The Federal Government just capped indirect rates for new and existing grants for research at universities at 15%. Capping indirect costs was on page 355 of Project 2025’s Mandate for Leadership - ThreadSky

cjtackett.bsky.social • 15 days ago

The Federal Government just capped indirect rates for new and existing grants for research at universities at 15%.

Capping indirect costs was on page 355 of Project 2025’s Mandate for Leadership

Comments

little-thieves.com•15 days ago

WELL that’s one way to ensure we don’t have good American engineers anymore and more cancer yeehaw

dollyfromcali.bsky.social•15 days ago

Is P2025 is the playbook; then why is nobody able to get in front of the plays??

jdonne.bsky.social•15 days ago

Nonsense. Yale needs a nearly 70 percent rate? I'd prefer cancer research ensure that 85 cents per dollar goes to the research and researchers, not to pay the University Provost 700k a year. I work in nonprofit: Universities over charge shamefully @chrishayes1.bsky.social

chrishansonut.bsky.social•15 days ago

I also work in the nonprofit world. We use the 2 CFR 200 de minimus rate of 10%(just changed to 15%) and we survive just fine. I've never heard of a negotiated indirect rate of more than 20-25% in my industry. 60% is nuts.

anto4texas.bsky.social•15 days ago

Research labs require instruments that cannot be purchased with federal grants. For instance in my work I need PCR machines, centrifuges, refrigerators, etc. plus bench space. You can’t compare with the nonprofit organization.

chrishansonut.bsky.social•15 days ago

What a dumb system you work with. If I need equipment, I write it into my grants. None of what you described is really overhead it's program supplies and equipment.

anto4texas.bsky.social•15 days ago

Well I work in a public university with no endowments. We are mostly a teaching university with no medical schools but we do research. We are definitely not Harvard or MIT but we do have PhD programs. We cannot add $100 k for a -80C in a grant.

portfoliocarmel.bsky.social•15 days ago

📌

dianetober.bsky.social•15 days ago

Working hard to turn the US into a "shithole country," to quote his eminence.

philrv.bsky.social•15 days ago

this will absolutely cripple research institutions. While we as researchers always griped about the indirects, these funds provide critical infrastructure. If you wanted to stifle American ingenuity in the basic and applied sciences and biomedical field, couldn't plan a better way. America Last.

socaloma.bsky.social•15 days ago

Agreed. There will be a huge brain drain from great thinkers leaving for more welcoming countries. Being a scientist, fighting constantly for funding these days is hard enough, without deliberate roadblocks and disrespect from this administration.

saeyster.bsky.social•15 days ago

I keep thinking about how this will result in a brain drain from the US. World class researchers don’t need this crap. They can go overseas where their work will be reliably supported.

jfoiles.bsky.social•15 days ago

My (private) institution, which I could never have imagined attending as a kid from a poor rural high school, will be fine. My (public) Alma mater will be screwed.

edoggthered.bsky.social•15 days ago

What has research ever done for *us*?

socaloma.bsky.social•15 days ago

Exactly, Muskolini and tRump have all the answers, so we don't really need scientists anymore, eh?

sheilassconesnat.bsky.social•15 days ago

The aqueduct?

anto4texas.bsky.social•15 days ago

A joke is a joke and this is a good one.

realkeithlarson.bsky.social•15 days ago

Those top three are all research hospitals. I can’t imagine that they would have high overhead costs /s

terisa1.bsky.social•12 days ago

Overhead costs for labs include chemicals, flasks, test tubes, microscopes, slides, electron microscopes, ventilation systems, lab assistants, janitorial services, pretty much the whole laboratory setup and maintenance. It is amortized among the grant projects working in the lab.

ncbears.bsky.social•15 days ago

How does this save any money. The grant is the grant. If the University isn't getting a larger cut, then there is more for the researcher.

thorvalhalla.bsky.social•15 days ago

You don’t understand how grants work then.

eldano1.bsky.social•15 days ago

Wait, I think he’s right. They’ll have to reissue any existing assistance. Future years, sure.

physfoley.bsky.social•15 days ago

No, indirects are paid *on top of* the nominal award amount ("direct costs"), so this is just less money getting paid overall.

eldano1.bsky.social•15 days ago

Eventually, yes. Of course this is terrible. But the award is for a dollar amount. As a small institution, our rate has bounced around a bit. You just rebalance the direct/indirect amount for the active project period.

anto4texas.bsky.social•15 days ago

Researchers don’t work in a vacuum. Without the adequate resources it’s hard to use grant money efficiently.

cjtackett.bsky.social•15 days ago

Capping the indirect rates, which is how universities ensure everything else around a grant / study are supported, is designed to handicap universities and their budgets.

psbntn.bsky.social•12 days ago

Owning the Libs.

kieslowskifan1.bsky.social•15 days ago

But, but Facebook moderators always corrected me about Project 2025 last year 🙄

excannbiz.bsky.social•15 days ago

Gee, just imagine how much of Project 2025 would be being implemented if T34 hadn't "never heard of it b4"!

brooklynkid53bskys.bsky.social•15 days ago

https://bsky.app/profile/archstreet.bsky.social/post/3lhmvslygsk2f

heathermcg.bsky.social•15 days ago

Does the Project 2025 Mandate say what the end game of all of this is? This many people losing essential services and jobs will devastate economies and communities.

anto4texas.bsky.social•15 days ago

The end game is a white nationalist Christian state and tax cuts for the rich.

sctroyenne.bsky.social•15 days ago

Just to end the woke DEI leftist agenda. It’s bleak.

mdeleal.bsky.social•15 days ago

I want to put a little emoji but not a heart. I want to put something with tears or anger. 😡🤬 Damien the Omen is in the White House.

psleeper.bsky.social•14 days ago

Ain’t nothing savin’ anything immediately. When you make indiscriminate cuts, it always backfires.

okguy.bsky.social•15 days ago

What I’m confused about, how does this win them future elections? They are attacking every voting block across every demographic. This will be the biggest oops we made a mistake or I never voted for him backlash in political history. At this rate of insanity, Republicans might get wiped out in 2026.

khonri.bsky.social•15 days ago

Forgetting the thing where they said we'd have no more elections?

dcirish91.bsky.social•15 days ago

Bingo, they never intend to have a future election, they can never allow a Democratic president this power

scribblegurl.bsky.social•15 days ago

Oh, were you thinking elections are still a thing?

mfsteve.bsky.social•15 days ago

Their voters willingly chose a rapist nazi. Any hardships that arise from these actions will just be blamed on immigrants and gays.

okguy.bsky.social•15 days ago

That only works when the pain is being inflicted on someone else. When is happening to you and they’re the ones in power, there’s only one place to put the blame on the people in power. If they show migrants being arrested on TV, then they’re no longer the problem. At some point
2+2 will = 4.

overit1971.bsky.social•15 days ago

Straight from Project 2025. Project 2025 gained traction in the general election. So much so that Trump had to distance himself due to how unpopular it is. THIS IS WHAT DEMS NEED TO FIGHT ON.

nativgrdngirl.bsky.social•15 days ago

How does this not violate the Administrative Procedures Act?

anto4texas.bsky.social•15 days ago

It most likely does but they don’t care

sallydeal4.bsky.social•12 days ago

This is HUGE. Please share it with folks you know who don't follow the news ... or follow news that would never report on this.

murph612.bsky.social•15 days ago

By indirect, they mean the people to do the work and the facilities that must be maintained for them to do said work.

ddmmrr.bsky.social•15 days ago

The salaries of people doing the research don’t come out of the indirect costs

cjtackett.bsky.social•15 days ago

Bingo

jdonne.bsky.social•15 days ago

you think a researcher only needs 40% of the grant to do the work, but HR costs 60%? Each and every billions of dollars captured by Yale or Harvard? This isn't a crazy policy. These are definitely crazy people, but a stopped clock and all that. I work in nonprofit and 15% is totally normal

thorvalhalla.bsky.social•15 days ago

So how do you think employment taxes, health benefits, office space, lab materials, get paid for? Yes a researcher gets paid a fraction of the cost to do the work. Indirect doesn’t mean unnecessary.

jdonne.bsky.social•15 days ago

You don't know what you're talking about. I manage a 20 million budget. Universities famously have taken advantage of these expenses. Also, fringe rate, what you're trying to talk about, is not part of overhead or indirect

thorvalhalla.bsky.social•15 days ago

Fringe is a type of indirect, as is overhead.

mxphiseatl.bsky.social•15 days ago

It's pretty incredible how confident you are about something you have less than zero understanding of

class-wars.bsky.social•15 days ago

Wrong! The indirects are added on. If the grant is for say $ 1 million and the indirect rate is 50% the total award will be $ 1.5 million. 1 mil for the Research and 500k for the overheads. This is direct attack on Science.

saeyster.bsky.social•15 days ago

That’s not how indirects are calculated. It’s a multiplier on a rate, not a % of the total. Depending on the category it pays for infrastructure, health benefits, administrative staff who don’t perform direct work but are essential to overall project performance. 15% indirect aren’t sustainable.

blancobercial.bsky.social•15 days ago

No. IDC of 60% is on the direct cost. So, the 60 in 160. Which is 37.5% of the total. If you pay everybody a decent salary, and your are not based on free labor, that is pretty normal.

jdonne.bsky.social•15 days ago

That's not how any of that works. These places have over 100 billion in endowments: the grant taking is predatory, just as the tuition rates are

one-ill.bsky.social•15 days ago

You’re full of shit. That may be true for, I dunno…TWO rich universities. Take a look at the Wayne State Universities, not at the Harvards.

ckean02.bsky.social•15 days ago

The majority of research universities do not have this large of endowments. This will cripple the capabilities of smaller institutions. The only places left will be the already uber wealthy. Also, tuition will definitely go up.

blancobercial.bsky.social•15 days ago

... I work at one :) infrastructure, maintenance, power usage, grant administration, etc. We barely cover that with grants. Both at my research institution and at ASU

freedompimp2012.bsky.social•15 days ago

Idk if you’ve heard but all but 2 universities in the country aren’t Harvard or Yale.

ryanamartin.bsky.social•15 days ago

For one. Most universities don't have multimillion endowments and 2, that's not how I direct works, it's a percentage added to the direct cost

eldano1.bsky.social•15 days ago

This is why you don’t put bean counters in charge.

drbethany.bsky.social•15 days ago

Do they think they can get universities to use their endowments to make up the difference? I have a theory -- based on nothing, pretty much just a guess -- that Trump and Musk (and maybe the P2025 writers?) have their eye on all that wealth universities are holding

heidzmama.bsky.social•15 days ago

Well, China probably way ahead anyways.

anto4texas.bsky.social•15 days ago

They are indeed more advanced than us. Wait for all the Chinese nationals leave the US en masse to join the better funded labs in China. It’s going to be even worse.

anto4texas.bsky.social•15 days ago

This will be very bad for public universities without endowments. The costs to buy instruments, maintenance of the facilities, pay for administrative staff etc. come from indirect costs. If you never worked in a research lab please abstain from commenting!

wilrus88.bsky.social•15 days ago

Keep 'em dumb. Keep 'em controlled.

hinebd.bsky.social•15 days ago

ITS NOT JUST UNIVERSITIES

finn-cak.bsky.social•15 days ago

Indeed, no. Businesses as well.

aslajoie.bsky.social•15 days ago

Save money? At the cost of what? Bankrupting the universities who do the research that supports your mission?

Comments

Posting Rules

Reply