almost 44,000 years worth of Sudafed

achilleselbow.bsky.social•395 days ago

How much Adderall?

mpinga.bsky.social•395 days ago

But they haven’t ruled yet on whether stars have immunity!

cajohns.bsky.social•395 days ago

And he defames her again in...3...2..

fckthemacaroni.bsky.social•395 days ago

I'm screencapping this

shoutingboy.bsky.social•395 days ago

To put it in context, a minimum-wage worker would have to work for roughly 130,000 Scaramuccis to pay off that settlement 😰

ennuimageddon.bsky.social•395 days ago

I bet the ratio equivalent for Playboy Playmates is even greater!

myfuguestate.bsky.social•395 days ago

Ken whats the likelihood of an appeal and reduction on the punitive damages?

kenwhite.bsky.social•395 days ago

Low. That’s a reasonable multiplier of actual to punitive and consistent with his stated wealth.

mithras.bsky.social•395 days ago

If he does appeal, do you know how much of an appeal bond he would have to put up?

bjc860.bsky.social•395 days ago

@mitchellepner.bsky.social

Indicates it is typically 110% of the judegment.

bjc860.bsky.social•395 days ago

Ugh. *judgement

rossmc11.bsky.social•395 days ago

'Stated wealth'. Ouch.

ennuimageddon.bsky.social•395 days ago

Did I say my penthouse was 30,000 square feet? I meant to say 3,000.

timnfeinstein.bsky.social•395 days ago

Stated to lending banks, or stated to the IRS?

chrish.bsky.social•395 days ago

Likely as he stated in his deposition for the trial, as they played video of that (or read it back in court) for the jury before they decided how much to fine him.

timnfeinstein.bsky.social•395 days ago

IRS then.

hairychris.bsky.social•395 days ago

Works both ways.

AYO!

Sorry.

marktspence.bsky.social•395 days ago

Is this additive? Does it stack on top of the previous judgement, or does this roll that in?

deathbymeteor.bsky.social•395 days ago

Should be, they are different cases and different awards

dogzilla100.bsky.social•394 days ago

What kind of bond will Trump have to get to allow an appeal?

555tee.bsky.social•395 days ago

He’d also have to bond the appeal.

crforcards.bsky.social•395 days ago

I'm imagining the Judge will make quick work of any post-trial motions, but would you have a ballpark deadline for appeal and what the bond would need to be? It seems to me that posting these bonds might expedite his ultimate downfall faster than the criminal matters.

kenwhite.bsky.social•395 days ago

2-4 months for post-trial motions.

jefffreyspies.bsky.social•395 days ago

Can you explain the extraordinary order the judge made in Rudy’s defamation case accelerating payment?

crforcards.bsky.social•395 days ago

Will he need to post 10% probably or will he have trouble getting a bond without a higher amount?

chessercat.bsky.social•394 days ago

NY practitioners are saying that he would have to post all of it, plus a 9% annual fee, so $90.8 million, and he’s unlikely to get a bond for that amount.

He paid the first one in cash, but it was $5.5 million. The fee alone is more on this one.

rednecklefty.bsky.social•394 days ago

How soon until he starts soliciting from the MAGA mob for the bond?

crforcards.bsky.social•394 days ago

Whatever lowers the pool for campaign donations

myfuguestate.bsky.social•395 days ago

Once appeals are exhausted how does this work enforcing this judgment? Do they goto his various banks where he has accounts with this judgement? Ask Palm Beach Sheriff to auction off chairs and tables at MAL?

kevinnelson84.bsky.social•395 days ago

As someone who's most definitely not a lawyer... does this give grounds for them to find out actual wealth?

cyneheard.bsky.social•395 days ago

It’s hard for him to appeal this one is because he’s broke while also facing fraud charges in NYS for lying about how much money he has.

tripsnek.com•395 days ago

It's also commensurate with the monumental task of shutting his piehole.

drewkadel.bsky.social•395 days ago

The fascinating thing is that his stated wealth is much lower than his actual wealth. After the fraud verdict comes in the disgorgement in that case plus this verdict could cause a cascade in the value of his equity until his net worth will be less than zero.

iskaral-pust.bsky.social•395 days ago

He says his most valuable assets are his name and reputation so presumably he can just slice off some of those and give them to her.

drewkadel.bsky.social•395 days ago

He'll have to place a call to a moile.

adw.bsky.social•395 days ago

Not gonna lie, this being ‘consistent with his stated wealth’ is going to make me happy for about 5 different reasons for quite a while

wombative.bsky.social•395 days ago

Could you please expand on this? I had seen claims that 3X was normally a large multiplier.

I must admit, that I would be thrilled if Trump's inflated claims about his net worth left him hoist on his own petard...

cyneheard.bsky.social•395 days ago

I would think the fact it’s repeated behavior enters into it? And it’s about a 3.5 multiplier.

salviati.bsky.social•395 days ago

The Supreme Court has previously ruled that punitive damages in excess of 10x the compensatory damages are excessive, so this is well below that level.

seanmatthews1.bsky.social•395 days ago

Can it be appealed?

sababausa.bsky.social•395 days ago

this area of law is complicated (naturally), but in fed court punitive damages are said to implicate due process issues bc the defendant can't anticipate the magnitude of damages before committing the tort. There's post-trial motions for "remittitur" (judge reduces damages)

https://bsky.app/profile/joshuajfriedman.com/post/3kjw2nsdyjk2m

richdotdad.bsky.social•394 days ago

In

kenwhite.bsky.social•395 days ago

Right, but the factors courts look at favor this verdict. It’s a low multiple of the compensatory damages (in the range SCOTUS says is acceptable) and a low percentage of his claimed net worth.

jinesh.bsky.social•395 days ago

And he’ll have to put up the bond to appeal, right? So that will be deterrent too

madbastard-v2.bsky.social•395 days ago

Yeah, darn shame he keeps claiming he's worth billions.

..... anyway.

chessercat.bsky.social•394 days ago

Anyway, I’m trying to decide if I want chili or curry for dinner. You?

madbastard-v2.bsky.social•394 days ago

Steak, with a side of broiled onions, and mixed veggies.

jestpier.bsky.social•394 days ago

And I presume that if he is lying about his net worth, the correct legal term is 'sucks to be him'?

stinapag.bsky.social•395 days ago

Running around claiming to have Billion$$$ can have its drawbacks.

trampschool.bsky.social•394 days ago

Also couldn’t he have anticipated the magnitude of the damages given that he committed the tort in response to a multimillion dollar judgment against him for … checks notes … committing the tort?

crforcards.bsky.social•395 days ago

Yeah, it seemed to me that this was a perfect test case for exceeding a 10x multiplier, but I'd almost prefer to minimize the chances of it being overturned.

lawtalkinguy.bsky.social•394 days ago

Compensatories are significant, and will be viewed as including some implied punishment. I think 3 to 1 will be the remittitur.

mattlalden.bsky.social•394 days ago

I would love for him to sit for a judgement debtors exam so his real financial situation could come to light.

ncweaver.skerry-tech.com•395 days ago

PLUS this is his second go-round, and you need to deter further bad behavior...

ypsidoodle.bsky.social•394 days ago

Correction: It's in the range Scotus USED TO say was acceptable.

chessercat.bsky.social•394 days ago

I hate that you’re right.

ypsidoodle.bsky.social•394 days ago

Me too.

svunt.bsky.social•394 days ago

I imagine that the concurrent trial over his inflation of his asset base makes it significantly harder for him to cry poor or claim that this is unfairly punitive. All those multi billion dollar properties surely make this a trivial penalty.

bluememe.bsky.social•395 days ago

And hard to think of anything about Trump or this case that tilts against the full verdict.

lawtalkinguy.bsky.social•394 days ago

Bet judge knocks it down to 3 to 1 ratio.

joegordon.bsky.social•394 days ago

As long as I’m not actually betting money: they should increase it to a 7x ratio.

chessercat.bsky.social•394 days ago

You mean down to $54.9 million + the $18.3 million in compensatory damages? All the way down to…$73.2 million total? Kay.

I hope his lawyers charge $10.1 million for the appeal…actually, not even that much, 9% interest is nearly $7.5 million, and a $2.6 million legal bill is quite possible.

sababausa.bsky.social•395 days ago

and it sounds like in this district he'd likely have to post the judgment if he wanted to appeal to the 2d Cir

https://bsky.app/profile/toobigtofail.bsky.social/post/3kjw37f2do42l

kevinrsours.bsky.social•395 days ago

So it's not *required* to appeal, but if he doesn't post a bond or escrow amount the judgement can be collected while the appeal is being heard.

ogmcduck.bsky.social•395 days ago

Get ready for Trump to revise his net worth down to something in the range of, say, Fred Sanford.

svunt.bsky.social•394 days ago

Hard to do since he's currently defending himself against a charge of fraudulently inflating the value of his assets. If Mar a Largo is worth north of a billion dollars, he can definitely pony up $83M

ogmcduck.bsky.social•394 days ago

Well, yeah. But lies are easy to tell when you are a sociopath. Especially you are a very dumb sociopaths. It's a lie he is going to tell while simultaneously claiming he is also a billionaire.

There is no truth nor any logic that he won't blow right past.

zippyrich.bsky.social•395 days ago

But which "claimed" net worth? The one submitted for loan applications or the one submitted for tax liability? I hear there's been some discrepancy between the two number sets.
Might've even caught the eye of an enterprising State AG….

georgethomas.bsky.social•395 days ago

👍And with the NY fraud trial going on it is going to be difficult for him to plead poverty. He really is stuck. 😂

hairychris.bsky.social•395 days ago

The more the merrier, I hope!

ahaberlach.bsky.social•395 days ago

As a second offender, shouldn't he be pretty ready to anticipate the magnitude of damages before committing the tort again?

sababausa.bsky.social•395 days ago

and then after that he can appeal, but -generally- it's much easier to appeal the punitive damages than the compensatory damages

lucn.bsky.social•395 days ago

Hahaha

mty917.bsky.social•394 days ago

It took .011 Scaramuccis to arrive at that verdict.

joberama.bsky.social•395 days ago

Has Trump called E. Jean Carroll a liar again yet?

bodger.ca•395 days ago

Sounds like grounds for an emergency podcast.

kevinnelson84.bsky.social•395 days ago

Hashtag math!

fennar.bsky.social•395 days ago

If Trump gets on truth social tonight and says more of the same shit about Carroll, is there any reason they wouldn’t just file for round three right away?

lilrouge.bsky.social•395 days ago

Does 83.3 million = emergency/non-emergency Podcast?

groovinchip.bsky.social•394 days ago

What’s the betting that he defames her again because he just can’t help himself?

jdotj.bsky.social•395 days ago

Good thing he has so much cash on hand like he always claims. Shouldn't be a problem to post a bond during appeal.

lucyhaines.bsky.social•394 days ago

Thinking rn about the courts who require you to bring *actual cash* and how many boxes that might involve.

drfoxcroft.bsky.social•394 days ago

Question: Can a president pardon a civil tort ruling? Or just Federal criminal convictions?

Trump hopes to be elected so that he can end the Federal criminal cases against him, or pardon any Fed criminal convictions. But if he's elected, can he do anything about this case? Or the NY AG case?

zerschmetterling.bsky.social•394 days ago

Nothing. He can do nothing. Except wield the power of government to harass. Which he will start in day one, if the US voters let him again.

informema.bsky.social•395 days ago

Breaking: LIV Golf to pay $83.3 million more than expected for tour event in Bedminster, NJ.

lawzag.bsky.social•395 days ago

It is also 41.65 horses, which could then be converted to 41.65 handjobs for Elon Musk fans.

https://www.theguardian.com/books/2022/sep/05/donald-trump-tried-pay-lawyer-horse-book-david-enrich-servants-of-the-damned

caitesq.bsky.social•395 days ago

This is taking me back to dimensional analysis in chemistry class

cameron.bsky.social•395 days ago

Was his lawyer Andy Warhol

raptorizedira.bsky.social•395 days ago

That better be 41.65 horses of Shadowfax quality.

lawzag.bsky.social•395 days ago

To me, it's a measurement of the asshole tax for billionaires wanting handjobs. Robert Kraft is a billionaire and his handjobs cost around $100. Musk allegedly offered a horse for handjob from a stewardess. Using the Trump-horse conversion rate, we can see there is a whopping 2000% asshole tax.

raptorizedira.bsky.social•395 days ago

Interesting methodology. I also used the Musk/horse approach, but googled the average cost of a horse in the USA ($3000).

By my approach Trump owes Carroll almost 28000 horses.

lawzag.bsky.social•395 days ago

You think billionaires own outlet mall horses that they barter with?

raptorizedira.bsky.social•395 days ago

I have never considered that, but now that you suggest it: Yes. 100%.

rumpole-brief.bsky.social•394 days ago

You should factor in the legal and PR fees Kraft had to pay to get out of the massage parlor handy scandal though.

daviderroll.bsky.social•395 days ago

…after deliberating for 0.0125 scaramuccis

isaacbradshaw.bsky.social•395 days ago

0.086 Alex Jones defamations.

emmanueldaylouis.bsky.social•395 days ago

Trump is Costner at the end of Tin Cup.

bacullenyyc.bsky.social•394 days ago

How many Scaramuccis does he have to pay it?

ceilingcat.bsky.social•395 days ago

“Make it hurt”

saxonwaker.bsky.social•395 days ago

This reminds me of something my grandfather, a country minister used to say:

Hahahahahaahahahahahahahahahahahaha (deep breath)
Hahahahaahahahahahahahahahahahahaha

He had a great sense of humor.

ianjspalding.bsky.social•395 days ago

He's going to defame her again into the first microphone he sees on the way out of the courthouse.

colken.bsky.social•395 days ago

It’s a shame Biden can’t sue him for claiming he set it all up

mtblah.bsky.social•395 days ago

Is there any likelihood he actually pays it? It feels like the sort of thing he just ignores with only theoretical consequences.

wfpremo.bsky.social•395 days ago

Sure hope Habba defends him in all of his future trials.

heathermoandco.bsky.social•394 days ago

I hope he is forced to liquidate.

Comment image

chasing.bsky.social•394 days ago

How much do you think the third defamation penalty will be for?

ladybugn.bsky.social•394 days ago

we’ll see if that check clears lol

jayadan.com•395 days ago

What will likely happen when he doesn't pay?

crimsoncapacitor.bsky.social•395 days ago

So a Stormy is a unit of measure now?

pyrholidon.bsky.social•395 days ago

Imagine all the ponies you could buy with that.

audiolibrarian.bsky.social•395 days ago

countdown until he demands the RNC pay the judgment

raptorizedira.bsky.social•395 days ago

At the US average cost of $3000, that is 27676 horses.

mattgruhn.bsky.social•395 days ago

If he defames her again and she sues again, would she expect to win even more than that in a third round? Does the amount just keep going up until he keeps his mouth shut?

thatandromeda.bsky.social•395 days ago

Weren't people just liveskeeting closing arguments like...this morning?? How long did that jury take?

babblingfringe.bsky.social•395 days ago

About three hours.

kitncaboodle.bsky.social•395 days ago

They started deliberating at 1:40 pm. ET So about 3 hours. Takes a bit to write all those zeros.

thatandromeda.bsky.social•395 days ago

I've spent a longer stretch in a coffeehouse than they spent deliberating.

kitncaboodle.bsky.social•395 days ago

Well they only had to find damages. So it was just a matter of debate on how big a number.

renuvian.bsky.social•395 days ago

Can he use campaign or PAC money to pay this?

heyaries325.bsky.social•395 days ago

That’s what I’m wondering too. He can pay legal fees but I don’t think he can pay actual damages unless he explicitly asks for donations for that. But I’m not sure, I’m basically guessing.

hugoyyo.bsky.social•395 days ago

No way she is getting that kind of money off him. His actual net worth is probably negative, or close.

acmeleader.bsky.social•395 days ago

How many Scaramuccis?

daviderroll.bsky.social•395 days ago

0.0125 in fact

idgafcertified.com•395 days ago

That was quick. It seemed quick. Was it quick?

darkwebmallcop.bsky.social•395 days ago

I would simply stop defaming that woman