Was anyone going to tell me that the Pope has a standing lunch date with a group of transgender women or was I just supposed to read that on a tumblr news roundup?
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I’m not a catholic and I have a bunch of grievances with the church and papacy and all that, but in the universe of all plausible popes, Francis is the WAR king
He is the very 1st Jesuit pope in the 2,000+ year history of the papacy, which helps explain why his approach to pope-ing feels like a radical departure. Because in Catholic terms, it is.
This article explains it much more eloquently than I could:
Ooh, thank you for that. What little I know of the Catholic church is mostly several hundred years old history, so I don't have the current context for any of this.
I was so indoctrinated that I didn't fully conceptualize that all religions weren't just various forms of Catholicism til age 13, but Mom was deeply devout & engaged w/the church her whole life, so I ended up knowing a lot about a religion I abandoned 30+ yrs ago. 🤪
In Brendan Gill’s marvelous book, Here At The New Yorker, he characterized himself as being a “collapsed Catholic”. And ever since I read that, I’ve thought of myself that way.
the thing about Francis is that when it comes to like, his role as custodian of two thousand years of dogma and church with over 1 billion global members, he is frequently WAY more conservative than I want him to be. but he’s really good at the pastoral stuff because that’s the job he wanted
there is something to be said for electing a guy as pope who never once in his career as a priest thought, “I should get into the politics game and run for pope”
when they picked him, every catholic in the world was like “…. who???” 😂
I think he would so much rather just hang out with people
I was just thinking this thing. As a Very Much Protestant, one guy in charge of a whole religion gives me the willies and as a progressive Christian, I desperately want the Catholic church to better serve our changed world. But DANG he is a good shepherd. He legitimately loves and cares for people.
I have a lot of thoughts about how we gauge whether/how Francis is building a more progressive church, and broadly speaking, I do not actually believe “has girl squad of trans sex workers” and “says Clueless Old Man things about ‘gender ideology’ in formal speeches” are AS discordant as they appear
In my personal homosexual Catholic opinion, attempting to quantify “The Francis Effect” based on metrics like “what laws have been changed on paper” - an area in which he always falls short! - is missing a huge bank of data, AKA “how do the people in the pews treat the other people in the pews”
Yes, this. Theologically, he isn't as progressive as I'd like. But in terms of his pastoral role, he's great. He genuinely seems to care about people to a degree that is unfortunately rare.
yeah this is definitely true; he’s still very much the head of the Roman Catholic Church, which entails social conservatism
but the Jesuit in him really shows when it comes to commitment to pastoral care and saying/doing things that ruffle the right feathers (esp. conservative Roman Catholics)
My dad’s a mass multiple times a week, misses Latin mass Catholic, and he’s very happy about it. He has lunch monthly with a retired priest friend and they discuss the ordination of women. Dad’s very much in favor. Also very pro choice. I don’t think the rest of the congregation is as progressive.
Sorry to interrupt. Similarly-progressive Catholic here. Conservative Catholic attitudes tend to be generally unhealthy, whether the subject is gender expression, sexual orientation, women's rights, birth control, safe injection, education, legislative over-reach or reproductive choice. Sad really.
Yeah, I know my dad likes his church, but he’s been less happy as every new priest is more conservative. I’ve tried suggesting other congregations, but I think that church is tied for him with his beloved friend who was the priest there who’s died.
Well, I can see that, bless him. Here's "The Daily TV Mass" from Toronto if he's interested in some balance. We watched it at the height of the pandemic and my poor dad watched it every day during his last few years. They never bring up politics.
I'm Catholic, and I wonder why eating with transwomen would shock a Catholic? I doubt the Pope has changed any marriage rules for them or that there are women shelter/prisons in the Vatican, for which rules could need revisions.
Conditions for being a godparent didn't included cis-gender in the past. If anything, there was uncertainty how to write a godparent's name, and that's clearer now.
Do you know any tradcaths who were mad, not about the Pope but about this decision of his? I ask, because I haven't heard from any.
It's a start, but a really small start. The church still considers trans to be a disorder. It's not. It's a normal variation. But allowing them to be baptised and to be godparents is a start. You got to start somewhere. I hope one day my church will fully accept lgbti+. Preferably soon.
(it’s pretty common for popes to do this, at least when it comes to the poor and sick, Francis and prior popes have even snuck out of the Vatican to do so
still, the fact he’s doing it so publicly when LGBTQ+ rights are under global threat seems prescient to me)
yeah i guess. but i am not about to applaud the pope for treating a few of us with the standard of dignity all people deserve, while patronizingly pitying us for bearing the targets the church painted on our backs. as "dining with sinners" implies
well yeah, that’s what I meant by “mixed reception” from LGBTQ+ Catholics: it’s noteworthy, but nowhere near the amount of work needed to undo the Church’s harm
plus I left the Church several years ago, partly b/c I’m pretty familiar with its particular brand of queerphobia with a friendly smile
the Church only changes its doctrinal stances once in a few blue moons—if ever—so I have no illusions about this creating a seismic shift
it’s more that Francis’ outreach to LGBTQ+ Catholics, while performative, is still different from his predecessors, even if it won’t change anything anytime soon
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This article explains it much more eloquently than I could:
I was so indoctrinated that I didn't fully conceptualize that all religions weren't just various forms of Catholicism til age 13, but Mom was deeply devout & engaged w/the church her whole life, so I ended up knowing a lot about a religion I abandoned 30+ yrs ago. 🤪
when they picked him, every catholic in the world was like “…. who???” 😂
I think he would so much rather just hang out with people
https://apnews.com/article/vatican-transgender-lgbtq-b3d67868504ba701cce09da9ecc94de0
but the Jesuit in him really shows when it comes to commitment to pastoral care and saying/doing things that ruffle the right feathers (esp. conservative Roman Catholics)
Do you know any tradcaths who were mad, not about the Pope but about this decision of his? I ask, because I haven't heard from any.
It doesn't contain, however, any mentioning of tradcaths or opposition to the announcements.
But I’m happy to know now
granted, he’s pretty conservative on queer issues as far as Jesuits go, but has demonstrated a capacity to listen to LGBTQ+ people, which is notable
but Francis, at the very least, takes the whole “mingling with sinners” thing to higher levels than previous popes, in that he attempts to communicate
still, the fact he’s doing it so publicly when LGBTQ+ rights are under global threat seems prescient to me)
plus I left the Church several years ago, partly b/c I’m pretty familiar with its particular brand of queerphobia with a friendly smile
it’s more that Francis’ outreach to LGBTQ+ Catholics, while performative, is still different from his predecessors, even if it won’t change anything anytime soon