Everybody's mad at this dude for this post, but are we not in *exactly* the kind of situation Jefferson described in the Declaration of Independence? That passage that dumbass right-wingers are always quoting?
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We lose 45k Americans a year to guns. Necessary we’ve been told to protect liberty. Well, we’re are the well regulated militias stopping these unlawful acts?
Listen, Liberals and Leftists ain't picking up a gun to Do It any time soon, and conservatives are honky dory with the direction the country is going in. I'll be very honest that the chance of anything dramatic happening is very low, we're looking at a Francoist Spain situation if anything
Last resort solutions are a well-documented American tradition.
Don’t count on liberals to let this slide. You’re all in crosshairs if you won’t stop this madness.
This isn’t a threat.
It’s the consequences of foolhardy aggression against a free people.
Fight with us, maga, or …
Choose wisely.
The list of grievances in the Declaration is worth a reread. I am, and I suspect many of us are, quietly hoping that it will magically work itself out, but…
Dude’s got a point
This administration is like a bad fungal infection— it’s not just going to get better with time
Treasonous Traitorous Anti-American Racist Adjudicated RAPIST PutinsBiaatch45 deserves nothing less than the Death Penalty under US Law for his Treasonous,& Traitorous Acts against WE The People's US Constitutional Republic Democracy&Rule of Law Against Tyranny! IMFO, the Sooner, the better!
Trump is sending people to concentration camps. If someone kills him it will be self defense. I prefer impeachment, removal, and life in prison, but if he dies it is a win.
It does if you're spending time "win[ning] over a majority of people...by sacrifice and commitment" rather than fghting to keep people from being sent to foreign gulags RIGHT NOW.
But sure, that was the key to stopping Hitler, so let's try that.
I agree, nothing should be off the table. I believe if all avenues fail us; if the checks on power no longer function; if the people of this country are being terrorized, disappeared and killed, the option of fighting should be considered. We should plan now to use all the tools we have.
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Hope that enough sanity remains within your State Defense Forces, National Guard, State Police and the FEDs to stand up for your constitution and with the people if your current administration decides to radically erode it, or undertakes other unconstitutional steps that endanger your country.
“Killing” isn’t the point or goal. And this is different in a big way than Jefferson’s day.
After WWII
Karl Popper’s paradox of tolerance is the point. At that point, whatever it takes.
But it can’t happen here, or so we were led to believe.
Violence can most definitely be avoided, but the onus is on those who have the knowledge and resources to organize an effective resistance and educate people. This is something that the Democratic Party is unfortunately incapable of in its current state.
The short answer for when we must kill is: when we have no other choice. And it looks more and more as if, fascist sociopaths having trashed the Constitution and smashed all the supposed guardrails for democracy, we may be nearly there.
Better wake up, there could be a one-way ticket to a Salvadoran prison with your name on it and you won't know it until masked ICE agents put a bag over your head.
Since when do Nazis stop being Nazis by talking???? Seems to me that everyone on the right have already filled out their kill lists years ago. And the Nazis-R-Us media sites constantly push them to add more names....
The 2nd Amendment was made to fix problems like we are having in this country. A rich tyrant is in control and making laws without proper legislative action.
His first "Executive Order" went over the line of what's acceptable. Should have been enough.
They don’t want to deal with this shit either, nobody wants to throw out their whole life being The Guy. Like that’s what makes the Luigi Mangione thing so astoundingly unusual
What those on the right fail to realize is that Lefties own 250,000 + guns in the Country and that’s probably an underestimate. They also fail to realize that we -as a whole -will stand up for those who are persecuted and treated unjust. This Country is a tinderbox- THEY are the match!
It was a hard piece to read. But if we're being honest, each of us has wondered what "the line" would be, in our own lives.
How much fear will we accept?
How many freedoms are we willing to give up?
How many deported neighbors is too many?
This came from an Economics blog. From a PhD student who hopes to reduce the suffering in Sub-Saharan Africa. From a very intelligent and reasoned person, as far as I can tell. We are clearly on the cusp.
The military need convincing to do the right thing, it's the large unknown elephant. If someone knows where the chips lay with the general staff's support for trump, they can be very valuable in instigating a popular military backed coup. I'd love not to see that, but less than the alternative.
I'd argue peaceful revolutions are largely toothless *if*
1) The people in power have no conscience
and/or
2) They are not supported by, at least, the specter of violence if civil disobedience is not respected.
On a practical level, the IRA and their political arm Sinn Fein are a fairly good modern example that much of the Western world both knows and can think about without the filter of xenophobia tinting their perspective.
Another parallel with today is British black sites like Gitmo were random detainees were brought for torture. Within a month it ended up gaining popular support for the IRA.
Stuff I did not know.
It's worth acknowledging here, too, that Kevin Roberts (Heritage Foundation) was truthful in calling this a revolution. His insistence that it would remain peaceful only if the left allows it to be, though, is a callous lie. They have already made it violent. The left can't undo that.
I didn’t say that. What I said was that there is no principle behind the idea that you can use violence as long as you believe you are right on the merits (that there really is a threat to American Democracy).
Exactly. Now they're rounding up people they claim aren't U.S. citizens and sending them to a foreign gulag. But maybe we should just keep shrugging and hope the next time the Supreme Court is more clear that it's not okay.
Right, they earnestly believed American Democracy was under threat. That they were wrong on the merits is irrelevant to the principle that if you believe American Democracy is under threat you should be able to resort to violence (which is what Dave is insinuating here).
Comments
Last resort solutions are a well-documented American tradition.
Don’t count on liberals to let this slide. You’re all in crosshairs if you won’t stop this madness.
This isn’t a threat.
It’s the consequences of foolhardy aggression against a free people.
Fight with us, maga, or …
Choose wisely.
Dude’s got a point
This administration is like a bad fungal infection— it’s not just going to get better with time
They are not civilized and they don't want to live in a decent society.
(actually exclusively backed up by armed African Americans, many of them veterans)
Non violence only works if you also know how to do violence.
https://www.motherjones.com/media/2014/06/quick-reads-nonviolent-stuffll-get-you-killed-charles-cobb/
But sure, that was the key to stopping Hitler, so let's try that.
Fuck them.
I’m in.
https://gofund.me/47d5d914
https://gofund.me/47d5d914
“A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.”
~ Thomas Jefferson
After WWII
Karl Popper’s paradox of tolerance is the point. At that point, whatever it takes.
But it can’t happen here, or so we were led to believe.
This is a dumb comparison
We actually elected this fucker, and he’s right here, not way over there
Like completely unaware that you’re dumb as rocks, just scrolling Bluesky, drool dripping down your face, happy as tits.
I actually imagine it’s a nice blissfully ignorant life. So good for you. Genuinely.
His first "Executive Order" went over the line of what's acceptable. Should have been enough.
But here we are.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=jSQ5fsW-MbE&pp=0gcJCdgAo7VqN5tD
https://web.archive.org/web/20200604182411/https://theshovel.com.au/2020/06/04/nra-accidentally-forgets-to-rise-up-against-tyrannical-government/
How much fear will we accept?
How many freedoms are we willing to give up?
How many deported neighbors is too many?
1) The people in power have no conscience
and/or
2) They are not supported by, at least, the specter of violence if civil disobedience is not respected.
Stuff I did not know.
But of course it’s fine in this instance because we’re right on the merits…
do you think John Brown was wrong to use violence? Was Lincoln? Should America have sat out WWII?
Revolution is the solution.