Why are we not doing this? Never seen a more "no brainer" policy. Even people who are the most strongly opposed to immigration tend not to object to top scientists coming here. - ThreadSky

samfr.bsky.social • 56 days ago

Why are we not doing this? Never seen a more "no brainer" policy. Even people who are the most strongly opposed to immigration tend not to object to top scientists coming here.

Reposted from The Guardian

Norway launches scheme to lure top researchers away from US universities

Comments

martinnhw.bsky.social•56 days ago

Because our HE sector is on its knees?

drpwest.bsky.social•56 days ago

Probably because we can't afford to pay them. A worrying indication that the Govt don't intend to sort out uni funding or increase research council spending?

jasongood.bsky.social•56 days ago

Have you not seen The Ipcress File 😱

😂😂

unmariuss.bsky.social•56 days ago

Because UK unis can’t offer competitive pay, it’s as easy as that

dennispatton.bsky.social•56 days ago

Staff get paid?

marktierney.com•56 days ago

Re your last comment: you'd be surprised, particularly if they're brown or Asian. And yes, the UK should be cleaning up on this but this govt seems weirdly stupid about it?

ruthdeyermond.bsky.social•55 days ago

If the management of the UK HE sector has any sense they'll be at least as focused on luring international students who were planning to go to the US before it turned out that expressing the wrong views could get you snatched off the street and disappeared.

marycorcoran.bsky.social•55 days ago

U.K. not attractive as a destination to study, it pains me to say. My younger family members want to study or do post-Grad in Europe or Canada. U.K. has lost ‘soft power’ in a global economy.

brennick.bsky.social•56 days ago

Runcorn by-election, mate.

fiferchris.bsky.social•55 days ago

We should be. But what do we really have to offer? Who in their right mind will come to a country that isolates itself (Brexit), is racist and less than welcoming to foreigners (Farage/Reform/Tories) and is desperate to rid itself of Human Rights (ECHR). Heck, even Reform MPs leave (Tice/Oakeshott).

marycorcoran.bsky.social•55 days ago

Well, it sure would feel like home…

edwinmix.bsky.social•55 days ago

We are doing the opposite. We want to keep foreign scientists away and encourage our native scientists to leave. Science is too "WOKE" for tiny MAGA brains to tolerate.

tadaaa.bsky.social•56 days ago

Probably too focused on addressing our woeful productivity

He says only half joking

justlee.bsky.social•56 days ago

We've decided that higher education isn't a national priority. There are a lot of decisions that would need to be reversed to be in a position to attract top scientists to the UK.

jillongovt.bsky.social•56 days ago

not just Norway.. Australia, Canada, France (I think) -- but requires both funding and probably cutting our visa costs

normandiecj.bsky.social•55 days ago

Yep. France is keen to encourage international scientists to come to Europe / France.

chrisdb9.bsky.social•56 days ago

I contacted my mp @jowhitemp.bsky.social about this. She has responded on other bits but ignored this one.

ses67.bsky.social•56 days ago

Because the flag shaggers will get frothy mouths!

gsoh31.bsky.social•56 days ago

Mainly because there are no HE levers left to pull I suppose - the UK govts have basically abandoned the sector to an unplanned quasi-market. Who would they even phone or pressure? Almost all unis would just say 'haha, no chance'.

jydenham.bsky.social•55 days ago

While that is true, the point about being in government is that you can always make specific beneficial things happen if you want to (even if you can’t fix everything)

ruthaylett.bsky.social•55 days ago

Because they are deep in a) 'we'll fight Reform by cutting immigration' b) We have to cut public services (except for war) - when they COULD set special quotas and offer funding sources

winchesterlunch.bsky.social•55 days ago

Such a shame considering common language. Wasted opportunity.

katherineschof8.bsky.social•55 days ago

Because Yvette Cooper and Reform

freewheeling.info•55 days ago

Because until the OBR score it in the autumn, its upsides don’t actually exist - so it would be officially a cost with no benefit?

omaromalleykhan.bsky.social•55 days ago

Between 1901 and 2024, 35% of US academic Nobel Prize winners were immigrants.

They were 19% of *all* academic Nobel Prize winners

Obviously small numbers but a similar ratio will apply to a wider definition of 'top'

omaromalleykhan.bsky.social•55 days ago

For comparison: 12% of academic Nobels went to UK based scholars

boatdesigner.bsky.social•55 days ago

The truth is that the HE sector in the UK is currently losing tens of thousands of academics, many of them researchers. Whilst I think it would be great to take on US researchers, we need to sort out our HE sector first.

sjsedmonds.bsky.social•56 days ago

Fiscal rules Sam, fiscal rules, and would need a superhuman effort at UKRI and universities, plus we wouldn’t want to upset Trump would we?

saltednuts.bsky.social•55 days ago

We are not doing it because Starmer won’t upset Trump and it would also ‘impact on immigration numbers’
You are welcome

stevehumphrey.bsky.social•55 days ago

People don’t realize how low pay is in UK academia. With current pay structures, it wouldn’t be possible to have a policy of recruiting from the US.

jimob1.bsky.social•56 days ago

Involves funding + foreigners + imagination + ambition + joined up thinking + actively doing something. All verboten under Labour.

lucamenato.bsky.social•55 days ago

Because unattractive is as unattractive does.
And before Trump took office it was Brexitland that was probably the least attractive English-language destination.

kayewad.bsky.social•55 days ago

It won't take much, just promise not to arrest them plus some decent healthcare... Bingo!

elencaldecott.bsky.social•56 days ago

My guess would be because UK HE is hemorrhaging staff through both voluntary and compulsory redundancies all over the shop. And rumours about institutions teetering on the brink of collapse are rife. We're about as attractive as Andrew Tate with a headcold.

jackmoxley.bsky.social•55 days ago

Pretty sure a headcold makes him more attractive, mostly because running away is far easier.

putt1ck.bsky.social•56 days ago

Norway's got rather more surplus cash

nicktheinventor.bsky.social•56 days ago

We’re Oslo on the uptake, Norway we shouldn’t, I can’t Bergen to imagine why not, etc

ashherbert.bsky.social•56 days ago

There's simply no way this Labour government would ever propose a policy that remotely looks like we're taking any sort of advantage of what America are doing

drpaulitious.bsky.social•56 days ago

UK needs a new watch. It keeps missing the bus.

normandiecj.bsky.social•55 days ago

The problem there is, in daily, non-work life, top scientists (& their families) don't wear badges with their job title. Since 2016, representatives of GB have been busy on the international stage telling the world that GB hates immigrants. So if you sound or look different, why risk GB?

clarniugin.bsky.social•56 days ago

But your former boss was against experts...

graham-marchbank.bsky.social•56 days ago

They have a sovereign wealth fund from oil unlike the UK/Scotland sadly

shodanalexm.bsky.social•56 days ago

Also, while UK professorial salaries might look good locally, they are not very competitive globally. Someone at a good US university could easily be earning twice what they'd get here.

catharina24.bsky.social•55 days ago

It was called ‘the brain drain’ for a reason..

shodanalexm.bsky.social•56 days ago

The visa costs etc for international academics in UK plus housing costs are crazy relative to salaries, particularly for families. I've a colleague actively looking to return home - they are happy in the UK but the finances don't make much sense.

garytorr.bsky.social•56 days ago

The way things are going in the UK, coming here would be like staying in the US

chris666999.bsky.social•56 days ago

It is clear that Starmer does not care about our universities. They are not part of his plans. He cares building constructing airports, theme parks and about Scunthorpe steelmakers.

alexhardy1987.bsky.social•55 days ago

I’m not sure that presenting a load of money for incoming American academics because they’ve decided to have another national flirtation with fascism would do much for workplace morale, given the stagnant nature of salaries here.

alastairmeeks.bsky.social•56 days ago

It's the equivalent of leaving bundles of £50 notes lying in the street for someone else to pick up.

ianstev91.bsky.social•55 days ago

You can sum up the roadblock in two words. Yvette Cooper.

alanjstedman.bsky.social•56 days ago

Damn these countries who are not part of the EU because they wanted sovereignty, the ability to move quickly, to be light on their feet when opportunities arose

Oh!

brillaben.bsky.social•56 days ago

Labour scared of upsetting the Fash, who are never going to vote Labour in a million years.

dennispatton.bsky.social•56 days ago

6 fingered slack jaw types?

tom-richmond.com•56 days ago

Don't forget France:
https://www.dw.com/en/french-program-for-us-scientists-draws-flood-of-applicants/a-72279414

And the Netherlands:
https://nltimes.nl/2025/03/20/netherlands-launches-fund-lure-top-scientists-like-fleeing-us

And Australia:
https://www.theguardian.com/education/2025/apr/17/australian-academy-of-science-global-talent-attraction-program-trump-research-cuts

toddgoldsbie.bsky.social•56 days ago

Canada is a lot closer and we're on the case.

toddgoldsbie.bsky.social•56 days ago

https://www.torontotoday.ca/local/education/university-toronto-hires-three-prominent-yale-professors-worried-about-trump-10433643

emilarchambault.bsky.social•56 days ago

3 profs going to one university is in no way a sector-wide investment. Canada's not doing anything.

toddgoldsbie.bsky.social•56 days ago

I doubt you're correct but time will tell. In any event, these were pretty good catches.

carolwildbird.bsky.social•56 days ago

Yes- why are we not doing this @darrenpjones.bsky.social @lizzicollinge.bsky.social

minzylikesjazz.bsky.social•56 days ago

I thought Yvette Cooper was smart but instead she's obsessing about net immigration numbers.
When is the Labour front bench going to understand that they will never appeal to Reform voters, no matter how many idiotic policies they implement?

mazzerooni.bsky.social•56 days ago

Given the choices - would you actually come to Brexit island ?

climatedaily1.bsky.social•55 days ago

It costs money. We didn't set up a sovereign wealth fund when we had oil revenues. Norway did.

danlowe.bsky.social•56 days ago

If you've been to Norway, it kinda explains it. When I went, I found it felt like a weird pre-Brecit idyllic where everything actually works.

nerdlegend.bsky.social•56 days ago

Same reason why we're not cutting visa fees, helping save universities and more. They say one thing do the opposite due a fear. Unwilling to make a positive case.

ktrivv.bsky.social•55 days ago

Because Yvette Cooper

johnhuww.bsky.social•55 days ago

It reflects a lack imagination on the part of DSIT (perhaps AI can help !) There many approaches that it could chose to adopt to attract and retain world class people in our Universities or for that matter Public Sector Research Institutes. It requires leadership and cross funder collaboration.

stefaniabarutta.bsky.social•55 days ago

Could it be that the UK is one of the most expensive places to arrange a visa, our Unis are bankrupt and they can’t afford to pay ££££s for extra visas when they cannot keep the lecturers/researchers they already have. We have also lost numerous EU research grants. Thank You BREXIT!

jhudsy.bsky.social•56 days ago

Every scientist I've spoken to recognises the opportunity here and would love to do this. However, even if the visas were there, for all but a very small handful of institutions it's a non-starter without significant government investment given the current financial crisis in HE.

ullamr.bsky.social•56 days ago

They should withhold the visa costs...

sallyl.bsky.social•56 days ago

Because we include foreign students & researchers in the immigration figures (we shouldn't) and because we are apparently trying to keep immigration figures down.

dennispatton.bsky.social•56 days ago

Foriners innit!!

pickle1805.bsky.social•56 days ago

Because it would require an explicit acknowledgement of what is going on in the States.

francischubb.bsky.social•56 days ago

Exactly this

elmanz.bsky.social•56 days ago

Example: The 1000 scheme.
200 K salary by the government for la crème du la crème science, technology and humanities thinkers and researchers. (Half of that salary will be taxed). Let any other expenses such as grants, offices, labs etc be sorted by unis.
That will be 200 million pounds per year!

elmanz.bsky.social•56 days ago

Starmer is never a confrontational with US.

papillon19.bsky.social•56 days ago

Who's life is he protecting ??

ellenenders.bsky.social•56 days ago

we did this after ww2 and during the cold war

before fox news & P2025 aholes

lourencojml.bsky.social•55 days ago

I think UK elite scientists wouldn't necessarily like that.

michaelmhopkins.bsky.social•56 days ago

The lamentable truth is we cannot afford the researchers we already have because most UK universities are in a financial crisis. That crisis is due to immigration policies that reduced the UK's appeal to international students, who were contributing billions to the economy in fees, rent, food etc

postiepaul.bsky.social•56 days ago

The problem? We have a Reform government maskerading as a Labour one!

sueryan66bskysocia.bsky.social•56 days ago

We are actively preventing the best and brightest due to the draconian Brexit visa rules.

nearsighted.bsky.social•56 days ago

Starmer is scared of Trump thats why

alasdaircameron.bsky.social•56 days ago

I fear the government’s unwillingness to change its public narrative on the US to recognise its hostility will cost us dear. They could be hammering Reform in this way too, but so far they won’t.

fourteeneighteen.co.uk•56 days ago

We appear to have no long-term strategy for anything at all. Energy, transport, defence, industry, health, research, nah. All sacrificed for right-wing soundbites.

clearlier.bsky.social•56 days ago

Too much of a long term play for politics in the contemporary world?

pascalr57.bsky.social•56 days ago

Short sightedness? But there again, is the UK an attractive destination without EU membership and funding?

dd-prague.bsky.social•55 days ago

Why would top scientists move to a country that wrecked its own economy in order to keep foreigners out? Hardly a fuzzy welcoming feeling.

michaelhigham11.bsky.social•56 days ago

Because HE is already bursting at the seams. Simply, there aren’t enough jobs to go around. So adding US-based researchers to the mix will just oversaturate an already incredibly competitive marketplace. Also worth noting that there’s slightly less competition and more funding in Norwegian academia.

officialstehee.bsky.social•56 days ago

The Labour untermensch have been identified. The Disabled, Poor, Trans and Immigrants. Nothing shall deflect labour from this fight.

loop16.bsky.social•56 days ago

Assuming that’s a rhetorical question as it’s surely down to our cowering, corporatist, captured, pitiful government.

andygeology.bsky.social•55 days ago

Why: Because research funding is already being cut, many UK universities are already making redundancies because of a current funding shortfall / anticipated future cuts. So there is no way to pay for it.
Should we: absolutely. But stopping cuts to UK research funding must happen first.

moon-monkey.bsky.social•56 days ago

Politicians seem froken in fear of this. See Cooper's reaction to extending Student Visas?

cchogan.bsky.social•55 days ago

There are several initiatives already, like UKRI and Fullbright.
And there are long-established partnerships between the UK and the US where universities collaborate on both education and research. A common language helps too!

cchogan.bsky.social•55 days ago

This is where I'm not sure people understand the "Special Relationship" is. It is not really about the politicians. It began with intelligence sharing (and that is still true). But it involves all kinds of co-operation in and out of government, and it will quietly continue despite Trump

kiersturmer.bsky.social•56 days ago

UK higher education is a mess, Labour are terrified of doing anything to upset Trump/the USA, Labour are terrified of (imagined) Reform voters

liamshields.bsky.social•55 days ago

You would think so. Isn't the UK likely to be the destination of choice for US academics who don't fancy Canada?

notjobloggs.bsky.social•56 days ago

Visa fees are a huge disincentive. The uk in this, as in all sorts of policies, is very shortsighted.

jsargentr.bsky.social•56 days ago

If you think something is a no-brainer, it may be that you failed to engage your own.

rostaylor.bsky.social•56 days ago

Politically and financially difficult when universities are sacking tens of thousands of people.

acmcgregor.bsky.social•56 days ago

Which is itself due to their choice to count students as part of general immigration and sharply reduce the numbers coming (also impacted by Brexit ofc)

abusefreezone.bsky.social•56 days ago

Not labours choice. Unfortunately the rhetoric put out by Tories/Reform that students could bring all family members with them if they want means reversal of the policy will not be popular with the public. I regularly have conversations with usually “sensible” people who believe this rubbish.

tadaaa.bsky.social•56 days ago

The long tail of Brexit strikes again

dennispatton.bsky.social•56 days ago

I have always regarded students as er, students. Students know they are here short term. Tories and Labour just sucking up to the idiots. Many urban ateas will suffer economically losing the 'student economy'.

dennispatton.bsky.social•56 days ago

Yep. Management of these establishments seem to be completely off their heads.

robussc.bsky.social•55 days ago

The UK has also proven itself capable of random acts of self-harm. So I doubt it looks an appealing alternative anyway!

jamesinbrussels.bsky.social•56 days ago

I think it's just a case of other European countries needing to sing it from a higher rooftop that the UK, which is actually what the top scientist in the US would default to as an escape route.

rholmes.bsky.social•56 days ago

UK has poor salaries and standard of living compared with other European countries. Switzerland and Germany look much more attractive. For outdoor life, Lund and Oslo.

jamesinbrussels.bsky.social•55 days ago

I would wager American academics, or indeed most migrants, are more keen to settle in a place where they speak the lingo even if it means a salary hit, but you're right that the state of UK academia and their salaries/standard of living could be more competitive.

mrgavhinks.bsky.social•56 days ago

No expert here, but from the news it seems we can barely pay for the academics we’ve got.

laughingravy.bsky.social•56 days ago

Starmer’s a coward

hellsop.ninehells.com•55 days ago

I mean, step #1 is "keep funding actual scientific research", which seems is not an austerity-compatible path...

eicathomefinn.bsky.social•56 days ago

Is it a "no brainer"? UK HE is in financial crisis, shedding staff & closing departments. Notable US defections to Toronto are social scientists (not much of interest to UK backers of "science", sadly). Moving them is much easier than a team. (Keeping them is another thing). It's complicated.

jonroberts.bsky.social•56 days ago

The UK government would have to show it can invests in and value higher education for this to work. Given the trouble HE finds itself in right now, I can't see the UK being that appealing to US academics.

dennispatton.bsky.social•56 days ago

The downward spiral of Britain.
Third World and not even a turnip available due to climate change (flooding).

ereshkigal99.bsky.social•56 days ago

Universities are firing the staff they have, because the funding model is broken. Whole sector needs proper funding, but gods forbid we raise taxes to make the country work. (Sorry, v. pissed off with Labour govt).

childofnovelty.bsky.social•56 days ago

Because Labour continue to kill the university sector to pursue their petty xenophobia, just like the Tories before them.

catharina24.bsky.social•56 days ago

In theory, but: https://www.timeshighereducation.com/news/uk-university-redundancies-latest-updates

chrislintott.bsky.social•56 days ago

One answer is that it would inevitably take money away from the top scientists who are already here who are already dealing with catastrophic cuts to the research budget.

chrislintott.bsky.social•56 days ago

There’s a strong case for making us an alternative for younger US researchers but that means improving the research environment in general. Else they will go elsewhere.

sophiacollins.bsky.social•56 days ago

But there must be tens (hundreds?) of thousands of US researchers and other knowledge workers out of work, all of a sudden. Presumably you wouldn’t even need to offer the previous market salary…

chrislintott.bsky.social•56 days ago

Who will fund their labs? Their access to postdocs and students?

sophiacollins.bsky.social•55 days ago

Yes, I get this. I’m just imagining that if I was a newly unemployed researcher in the US right now, I’d be considering a job as a lab tech, if it meant I could get out of there. It’s a horrendous situation, and it’s only going to get worse.

deadlyvices.bsky.social•55 days ago

I work (for the moment) at a university which is currently making substantial job cuts. It's a well established Russell group institution too.
It's painful enough to give existing researchers their marching orders. It's insulting to then welcome émigrés with open arms.

sophiacollins.bsky.social•55 days ago

This is also a valid point.
I suppose we all are playing fantasy football (fantasy academia?) where the UK HE sector isn’t a binfire and everything is as we’d wish.

theoxforddom.bsky.social•56 days ago

Norway is the last country in Europe with any money...

callymeg.bsky.social•56 days ago

Considering the costs, I don't think a smaller salary would be a good idea!

sophiacollins.bsky.social•55 days ago

This is completely true. Also the visa difficulties of bringing a spouse with you.

ibster.bsky.social•56 days ago

What about the younger researchers here? Where do they go? Given the state of academia in this country, with so many on precarious contracts and so few substantive posts, flooding the market with US researchers (usually paid so much more) makes little sense.

alialiafro.bsky.social•56 days ago

My guess - Someone somewhere in Labour HQ has clocked that immigration is likely to fall on their watch, so they have a plan to weaponise this in future elections, and they’re going to make damn sure that nothing messes up the figures [such as attracting some of the worlds top scientists].

millglenindustries.bsky.social•56 days ago

We're not doing it because even the appearance of encouraging any sort of immigration is verboten in the McSweeney strategy.

eeleach.bsky.social•55 days ago

Actually unis are doing it without trying—little need for govt levers. Vacancies currently attracting very strong international field as US academics vote with their feet. We’re just trying not to vaunt our Schadenfreude as it’s a slightly smug look.

matthewkilburn.bsky.social•55 days ago

This is good to know.

eeleach.bsky.social•55 days ago

Mind you, these are not new jobs, just turnover in normal run of things. And lots of UK HE is cutting jobs and/or not renewing posts so probably limited. But search I chaired last month had a shortlist with 3/4 US based academics and 1/4 from UK on it

matthewkilburn.bsky.social•55 days ago

I would like there to be new jobs through all kinds of avenues in the present climate, but government is to say the least cautious.

kaceyvarren.bsky.social•56 days ago

All sensible countries are....

tjmarsden.bsky.social•56 days ago

Indeed. But when the government seems to be trying to rule temporary students into the migration stats rather than quite sensibly counting that separately, we probably can't hope for anything here. A No Brain Policy, for sure.

callymeg.bsky.social•56 days ago

rwdwhite.bsky.social•56 days ago

This government specialise in shooting themselves in both feet every morning.

robinbisson.bsky.social•56 days ago

You're not the only person thinking this - chairs of both Commons and Lords science committees told us the same

Potential US trade deal staying govt's hand?

https://www.researchprofessionalnews.com/rr-news-uk-politics-2025-3-uk-ministers-urged-to-lure-us-researchers-hit-by-trump-turmoil/

robinbisson.bsky.social•56 days ago

John Bell also said the same earlier this week https://www.researchprofessionalnews.com/rr-news-uk-politics-2025-4-uk-has-massive-opportunity-to-attract-us-scientists/

dennispatton.bsky.social•56 days ago

The Earthworms hold all the cards.

kevshaw99.bsky.social•55 days ago

Because our HE sector (outside Oxbridge and one or 2 in London) are in horrendous financial situations, and high profile US academics get much higher pay than those here.

If we had a sensibly funded HE sector, we could snap them up.

But we don't.

stefaniabarutta.bsky.social•55 days ago

Also the UK is one of the most expensive places to get a Visa, the most expensive in Europe actually, and those UNIs which are already nearly bankrupt can’t afford to keep the lecturers/researchers they already have.

garretbeggan.bsky.social•56 days ago

Why do successive UK governments pursue stupid, self-defeating policies? In episode 97 of our long-running series, we'll explore...

randomname99.bsky.social•55 days ago

The government should just take out full page ads in the mail.

THESE ARE RICH WHITE PEOPLE. REALLY RICH. REALLY WHITE

Hey presto, immigration fears gone🪄

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