there are lots of reasons i couldn't or shouldn't — i'm not very good at it, i don't have the space for anything approaching the variety that interconnected society affords me, it's water-intensive in a drought-prone area, and so on — but i also just do not fuckin want to
i do grow limes and meyer lemons. they require no work because where i live might as well have been designed in a lab to grow them, but even so this winter's limes were over-firm garbage while the meyer lemon tree nearly keeled over from the harvest. because i am not a farmer, i live in los angeles
I feel like this is a thought being jumped over. A world of subsistence farming isn't practical. But a world of communities growing more edible native plants can be a low effort boost to healthy diets & food knowledge while lowering costs, water usage, and food transportation where it can.
I have gardened & have space. I even have canning equipment & have canned vegetables & venison. It is not a cheap endeavor & is totally dependent on weather. It can be a fun hobby but it is not the simple solution so many want to pretend it to be.
Growing food makes me want to punch myself in the face. And every spring I forget that, and every summer I swear never again. And ten minutes ago I just poked some English peas that had sprouted in my fridge into a planter on my deck. Lol 👊🏼
This is me with raspberries. Raspberries thrive here more effectively than I do. Perhaps they are farming me. Seems a silly hobby but who I am to tell raspberries what to do.
Yeah, and while we are at it, we should grow a little extra for the people who don't have the land to do it or who physically can't. Of course then we'll need to develop a system to ensure what we grow is safe to eat. You're a genius, this perspective is truly exhaustive and solves everything.
Do you think most non-US societies in 2025 consist mainly of subsistence farmers?
Do you also truly think the Chinese were "enslaved" by the US? What does that make the Sri Lankans, for whom the Chinese promised to build a port and never delivered?
no I'm saying the smart people in any society both grow their own shit and freely innovate
having direct access to the life that sustains you; influence, understanding, and opportunities to innovate within your own life is what makes great thinkers great
I am not an authoritarian, and I think anyone who listens to them is a silly bully, so I'm literally never advocating for administrative cleanses or anything like that
But yeah, humanity should talk about what's best for the whole sometimes
Acknowledging that we're more living creature than established members of society, we should worry about the former some times
Having people's lives sustained by science and technology, regulated by a wealthy rulers, introduces new levels of coercive force history has never seen
Sounds like my fig tree and grapevines here in NorCal. A fun and cute hobby that produces some fun things every year, but it's never feeding my family of 5. And having figs made my budget go up because now I need to buy so much goat cheese to go with them.
we're not going to "grow" our own meat, and the vast majority of americans live in cities. doing what's available to you in this climate is fine, "we don't have a choice" is nonsense
The Australian food writer Adam Liaw (check out his recipes, they're simple and great )wrote an article during Covid lockdown that was basically "stop trying to make sourdough, the bakers are still doing it and they're better at it than you"
I used to grow some stuff - I had an acre and I was young and had help. We still didn't grow enough to sustain ourselves. Now I'm old, disabled, and live in an apartment by myself. I'm not going to be growing my food, plain and simple.
I grow a fair amount of my own vegetables in the summer, *during the growing season* (because I enjoy it, and...tomatoes!)
I'd be pretty damn hungry November through July if that were my sole source, tho...
Oh, I'm supposed to can them?
Where'd the jars come from?
I retired & started veggie garden. It went well at 1st. My husband would say every yr that was great let's make it bigger. I did. Finally I said then you do the added on part. He didn't. Then wet summer where I couldn't keep up with weeds. I quit. Can't imagine at all if working.
This is why I like to be kind to our farmers, they work their asses off to feed people. One of the truly sacred professions (along with teachers, firefighters, and nurses etc).
Not everyone can. Whether they have the space, climate, or green / brown thumb.
I have the space. I have a decent climate. I have a brown thumb. (And 4 legged cretins who eat my strawberries...)
Seriously, about the only thing I ever grew successfully were a few leeks, some potatoes... yeah.
Louder for the assholes in the back that are loudly squawking about how *all* folks need to do is go to the dollar store and buy some seeds. CLEARLY they have NEVER actually gardened.
it's so hard lol. and like that's great if it's your hobby! that rules! my best friend has a plot in her neighborhood urban community garden! but it is not something we all are going to be doing on top of jobs and other responsibilities
I have a VERY small homestead where I garden and bake my own breads and from scratch meals and all. But I am fortunate enough to not have to work (hubby brings home quite a bit of bacon). I still buy A LOT of our food. It's unrealistic to expect everyone to be completely self-sufficient.
It's so tone-deaf from privileged folks that have never experienced poverty. There's so much $ and time invested for MAYBE something edible at the end IF you're lucky.
I planted blueberries 5 years ago and never eaten more than a couple off them. My apple tree, 5 years & given ONE apple. Lol.
that's a whole other thing that becomes especially acute for me here in la lol. you are wasting water home gardening in la. which is fine, lots of hobbies use resources for joy rather than survival, we gotta have joy, but the moral/sustainability dimension rides AGAINST home gardening, not for it
The one year I grew tomatoes, I had what I thought was a HUGE harvest.
That enormous bounty that I watered and tended faithfully turned into... about 30oz of tomato sauce. Enough for 1.5 spaghetti dinners.
I have a little hobby garden in back with a wide variety of plants to eat but it’s a hobby and ironically the most costly fruits and veggies I consume.
Do you want to work in Coward Nutlick's iPhone factory, screwing circuit boards together with a tiny screwdriver, all day long, for minimum wage? Or do you long for the beautiful clean coal mines?
Canada is Nice. Though I know an ex-Canadian who is now an American MAGA and doesn't like that the Liberals won.
Niagara area on the Canadian side is enormously more vibrant than the NY side. From Toronto - to the west and east - all great. Buffalo and WNY is nice too but far more beaten down.
Old friend of mine originally from around Ottawa and has lived in Banff, Canmore, etc. Loves PEI and wanted to retire there. Canada is what the USA should strive to be like - at least culturally. We're way off now. Staying in that cultural vibe, I'm seeing a Rush tribute band on Saturday...
I spent 8 years there for university. Easily the best city I’ve ever lived in for quality of life. Almost all the amenities of a larger city but small enough to escape it and be out to Peggy’s Cove or one of the beaches in 30 minutes.
I’m a professional gardener, who includes edible plants in my landscapes, and I wouldn’t want to grow my own food either. What makes us great is diversity, inclusion and sustainability, whether we’re talking about food or people.
nary a modern man hath the land nor strength nor knowledge required
to grow the four hundred pounds o grain per person required to survive each year
deluded! no man survives alone
I would like to grow some salad greens and my own herbs, just as a fun little addition to my life. I do not want to have to survive on what I grow and no one who's tried to garden realistically wants that either
One imagines that in early agricultural societies some people farmed while other people did other things than farming. One might go so far as to say that’s the whole point of setting up a central area that grows the food so people don’t have to think about it all day and can go invent pottery.
One could posit that while trade can get out of hand, in general it can be a good technology that allows some people to farm and some people to write poetry or paint pictures or build houses. Perhaps absent the toxicity of capitalism, trade may be a good idea so we can have culture.
I never grow enough tomatoes to can, but we always buy them to can. I’m always ambitious, but by the time I’ve put up 80lbs of tomatoes I’ve usually decided that next year I’m just buying canned tomatoes. (Lather rinse repeat) it’s SO much work
Not just the arable land to do your own farming (not everyone has even that level of access) - but then the space inside to properly store them after harvest and keeping things safe from vermin.
There are many reasons we function the way we do in this regard.
Got a greenhouse after the election because I could see strawberries lettuce and tomatoes being more expensive. Now I’m nostalgic for the days when I thought we could get all through this with victory gardens 😭
As someone with a physical disability, lol, grow my own food, sure, I'll dig my grave while I'm at it. I can barely mow a lawn these days, much less do something like that daily.
I grew up on a farm. We raised all our own vegetables and livestock. It's a lot of hard work that sucks up all your time. It needs a lot of land and resources.
I LIKE buying carrots in the grocery store. I want to be able to keep buying carrots in the grocery store.
And the irony is that a lot of new home developments are built on good farmland that families were no longer able to make a living on (all of coastal Delaware)
Community Supported Agriculture is pretty fabulous too, especially for families. MT nester, now, but when we had a fuller house it was awesome to get that weekly big basket of delicious local in season produce and recipes!
This is so funny because it’s the opposite of me but I 100% get it. You should not have to grow your own food, it should be a fun hobby not a last ditch effort to make sure you don’t starve lol
Comments
so you're saying you're just gonna live in the delusions of America's propaganda bubble?
you realize the average American lifestyle was only affordable because we plundered the world and enslaved Chinese people?
you just gonna die now that it's over?
Do you also truly think the Chinese were "enslaved" by the US? What does that make the Sri Lankans, for whom the Chinese promised to build a port and never delivered?
having direct access to the life that sustains you; influence, understanding, and opportunities to innovate within your own life is what makes great thinkers great
most people in any society are just there
Also, you're a eugenicist.
But yeah, humanity should talk about what's best for the whole sometimes
Maybe that makes our individual lives better 🤯
Having people's lives sustained by science and technology, regulated by a wealthy rulers, introduces new levels of coercive force history has never seen
Urbanization led to decreased mortality, the Enlightenment, the possibility of time without labor, and the collapse of Feudalism.
Sounds to me like that's better than mass deaths of our most vulnerable from a 2 bit moronic scramble for the limited amount of arable land.
#longpig
I'd be pretty damn hungry November through July if that were my sole source, tho...
Oh, I'm supposed to can them?
Where'd the jars come from?
I guess, if it came down to it- I don't want to starve.
Sorry.
Former military.
We learn it through our pores- You do what you have to do to survive, or you die and get a hole in the ground.
So, if I have to, I'm growing food. BUT
Not gonna be happy with the idiots that made it so I have to do that.
Not at all.
I have the space. I have a decent climate. I have a brown thumb. (And 4 legged cretins who eat my strawberries...)
Seriously, about the only thing I ever grew successfully were a few leeks, some potatoes... yeah.
Never again
I planted blueberries 5 years ago and never eaten more than a couple off them. My apple tree, 5 years & given ONE apple. Lol.
That enormous bounty that I watered and tended faithfully turned into... about 30oz of tomato sauce. Enough for 1.5 spaghetti dinners.
https://www.pennlive.com/business/2025/03/coal-company-to-lay-off-hundreds-of-workers-in-pa-and-maryland-after-filing-for-bankruptcy.html
Niagara area on the Canadian side is enormously more vibrant than the NY side. From Toronto - to the west and east - all great. Buffalo and WNY is nice too but far more beaten down.
to grow the four hundred pounds o grain per person required to survive each year
deluded! no man survives alone
However, when my 28 tomato plants all decide to ripen at the same time, canning happens. And the entire neighbourhood gets zucchini.
No one should go hungry unless everyone is hungry.
Subsistence agriculture decidedly less so.
There are many reasons we function the way we do in this regard.
I LIKE buying carrots in the grocery store. I want to be able to keep buying carrots in the grocery store.
Buy from farmers markets.
Support local.
Tell corporate farms to shove their produce up their ass.
I am so tired of supporting those who screw me around.