Fixed that for you @MegynKelly, because you obviously know absolutely nothing about growing up #LGBTQ+. You should try to talk to an #LGBTQ+ person sometime - you'd learn a LOT about how one compassionate, trustworthy teacher can save a kid's life.
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As a parent, wouldn’t you want to know if your child was using different pronouns/names/sexual identity at school? I’m torn on this because I would want my child to know they can count on me to be their ally. How can I do that if I don’t know? That said, I’ll defer to those who have gone through it.
As a parent knowing what is going on with a child. As a human being I have to understand they aren’t my property, and they are going to become adults. We have created a fear society that has to know everything. Think what your parents didn’t know about you, but you didn’t trust to tell them.
I want my children to know that they can trust, learn from, and be supported by adults including, but not limited to, their parents. I want my kids to come to me *when they're ready* because I respect and encourage healthy boundaries. Why would you want to isolate your child by demanding otherwise?
Also, it's just a matter of respecting your kids' privacy. All kids have secrets, just like adults. It's hard as a parent to acknowledge that that separation exists between you, but it's a vital part of letting them be individuals--and teaching them to respect others.
And that information should come from your child, not the school. If your child is frightened to come out to you, then you have failed to create a safe home for them. The good news is, it's almost never too late. Even if you don't suspect your child could be LGBTQIA+, be an outspoken ally.
As a parent, I don't know/don't care how my children are called in school. First name? Second name? Nickname? Who cares?
Did your parents know how your friends were calling you?
Same for pronouns/sexual identity.
(I've got friends, now IRL, who are still using chat nicknames...)
If your child doesn't think they can count on you to be their ally, a law forcing teachers to snitch on them won't cause them to think they can count on you, it will just tell them they can't count on their teachers, either.
Which is the point: they want to keep schools from being safe places for kids to explore their identities independently, and instead make sure schools run like the indoctrination programs they try so hard to make homeschooling into.
The easiest way to have your kid open up to you about these sorts of things would be to just be to show you're an ally, be open and honest with your kid and make them feel like they can tell you things. That's it really if they feel safe they will open up in time.
My parent beat me within an inch of my life because I was outed by my teacher as being "kind of queer" in a writing assignment. I'd probably be dead (no exaggeration) if I came out as trans.
That shit pushed me into the closet for literal decades. So, no. I don't want kids today to go through that.
I would. But the answer isn’t snitch laws. It’s active compassionate engagement with your kid so they will feel comfortable coming out to you. But you have to be aware that so many parents are active transphobic shitheels that kids are scared to talk to their parents. So let’s not isolate them from…
The secret is to demonstrate that allyship, so if your kid is trans or gay or whatever, they feel able to approach you about it.
I didn't tell my parents so many things because I did not feel safe sharing that info. If a teacher had outed me it would only teach me I couldn't trust teachers either.
Yes. If my child couldn’t tell me, I would feel I’d failed my child; if they don’t think home is a safe space, that would be my fault and I’d be devastated.
True, definitely. I think of my brother, single dad; his kids feel so safe with him. His 8 year old started asking about whether two boys could like each other, and I was just so warmed by the loving embrace of that trust and my brother’s supportive response. I want it for everyone.
I think if your kid is happy to tell their hypothetical teacher rather than their hypothetical parent then you haven’t shown them they can rely on you as an ally and no law fixes that. Just go ahead and be an ally without needing any details they don’t want to give you
I think if a child wants anyone to know, they will tell that person. So the question should be "Do you want me to tell your parent/s about this?" And if the answer is no, then don't - although parents' evenings and school events will present bridges to cross, timing should be up to the child.
I suppose you could let your kid know that if they were doing that, you would like to know so you could support them. If your kid already knows they can count on you to be their ally, they’ll likely want to tell you.
I would want to know so I could support my child which is why I do my best to foster an environment where she feels safe telling us who she is. She is a human being in her own right and has the same right to privacy as any adult. These laws only serve to endanger children, not help them.
It’s very normal to WANT to know. But feeling entitled to personal identity information shouldn’t just be a norm, and makes it much less likely that you actually will know. If a child feels they can trust their parent they’re more likely to share, but it’s not inherently their business
As a parent, I hope my kid would feel comfortable telling me that. But as a parent, I know not everyone parents that way. And, also as a parent, I understand that if a kid thinks that the parents are going to be abusive if told something about the kid, that kid probably has a reason to think so.
You're "torn" on laws where if a kid tells their teacher "I'm scared that my parents will hurt me if they know I'm trans/gay," the teacher will be legally required to call up the parents and say, "Hey! Guess what? Your kid is trans. Have fun beating them"?
"Many queer kids have good reasons for not being out to their parents. For those kids, being able to confide in a trusted adult and read relevant books, without their parents' knowledge, is an essential need and right."
I'm really sick of people not understanding that, "gee, gosh, I'd personally prefer [whatever]" is not an excuse to CREATE LAWS MANDATING NEW THINGS. This is the same shit with the bans on health care for trans minors. "I'm not completely 'sold' on the trans thing, so I'm fine with new laws" BS
Also, much like the gender-affirming-care bans arising from fever dreams of pediatricians pushing puberty blockers and surgery on a whim; I bet teachers are more likely to ask "have you talked to your parents about this? Why not? Can I help you have that talk?" than supporters of these laws imagine.
I'm so sick of shitty parents being like, "Wah! The government should step in and make up for the fact that I'm a shitty person who shouldn't have kids in the first place!"
"I'd like to know if..." Then make sure your kids know it's safe to tell you stuff like that.
If you 'need' a law forcing schools to report that their kid is trans even to parents the kid says they're scared will physically harm them, then you are a danger to children.
If you do your job as a parent and actively accept, advocate, and protect them from people who want to harm them, you'll know your kid is feeling safe because they will tell you *everything*.
If your kid isn't telling you everything, you've got work to do.
Of course I'd want to know, that's why I fostered a relationship with my kids where they could tell me those things. If kids aren't coming out to their parents, there's a reason. Or maybe they just need more time, either way forced outing is always bad.
why would your child turn to a teacher in the first place, if they know they can count on you to be their ally? if they do, you need to start thinking about your own parenting, not about needing laws to prevent it
Children are people. The goal of being a parent is to raise independent adults and that means you have to allow for the fact that they will explore things that you as a parent will have no knowledge of
Having said that, parents who treat their kids like people and have open dialogue with their kids without judgement will already know they’re exploring. Anyone who doesn’t already know: there’s a reason.
Adolescents need space to develop their identity and problem solving capacity without surveillance and reporting. I have adolescent children and I get where you’re coming from, but we can only give them the support they ask for — and sometimes that support is leaving them be.
I told my teen son that "sometimes there are things you don't want to talk to your mom and dad about, and that's OK, it's very important to have SOMEONE to tell."
Adults aren't always ready to process something, why expect teens to?
Also, because of how awful some parents are (there are a lot of trans kids who’ve been thrown out or shipped to mental hospitals), it may be easier for a kid to come out to someone else first, so they have a fallback in case their parents are abusive. Public bigotry damages trust, too!
Parents don't realize that when they made an offhand negative comment about some minority or out-group, they're signaling to their kids that parents are likely not safe to talk to about potentially identifying with that group.
And knowing when to act, when to merely observe, and when to avoid observing… and how those change with growth (of both of you!) is part of the Art of Parenting).
I have adolescents too and while I would love for them to trust me with something so private, I also recognize my job is not to make their decision for them. It is to be supportive when they do tell me. To be there for them no matter what.
While I am obviously still going through this with my kids — I hopefully help with our family’s “don’t be an asshole” rule.
Whenever someone is going too far. Being mean, rude, or someone feels like it’s not fun anymore - we tell the family member “don’t be an asshole”. They then stop & apologize.
Let me put it this way: there are three outcomes of outing a child to their parents: acceptance, (or) indifference or disapproval, (or) outright murder, abandonment, or torture. and those last are not hyperbole and they are STILL LEGAL in some places in the US. I wouldn't take the chance.
I’d rather they had at least one place they felt comfortable doing that. If they don’t feel comfortable telling me directly, that’s a fail on my part, and it would be wrong to demand that others tell me/seek permission to address them in the way they want at that time
As a parent, you have had a decade or so to build a relationship with your child in which they feel safe and supported enough to tell you themselves. To demonstrate your trustworthiness.
Okay there are two things going on here. One of them is being yelled very loudly: if you foster a safe environment with open communication, the child will be more likely to express themselves in a more true manner - however
Older queer and trans people often suffer from what is known as the curse of knowledge when it comes to the closet. It's hard to remember what life was like in it after we have escaped it. I was raised by two lesbians, I was terrified to come out.
The closet is a social structure in which parents have an influence, but so too does the community around the child and the media they consume. It all comes together to build a narrative of what is okay to be. The closet doesn't operate on logic, it operates on survival instinct.
If your child isn't ready to come out to you, for whatever reason, the best thing you can do is respect the autonomy of their identity. They are going to be who they are with or without your input. Just be patient and supportive and they will come to you in good time.
Forcing the conversation by invading their autonomy will only harm them in the long run and destroy whatever trust they may have in you. Source - I'm queer, trans, in my 30s, have had over a decade of therapy figuring this shit out, and have extensively studied queer behavior in social settings.
Dude my dad used to believe being LGBT was linked to paedophilia do you think it would have been remotely safe for a teacher to tell him about my gender stuff as an actual kid? He probably would have sent me off to conversion therapy to "fix" me before I hurt someone.
Like I promise if you come off as a person that accepts trans people your kid will happily tell you. My mom knew I was trans many years before my dad did specifically because of his past bigoted behaviour (notably my dad has since grown as a person and is no longer queerphobic).
It's often said that trust is a two way street - but this adage doesn't address power dynamics well. In a relationship where one person has a lot of power over the other and the other person has none, the powerless person will only trust if they're certain it won't be betrayed.
This can be hard to stomach if the parent learns that they have somehow lost the trust of their child - especially if the parent means well and genuinely cares. But for one reason or another, the child in that situation believes that they may be harmed. Trust can't be coerced, only grown organically
The parent has to make it clear to their child that they're a trustworthy party and will not betray or abuse the trust of their child. I trusted my parents with sensitive information as a kid because I believed them - but they threw it in my face and violated my privacy. I never trusted fully after.
It can hurt to think that one's child may not fully trust you and yet the difficult part of being a parent to a child is to understand that, at the end of the day, the child is their own person and that has to be honored. If the environment is genuinely good, they can eventually trust you with this.
And even then, if you're a supportive parent, you'll understand if your kid isn't ready to tell you yet for whatever reason. Sometimes we're just not out to everyone at first. It's up to the individual, which a kid is, not an extension of the parent.
my dad loves me, & he’s asked me if i was gay in a loving/open way, but i’ve also heard him say homosexuality is a sin, & that this is fundamentally disprovable, no matter what anyone says. so he created a safe container in that moment of asking, but his actions outside always indicated otherwise.
yeah, people bes like that. He may mean both, and be conflicted himself. The thing to look for is how the disapproval would leak out of him and if it would be hurtful to you.
i do think he means both and is definitely conflicted. the man is all conflicts lmaoo i love him for that honestly and we’re very similar in that regard
it’s already been hurtful to me. i’m not gonna parade my sin around him. there’s a lot of silent judgment in my family & ion need all that. at this point, i’m hurting myself more by not being my full self & addressing that hurt, but feel there’s too much at risk. i could lose contact with my nieces.
If you're trusted as an ally, they'd tell you. If you aren't, then they won't. Its normal and natural for children to individuate away from their parents, typical, really.
Anyway the reason those rules exist is that some parents are bad. This isn't really mysterious.
I mean, ffs, I simply decided I wanted to be called Andy instead of Andrew in school to experiment with it before telling my parents.
CIS kids who are not gay or trans are going to get asked if they are, simply because they pick a more gender neutral name. And there's going to be consequences.
It's also super normal for people coming out (at any age) to start with people who they trust but don't depend on. If things go sideways, they don't lose everything and if it goes well they have people "on team" for the higher stakes comings out
There's a certain obtuseness that comes through in all of these like comments as if they can't possibly imagine the scenario where a child wouldn't be safe with their parents and its a tough look in my general opinion
For sure, and you're honestly more on point here. But I've known enough well-intentioned parents *who I know are allies because of how they treat me* baffled that their children come out to them late in the process and them knowing that it's about building support and confidence, not them, helps
Its a thing, coming out to your parents has real stakes! I'm not really sure that I would come out to my mother, the Thatcher of the rolling Indiana hills, anywhere other than last and she's never shown me anything but (her understanding of) love and affection
A whole lot of people who purport to believe in small government actually believe in a state powerful enough to compel the speech of children, because they know that their children know how untrustworthy they actually are.
"My child is so afraid of me that they know better than to ever tell me about their lives, so the government should force them to" is a thing people are willing to say, out loud.
To the parents, kids are pretty quick to know who they can and cannot trust. They make mistakes sure but most of the time, they're a pretty good at checking out parents in how they act, how they speak about something.
If they don't trust you, that's a you problem. Not the kid itself.
I trust MY parents because they've never given me the feeling that they'd used whatever I could tell them against me.
But I know many people who have had to hide everything from their mom or dad because ANY statement they'd make or action they took could later be weaponized against them.
It's a bit funny in a way that kids feel far more willing to be open about things when parents aren't constantly prying or demanding that kids tell them everything - some parents try so hard to get their kids to not have secrets but instead have raised really good liars.
Glue a lgbtq flag sticker on your computer, or something like that. And every now and then at dinner talk about trans rights issues, like how angry you are about some news from another state. Basically, put out clear signals that you are supportive and willing to talk, but don't press the issue.
So often the kid is trying to process confusion or doubt but doesn't dare ask the parents (besides believing they already know what the parents think). Not always due to rejection, sometimes they're just afraid of letting the parents down or causing stress or having parent try too hard to "help".
If you actively demonstrate that you are fighting for a world that includes LGBTQ people and grants them full human rights, your kid will feel safe telling you. If you are doing nothing or filling the world with a lot of small homophobic and transphobic remarks then your kid won't trust you.
Like it's really simple. And so making a law that narcs on some of the most vulnerable kids probably just is absolutely terrible. But because you just said that you think we should throw trans kids under the bus for your comfort, your kids would pick up on the fact that you don't care.
Are you so sheltered and ignorant that you can't imagine the existence of violent transphobia/homophobia? Or do those kids not matter as long as your kid gets narced on?
LGBTQ youth keep “secrets” like this from parents as a means of safety, usually b/c they don’t feel their parents will react positively. Coming out to family can be a huge, life-changing decision.
So the best you can do as an ally parent is make sure they feel safe to tell you.
Every child needs a trusted adult in their life. They spend at least 65% of their life in school. So if they feel like the parents can’t be there for them, then a teacher is a natural substitute. To break that trust would be devastating at best, and threatening their lives at worst
If you as a parent want to know that stuff it's your job to raise your kids in a way that makes them feel comfortable telling you that stuff. If someone's kids aren't telling them then that seems like a skill issue on the parent's part.
My son is trans. Because I'm actually an ally, he told me when he was ready. The teacher shouldn't be burdened with the responsibility of making sure you know who your child is. That's on you. As an ally 😑
I would. But my wants aren't the most important thing here. My kid could trust me with that knowledge. But if he feels that he can't, I'd want his teachers to be on his side, not mine. Their duty is primarily to him, and to me only to the extent that that serves him.
it is such a cliche that people are in therapy because of shit their parents did but many people still don't get the memo that a lot of parents do not have their childrens' best interests at heart, especially so if their children are LGBT+
If you make me pick between keeping kids safe and their parents feelings being hurt, I'll pick safe 10 out of 10 times. If the kid thought it was something they could share with their parents, they would have.
What a parent wants to know isn't as important as what a child needs. Parents do not get to decide their children's needs. We are here to provide for them. If they need time and space to work things through before talking to us, then we provide them that time and space. That's our responsibility.
I'm sure others have said this already, but violating your kid's privacy/agency & taking your knowing out of their hands will, in fact, send the opposite message: It will cause your kid to think you LESS of an ally. Real allies do the work cuz it needs doing, not to convince others they're an ally
As a parent, I would do everything I could beforehand to make sure that my kid trusted me enough to tell me before their teachers. If they don’t, that’s on me, not the school system.
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Some parents are awful. They’re abusive. There are very good reasons to keep secrets from abusive people. Eg. Avoiding abuse.
Sometimes kids do stuff outside if their parents view to work out their feelings
Don’t take offence and keep trying to be one more safe space for them
Did your parents know how your friends were calling you?
Same for pronouns/sexual identity.
(I've got friends, now IRL, who are still using chat nicknames...)
That shit pushed me into the closet for literal decades. So, no. I don't want kids today to go through that.
These laws will kill kids. It’s that simple.
I didn't tell my parents so many things because I did not feel safe sharing that info. If a teacher had outed me it would only teach me I couldn't trust teachers either.
Make sure your children know by your words and actions, and they will come to you.
"Many queer kids have good reasons for not being out to their parents. For those kids, being able to confide in a trusted adult and read relevant books, without their parents' knowledge, is an essential need and right."
"I'd like to know if..." Then make sure your kids know it's safe to tell you stuff like that.
If your kid isn't telling you everything, you've got work to do.
Adults aren't always ready to process something, why expect teens to?
No, the global "you" may not ask me how I know. Or, ask away, but unless I know you, I won't answer.
Whenever someone is going too far. Being mean, rude, or someone feels like it’s not fun anymore - we tell the family member “don’t be an asshole”. They then stop & apologize.
But the foundation is always “don’t be an asshole”. We always love each other. Support each other. That will always be the case.
If you have failed to do so, well that's on you.
Anyway the reason those rules exist is that some parents are bad. This isn't really mysterious.
CIS kids who are not gay or trans are going to get asked if they are, simply because they pick a more gender neutral name. And there's going to be consequences.
That their kids should be obligated to share literally every single thought, action or event in their lives with their parents.
It's super wack....
If they don't trust you, that's a you problem. Not the kid itself.
I trust MY parents because they've never given me the feeling that they'd used whatever I could tell them against me.
But I know many people who have had to hide everything from their mom or dad because ANY statement they'd make or action they took could later be weaponized against them.
I chose to have my own privacy, I did -not- trust my own family for safety reasons, learned that very quickly.
This is for parents who want to punish their kids for not being straight.
LGBTQ youth keep “secrets” like this from parents as a means of safety, usually b/c they don’t feel their parents will react positively. Coming out to family can be a huge, life-changing decision.
So the best you can do as an ally parent is make sure they feel safe to tell you.
If parents want to be on that list, they should demonstrate that they are safe and supportive
Forced disclosure and outting only hurts kids and pushes them deeper in the closet making schools more unsafe
I would think their teacher is a dick for snitching on them.
But then again, I don't hate trans kids.
Not everything needs to be helicopter parented