Had to share this cause it annoys me. DS9 faced tons of hate, including racism. Watch the What We Left Behind doc for proof. Avery Brooks fought racism behind the scenes & even had to defend Cirroc Lofton after a security guard harassed him near set. Don’t rewrite history. Only Sisko can do that.
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The distinction was that it's fine for fantasy, but history should not be forgotten.
This is why I have never understood the argument that Trek has "become" woke. Trek FANS used to be supremely woke.
Are you fucking kidding? I am one of *two*Star Trek nerds I know that doesn't think Sisko's war criminal ass isn't the *best captain*
But I agree it would be great if the alt text was included, as most people won't see my reply. However I hope this helps!
It’s been panned wrongfully by bigots for the entire time for every show, and even now you’d have diehards who admonish its values over “photon torpedo go boom”.
I didn't not think we should ignore that this is a black man making these ridiculous edits to history.
Meant "I don't think we should ignore..."
The one where he definitely didn't face any kind of tacit blacklisting from the entertainment. That's totally a thing that never happened, right?
There was a whole letter writing campaign AGAINST it for featuring a lesbiankiss
https://groups.google.com/g/rec.arts.startrek.current/c/e3NY64xIyfQ
Then, the writers promoted Kirk and Picard to Admiral in the middle of the night.
Then again, I'd vote Janeway for President for Life after all she did and went through for her crew and the people of the Delta Quadrant.
After all, going to war for a .5c raise is kind of a mood for my generation. /s
Reading that a culture of unregulated business and obsessed with money is
Whatever a person might read into the Ferengi, claiming Jewish people crafted anti-Semitic characters doesn't sit right.
They stop at nothing to smudge a narrative.
We didn’t have social media back then to exacerbate the faux outrage.
The metaphors on DS9 were obvious if you had a brain an any kind, but these chuckle chuds did not understand ANY a them. not even the most obvious ones.
They thought it was actually about pew pew
they want that to end and for it to go back to where they can say “there’s no proof there’s queers in space! those black and white aliens weren’t metaphors!”
That’s where it stops
Right there
Try to imagine thinking of trek as a disposable burger
good move, past me
I remember Scott Adams doing a Dilbert strip about how women on tv are only allowed to be portrayed as lawyers and starship captains
Considering Dilbert ended up on the same network as Voyager and got canceled.
you can fill in "outraged" with any sort of bigotry you want. we weren't more enlightened 30 years ago, no matter what your memories may tell you.
until they think they don't have to.
I also feel like there was a reason Pel didn't come back or was mentioned again. With all those trans masc~gay overtones between them and Quark, it would have been "confusing" lol
Heck, I got some comments in person back then wearing a DS9 shirt.
Other side, Sisko is just that badass, and Q couldn't handle it.
My memories are far stronger of Mulgrew getting outright publicly mocked for a female captain. But nothing compared to Tim Russ as a black Vulcan. That was the worst of them from what I recall.
Racism was there for sure.
If you just liked to watch the show(s and movies) and otherwise weren't involved, you'd obviously be oblivious to whatever shitstorm went down in the trekky community.
Nowadays, all of that is far more visible.
Run a find and replace of "Vulcan" for "mermaid," and the exact same posts ran 30 years ago.
Tuvok couldn't be black because Vulcan's were logical, calm, rational and intelligent. Spock represented a white dude power fantasy, of being the smart reasonable one in the room.
@eluthurin.bsky.social
That's the documentary I said was really good- well worth the watch and an excellent follow up to a DS9 watch-through
In my defense I also hated TNG at first because they dared replace Kirk and Spock.
I came around eventually 😅
Avery Brooks told them flat out "I will NEVER do a scene with Vic unless you allow me to talk about how brown people would not have been let into a place like this."
I often tell people that I wish he'd have got cancer instead of Piller.
Piller and Behr were the best things that ever happened to the franchise. Berman is Satan.
I love DS9 BECAUSE it became serialized into a longer story.
Have you ever watched the dvd interviews? The writing staff very timidly brought the idea to Piller that "We could, uh, make Odo's people the Founders."
Berman wouldn't listen, but Piller said, "Yeah, I was thinking that, too." 😁
I remember it being an afterthought because at least 3 other shows did women kissing women before DS9. It most definitely was NOT a "first".
The piles of essays that came out about how the TNG ep with Melinda Culea wasn't about being gay were hilarious, though.
It's the same kind of kiss that, around same time, gets Nancy Sinatra and Sammy Davis Jr. in hot air. So yes, it "counts". 1/3
Star Trek can’t do this or that.
And it seems that no matter the fandom. It is getting worse. I try to be a fan now without getting involved with the fandom.
Yet, they can't see the hypocrisy.
Fuck, I love Star Trek. Although I wasn't too fond of Discovery.
Telling on yourself.
Star Trek IV. Is about time traveling to rescue whales, so idk what point you’re trying to make
But there are always toxic fandoms. Look at all the controversy’s that Hazbin Hotel has been in.
And I love the series.
I will say that Lower Decks is the best so far in my opinion.
I always want to see series set after voyager. Not going backwards.
That being said Strange New Worlds is growing on me.
The problem is always there, but social media allows it to be magnified to absurd degrees.
It's only being pointed out that toxic fandoms are always there, but while they've never had popular support from the public they found the establishments were happy to platform and support them, so they got louder.
Bigots used to just get to be bigots without many batting an eye, and now they can't without it being immediately ridiculed.
At least, that's the positive theory
Tweet from Clifton Duncan (@cliftonduncan)
"30 years ago a black man was the lead in a Start Trek show that ran 7 seasons, got 31 Emmy nominations, and was one of the most acclaimed series in the franchise. No one was outraged. No one boycotted. No one cared..." 1/2
My bad!
"...People who loved this show back then are called 'toxic fans' today."
End of tweet
But I agree it would be great if the alt text was included, as most people won't see my reply. However I hope this helps!
How many war dramas showed where a commander pushed the limits and committed war crimes? We forgave because we trusted Sisko was making the right decision.
Great show…
#ripTonyTodd
It's not about the money.
DS9 also had a lot of digital effects that would essentially need to be redone in HD, it would be massively expensive to remaster.
https://blog.trekcore.com/2013/05/deep-space-nine-in-high-definition-one-step-closer/
Talking isn't enough, getting attention so the studio knows we want this is.
I have ideas on how to focus money, and maybe get the cost down to 15 million from 26.
The worst episodes totaling around 30-60 could be re scanned and have upscaled FX.
5.1 mixes are uncompressed on masters and could be recycled.
Maintain 4:3, episodes like main story and fan favorites could be given the TNG treatment.
Money could have been saved on TNG doing it this way.
Not every episode is a jewel.
Even upscaling space ship scenes in DS9 would look great, they're way more cinematic than B5.
DS9 and Voyager are as much TNG as TNG.
IMO, TNG ran 21 seasons and interlocks.
That Generation ran 21 seasons.
VFX for TNG and DS9 were done on the video transfers, so there are no HD film elements to go back to: they all have to be recreated.
DS9 would need all new CGI created to replace all the lost stuff. Possible, but it would probably cost more than TNG. I would absolutely love DS9 to be remastered though!
TOS and TNG are star trek for kids.
I have 1/3 of TNG on my shelf.
TNG remastered discs sold well, Paramount shot itself in the foot overcharging for Trek.
They'd been doing it since the first DVD releases off of tape masters, which looked like shit, at 90.00 a pop. It's total BS.
And the fact it was considered low priority is why it was allowed to have an actual story.
And now? Arguably the best Star Trek show ever made.
Isn't it great...
I do vaguely remember reading about that and thinking that was pretty cool.
Still is.
It's a human Utopian society where money longer exists. That's all you need to know.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BGRZogWq8Vk
These rightoid freaks don't know how to do anything but gaslight. They lie about EVERYTHING. The right has gone full 1984.
Loooooool, someone didn't pay attention.
The only difference was we didn't have social media blasting that outrage in our faces 24/7 On Twitter/X, Facebook, YouTube, etc...