I know this is extremely vulgar idealism, but I do think we should try to aggressively reassert the norm that lying is bad. Not in a "Four Pinnochios" fact-checking kind of way, but in a way that frames this kind of lying as moral degeneracy that is fundamentally corrosive to the human spirit. - ThreadSky

ositanwanevu.bsky.social • 1 day ago

I know this is extremely vulgar idealism, but I do think we should try to aggressively reassert the norm that lying is bad. Not in a "Four Pinnochios" fact-checking kind of way, but in a way that frames this kind of lying as moral degeneracy that is fundamentally corrosive to the human spirit.

Reposted from Justin Baragona

Elon Musk says "10% of federal expenditures" are due to people having fake Social Security numbers, claiming it is "half a trillion dollars."

Comments

sovietcola.bsky.social•1 day ago

Vance reprimanding fact-checking was strange

sbaudelaire.bsky.social•1 day ago

i seriously think that people affected by public lies should be able to press charges, or at least sue for damages

youtackything.bsky.social•1 day ago

I do wonder if, like, former SSA administrators could sue for slander.

sbaudelaire.bsky.social•1 day ago

probably, but i was suggesting a new law which specifically outlaws public lying when those lies adversely affect people

heykatieday.bsky.social•22 hours ago

Politicians creating a law against lying? Only in our dreams.

sbaudelaire.bsky.social•22 hours ago

politicians shouldn't be allowed to eat food, much less make laws

spin4srv.bsky.social•1 day ago

I think we all believe this (us reading your post). But for the intended audience to receive the message it needs some pizazz. Something that will break through into the zeitgeist.

"Why would a man who doesn't see 12 of his 14 kids care about _your_ social security?" etc.

faithlessgrace.bsky.social•23 hours ago

And in this case, punishable by law. If you lie to the American people at this scale, with these consequences… prison.

coreycohen.bsky.social•22 hours ago

I’m not sure we want the government deciding what’s a lie. Imagine that in effect now.

faithlessgrace.bsky.social•22 hours ago

Let The Hague do it. There has to be some consequence for the damage he is causing and he doesn’t get to slither away saying “I thought it was the right thing. He is lying. His bullshit performance on Fox was a lie. Everyone KNOWS he is lying.

danbongard.bsky.social•8 hours ago

The Hague doesn't have the manpower to police global political speech. Even if it did, letting a selection of government appointees from other countries dictate who can hold office in America is just another way of saying "end democracy in America". Bad idea, and Trump beat you to it anyway.

evocadotoast.bsky.social•13 hours ago

I mean... I *get* what you're saying. At the same time, there's an entire body of law regarding defamation and fraud that addresses situations where the government needs to determine what's a lie

hillary-atp.bsky.social•13 hours ago

What’s that I smell? Pants on fire! Oh Elon… liar liar grifter grifter

assiduousrabbit.bsky.social•23 hours ago

Old Pennsylvania saying "Scratch a liar, you'll get a thief."

bentripp.bsky.social•19 hours ago

scratch the shit out of him

cuhome.bsky.social•22 hours ago

Too much ketamine

stopfamilyabuse.bsky.social•22 hours ago

Jesus Fucking Christ. Is he straight up lying . What th fuck is wrong with his speech pattern? Is that when he's lying ?

russtofferson.bsky.social•22 hours ago

As if white evangelicals give a shit about bearing false witness or most of the other commandments they pretend to care so much about. At this point the hypocrisy is a flex.

darthbob88.bsky.social•1 day ago

As Christian as a lot of conservatives are, we might get some traction framing it as "bearing false witness". https://www.patheos.com/blogs/slacktivist/2024/09/12/thou-shalt-not-bear-false-witness-against-thy-neighbor/

chainsawhands-joe.bsky.social•1 day ago

Question what does “degenerate” mean to you in this context

chainsawhands-joe.bsky.social•1 day ago

like this? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_degeneration

kushghost.bsky.social•1 day ago

elon musk is a lying degenerate

chainsawhands-joe.bsky.social•1 day ago

What do you think degenerate means?

chainsawhands-joe.bsky.social•1 day ago

Do you think it means something like this? Or are you comfortable unthinkingly adopting this language? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Degenerate_art

chainsawhands-joe.bsky.social•1 day ago

You are using a coded antisemitic/homophobic/racist slur and you don’t even realize it.

curtistired.bsky.social•2 hours ago

We should take it back from them instead of preemptively capitulating to their hijacking of words. I think that Donald Trump and Elon Musk and their entire administration are degenerates. I’m aware of how Nazis use that word. I’d rather reclaim it and make it powerless for them

4animallife.bsky.social•20 hours ago

Agree.

Also what drug is Elon using that gives him dry-mouth? I know weed does, but does ketamine do that, or coke like Don Jr's always wasted on?

bertieruss.bsky.social•11 hours ago

also calling lies lies. It's constantly taht Elon/Trump say a thing that is grossly untrue and the media says "Elon/Trump doesn't understand how the thing works"

No they know. They are lying, because they are liars.

butlertron.bsky.social•1 hour ago

can we start prosecuting people for perjury please? hold some of these fucking liars in contempt of congress?

williamchatnoir.bsky.social•1 day ago

For most of human history there was no printing press & most people were illiterate. Society couldn’t rely on written records & contracts. A person’s reputation for honesty was everything. In recent memory, a President lying was shocking news. Now we’re governed by criminals who rule by lies.

toddgoslin.bsky.social•11 hours ago

I don't think they view it as lying so much as a necessity distortion of reality to help support whatever bullshit narrative is en vogue.

sarahthurmond.bsky.social•1 day ago

I can hear Kellyanne Conway now: He’s not lying. He’s just doing alternative math. 🤥

jakemadtown.bsky.social•1 day ago

Or as JD Vance would say - Musk is "creating stories".

sarahthurmond.bsky.social•1 day ago

Well he should know about creating stories.

notjoeking.bsky.social•1 day ago

Great. So cancel those fake cards/numbers, investigate the perpetrators, and then go home.

🙄

No need to cancel any other programs or keep DOUCE around any longer.

jerseytigerfan.bsky.social•1 day ago

This. Exactly this. And sensible media (if any still exists) should call him out on this. As should Democrats.

paresisting.bsky.social•1 day ago

Only the media would disagree with you because they are bought and paid for by the rich

petekotz.bsky.social•1 day ago

Capital idea, Osita.

dneumde51.bsky.social•1 day ago

Oh God this jerk is DO FULL OF SHIT. LETS JUST GET RID OF HIM. ANY SHARPSHOOTERS OUT THERE?

jegath.bsky.social•12 hours ago

😂😂😂

ebonyeyes3524.bsky.social•23 hours ago

Lies!

aattraversatto.bsky.social•23 hours ago

you know, he makes this shit up. right?

ericmn.bsky.social•12 hours ago

It might work to use Lonnys's constant lying to the public specifically to cancel all of his government contracts.

peter-butler.bsky.social•11 hours ago

Honestly that's probably our biggest failure of the past decade

the17thqueen.bsky.social•10 hours ago

When we say “we”, we should be clear that the media has utterly failed here

decib.bsky.social•9 hours ago

Click bait conflict makes $$$

advocatetruth.bsky.social•6 hours ago

I disagree.

Psychologists Susan Fiske & Shelly Taylor have characterized humans as “cognitive misers.”

“People are limited in their capacity to process information, so they take shortcuts whenever they can.”

This is academia-speak for intellectually lazy, and is exhibited by almost all humanity.

pattikroen.bsky.social•10 hours ago

Totally agree. The behavior of this administration flies in the face of all the ethics and morals we are taught since childhood. Lying is unacceptable. Be kind to others. Take care of those less fortunate. If only there was a book somewhere that preached those teachings...that they all like to quote

streamthevote.bsky.social•23 hours ago

Here’s my favorite clip to post when people are lying.

gluonspring.bsky.social•1 day ago

It should have real world consequences. People shouldn’t associate with this kind of lying, shouldn’t do business with people who lie like this. You should get fired for telling public lies about public matters.

maymoesmith.bsky.social•1 day ago

What a pathological liar !Trumps maganazis https://will.eat shit if they are told it's yummy!

puzzlesthewill7.bsky.social•1 day ago

Musk and Trump/Liars, Inc.

doctormu.bsky.social•22 hours ago

MAGA, Musk, and Trump are in the FIND OUT phase of FAFO.

dawnddurante.bsky.social•1 day ago

He’s mentally ill. He probably believes what he says.

sea-burt0654.bsky.social•22 hours ago

Thank you! The word “lying “ is like “fuck”. Strong. “False” “fake”
“Mis”. LYING truth.

lookwhatlisadid.bsky.social•1 day ago

mollypeonies.bsky.social•23 hours ago

This is a fantastic idea, actually. What would it look like to even hold true to one simple value in American culture, politics, and systems. Believing lying is truly deeply unethical would require turning this country inside out—and I think that sounds like a lovely promise.

uriaheaped.bsky.social•1 day ago

For those in public office, “liar” should be on equal level as “racist.”

beege4.bsky.social•14 hours ago

He is the easily accessible weak underbelly.He lies because he has always lied including on his naturalization papers.He lies because he is a drug abuser.He lies because he won’t pay child support and abuses his children. He lies because he has tanked 3 businesses and is tanking ours. Give the why.

coyotebee.bsky.social•1 day ago

They lie because they think their base is dumb enough to believe it. We need to start hammering that they think Americans are stupid and hate them and that's why they lie to them.

wheezie1960.bsky.social•23 hours ago

Yup, and not one of those people can receive a ss cheque or any other benefits

jimmyparks.bsky.social•1 day ago

Yes! We have to punish liars again. Stop putting them on tv and asking them more questions.

partyof555.bsky.social•12 hours ago

The Republican Party is an entire group of fraudsters & liars- Trump, Bannon, Rick Scott, Ken Paxton…

I wish every reporter would call them out on their “10 commandments in every classroom” bullshit & ask them on the spot about their lying.

dbinmtl.bsky.social•1 day ago

Full of shititis

angela617.bsky.social•1 day ago

I appreciate and support this earnest idea. Thanks for sharing.

cks490.bsky.social•1 day ago

And if they don't want to call it lying, call it either lying or being so aggressively misinformed that it is reckless and stupid

freeulysses.bsky.social•1 day ago

kathykustra.bsky.social•6 hours ago

He’s so full of crap. I’ve run Medicaid programs 2 states (and local elections.) Illegal “aliens” get neither Medicaid nor voting rights. Yet he’s treated like the oracle.

m154n7hr0p3.bsky.social•10 hours ago

It’s human nature. People live in fear of telling the truth on the daily. It’s the norm

wpichickenhawk.bsky.social•1 day ago

A real federal government would have a “Truth In Politics Act” that would expel shitheads for disseminating lies to the public.

Preventing them from holding any office at any level.

elchopo99.bsky.social•1 day ago

in a funny way, the fact checkers essentially ruined the ability to call a lie a lie. they justify their existence by finding creative ways to "well, actually" every single blatant lie.

this article was one of the few over the summer that called them out for it

https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/politics-news/trump-harris-abortion-project-2025-politifact-1235087146/

themilfmag.net•1 day ago

@brooklynmarie.bsky.social

afaf-freedom.bsky.social•1 day ago

All of social security is only 20% of the budget. So this fucking moron is saying 1/2 of it is fraud. Jesus, being this stupid should hurt.

snortingwoke.bsky.social•7 hours ago

There needs to be an enforced law that strictly prohibits disinformation and has punishments that scale up based on the guilty party’s ability to pay.

iechydda.bsky.social•21 hours ago

Is the flock eating this feces?

twitterfugee49.bsky.social•23 hours ago

I think “why are you so full of shit?” and not letting him deflect or redirect until he rage quits the interview is the way.

Do it every time time a camera is in his face.

Need to change it up? Ask him about what it’s like being a rich deadbeat dad.

bigdicmystik.bsky.social•1 day ago

Amen

ainteefa44.bsky.social•1 day ago

But how would Fox exist then? 🧐 that might mean having Dem politicians that actually called out the lying liars that lie. To their faces. All the time.

handlegrip.bsky.social•11 hours ago

To lie is the most basic betrayal of humanity. You taint our ability to communicate. You incorporate false concepts into our thinking and planning. It is a betrayal above all else. You look like a human, you are trusted like a human, but you are reduced to carrion animal consuming trust.

handlegrip.bsky.social•13 hours ago

Musk is acting like a venture capitalist. Go into a business and start destroy its operations. Vilify the workers. Make all kinds of changes and walk away from the consequences. By the time they are finished, they have extracted the soul of the business, value stolen and bones auctioned off.

aymiejoi.bsky.social•12 hours ago

That's exactly who he is and what he has done time and time again. None of his "businesses" were actually his to begin with, and he's destroyed or is actively in the process of destroying every one of them.

handlegrip.bsky.social•11 hours ago

I agree wholeheartedly! “A legend in his own mind!”

taylorscheinuk.com•1 day ago

No you're absolutely right. No more of this polite "agree to disagree" bullshit. When it's a matter of fact vs opinion, fact needs to be the period at the end of the sentence, full stop.

cariroy.bsky.social•1 day ago

Caring & competence? I'm surprised his pants didn't burst into flames when he said that. What a lying sack of shit he is.

yastreblyansky.bsky.social•14 hours ago

Sign me up. There should be no reason for a Democrat to spread a lie.

nathkovich.bsky.social•1 day ago

Someone should smack him with a gauntlet.

myanulrich.bsky.social•1 day ago

Totally made up numbers. Lying,amoral degenerate.

dgstudios.bsky.social•1 day ago

What is give for a single government official to speak like that

mn-marvel-girl.bsky.social•1 day ago

This man can’t math

farmer52nb.bsky.social•23 hours ago

He just makes shit up

runlorun.bsky.social•1 day ago

Show the receipts, mf.

howdidwegethere.bsky.social•1 day ago

There's a particular degeneracy in telling lies to justify doing things people would never support if you told the truth about it, and I hope there's a hot place in Hell for people doing it on the regular

les1013.bsky.social•22 hours ago

Liar

tendaibsky.bsky.social•1 day ago

You are so right. There was a time where evangelical Christians believed the devil was the personification of lying itself - now lying is a necessary evil. The moral decay is reaching new depths.

arenowve.bsky.social•23 hours ago

He should be interrupted by someone saying "did you just lie on national television?"

r3fugiado.bsky.social•23 hours ago

It's FOX.. somebody needs to challenge this shit. They keep repeating and before you know it they get away with it and grandma's plug gets pulled.

bamamontana.bsky.social•21 hours ago

It’s FOX - grandmas’ favorite channel!

r3fugiado.bsky.social•21 hours ago

Yeah it's going to be like the NYT stories of undocumented migrants that are all in for Trump. With granny all for cutting SS for "cheaters". The big lie 2.0

josipk.bsky.social•16 hours ago

Turns out granny's gonna find out who's cheating. Who says old people can't learn!

matesrsen.bsky.social•22 hours ago

If they were the kind of journalist who would ever respond like that, then - to paraphrase Chomsky - they would never be sat next to Elon Musk.

norsetom.bsky.social•11 hours ago

And it certainly doesn’t help when a fool interviews the liar.

ann-atar.bsky.social•23 hours ago

I like that idea, and imagine if it was normal to think that musk's brand of willful ignorance was immoral when a person or entity has so much power over the standards and quality of life of so many others.

paulcallahanmv.bsky.social•1 day ago

I suppose a quantitative rebuttal kind of misses the point, but this is as nonsensical as the assertion that Trump won the 2020 election. If there were $500 billion injected into the economy like that, it would show up in macro statistics.

But yes, Musk is a stinking liar. That's a better takeaway.

subones12.bsky.social•1 day ago

Yes, just say THATS A DAMN LIE! Why won't people do that??!!

funnyhowitis.bsky.social•1 day ago

Just another classic case of alt-facts.

leflaneur78.bsky.social•6 hours ago

It's bad leadership that turns a good country into a wasteland of lies and propaganda. Trump's and Musk's childish habit of lying to get what they want has infected the Repubs in Congress who can no longer be trusted to govern with any integrity whatsoever. It's embarrassing, sad, and shameful.

crimeisnotacrime.bsky.social•6 hours ago

America was never good

modestproposal48.bsky.social•4 hours ago

Ending slavery after a brutal internecine war was pretty good.

Ending both German and Japanese fascism was pretty good.

You'll always find whatever you're looking for.

crimeisnotacrime.bsky.social•3 hours ago

Slavery was never fully abolished.

How was Japanese fascism ended?

modestproposal48.bsky.social•3 hours ago

1) I think you'll find it was.

2) Google it.

elusiveblue.bsky.social•3 hours ago

No, it very much was not. The 13th ammendment includes exceptions to slavery and indentured servitude if the person is convicted of a crime. It's laid out plain as day in the text of the ammendment. Just smug and wrong.

crimeisnotacrime.bsky.social•3 hours ago

We still have slave plantations. Reconstruction was never completed: https://apnews.com/article/prison-to-plate-inmate-labor-investigation-alabama-3b2c7e414c681ba545dc1d0ad30bfaf5

The US dropped two nuclear bombs on Japan, an unnecessary act that mirrored the horrors perpetuated by Imperial Japan.

uncalledfour.bsky.social•23 hours ago

I don't want pieces of paper that say this isn't normal. I want hot brass that says this over and we can start to rebuild again.

rbminsf.bsky.social•5 hours ago

You nailed it.

dhanoka.bsky.social•1 day ago

Prove it, Elon. Show us the f*cking balance sheets!

mnbirdwatcher.bsky.social•1 day ago

Nobody asks for proof.

larkraf.bsky.social•23 hours ago

FFS all BS , he finds trivial bits of info , and then misconstrues most of it .. eeeejjjjjits

silversalty.bsky.social•1 day ago

"Moral degeneracy that is corrosive to the human spirit."

An encapsulation of Elon Musk.

suroresort.bsky.social•1 day ago

Is Elon suggesting the Social Security Admin, for which I worked for 40 yrs, pays SSA/SSI benefits to individuals who use a fake SSN? Or that procedures are not in place for other Fed & State agencies to verify an SSN? Which, BTW, is mandatory. 😱🤣🤣

amyb63.bsky.social•1 day ago

Do you think we are going to lose our SS soon? People will be living in the streets.

suroresort.bsky.social•1 day ago

That would be horrendous for everyone on SS. I wish I could confirm your benefits will continue, but decisions are being made about every Fed agency that I never thought possible. I hope not.

amyb63.bsky.social•1 day ago

This is all so devastating for so many people. Thank you for your 40 years of service to the American people. ❤️

bicyclekix.bsky.social•1 day ago

The former head of the SSA certainly thinks so
https://www.cnbc.com/2025/03/01/doge-actions-may-cause-social-security-benefit-interruption-ex-agency-head.html

witchy224.bsky.social•1 day ago

Lying liar lying i am so sick of this already. Why is it only the things him and Trump hate fleeing cut and gutted? Not the war machine that includes musks 38 billion plus in blowing up rockets and taking money from Poland and claiming he is the all mighty one

vootongaat.bsky.social•16 hours ago

He has been and still is a liar. His entire career has evidence of him lying

llessu.bsky.social•11 hours ago

Sometimes at the heart of a lie is a betrayed truth. Elon just proposed a 500 billion dollar cut to Social Security.

martymishkin.bsky.social•1 day ago

Wow, Musk is as bad at data analytics as the pillow guy, and I did not think that was possible.

notagback5.bsky.social•22 hours ago

👏👏 well said!!!!

The erosion of consensus and ultimately objective reality is key to the success of a bourgeoning fascist movement.

They want us paralyzed and docile.

DO NOT GIVE IN!

ghostoflittleseb.bsky.social•9 hours ago

Yes PLEASE

hbrowne.bsky.social•1 day ago

I don’t understand how these people don’t feel the awful racking of guilt and shame when they do this. It’s one of the most powerful feelings a person can experience and they’re just completely bereft of it. Like not to put too fine a point on it, but it’s weird right?

awesomerobots.bsky.social•23 hours ago

There need to be consequences for lying.

adamblack411.bsky.social•15 hours ago

What consequences should there be for the Democrats who lied about Biden's mental competence?

awesomerobots.bsky.social•15 hours ago

Depends on the level of knowledge/involvement. At the very least, every statement they make in the press should be bracketed by "you knew about Biden and said nothing, why should we trust you now?"

adamblack411.bsky.social•15 hours ago

Do you think that will happen?

awesomerobots.bsky.social•15 hours ago

Consequences? In the current political climate? Goodness no!

pokepocalypse.bsky.social•22 hours ago

Used to be cancellation.

Trump should have fucking been cancelled in 1973 when it was shown in court that he was a lying racist piece of shit.

hippiefromthesouth.bsky.social•1 day ago

I don't know what the fuck I am talking about so I will just tell these moronic fucking idiots of MAGA anything and they will believe it.

bandcgames.bsky.social•1 day ago

We need to frame it in their language. Thou shalt not bear false witness is right there just begging to be used

foxfire50.bsky.social•20 hours ago

I think all these morons truly can not do math at all.

saffron1.bsky.social•1 day ago

😂😂😂😂😂

meowshell.bsky.social•1 day ago

My mom always said better a thief than a liar be. You never know if the liar is stealing from thee.

tracy44.bsky.social•1 day ago

#fuckelonmusk #pathologicalliar
#raidingthetreasury

sh33ppurple.bsky.social•1 day ago

We've lived through this frame in The Netherlands too. Because of the fake fraud claims thousands of families got completely ruined. Children got taken away, suicides. The impact was so enormous, special task forces have been working on compensation for years and still are.

theodalisque.bsky.social•1 day ago

Bring back preschool education! (And make it universal!)

brklynmind.bsky.social•1 day ago

The way to punish this lying is to make Tesla ownership something no reasonable person wants to to do.
It doesnt matter how - protesting, vandalism, shunning, mocking, whatever, it doesnt matter.
No Tesla Sales=Tesla stock goes to $0 = No more Musk

gpyr56.bsky.social•10 hours ago

Totally agree. I'm not for Victorian codes of conduct, but truth telling is a basic moral requirement.

semper-veritas1.bsky.social•1 day ago

mlmartello.bsky.social•20 hours ago

He’s a fuckin junkie!! He knows nothing about American government. Go home, you apartheidist!

dkxkee.bsky.social•1 day ago

It's one thing to have a difference of opinion. But just making up and spreading lies isn't "freedom of speech" or "your side of the story." It's just a damn lie.

paulcurran.bsky.social•1 day ago

We don’t have to bother checking. Everything Musk says is a lie. Everything Trump says is a lie. They are already just making up crazy stuff off the top of their heads.

cloudphoto.bsky.social•21 hours ago

And getting away with it.

cblready91.bsky.social•1 day ago

Never listen to a Nazi

mynahleague.bsky.social•1 day ago

Yes, we have to try and regain some standards that serve us well.

georgievarewski.bsky.social•1 day ago

Imagine all the criminal charges that will soon be filed, the confirmation from the inspectors general, and the congressional oversight hearings and reports that will lay everything out (sarcasm)

sheryl1971.bsky.social•9 hours ago

It's part of the Maga culture to lie. It's the narrative they want to spin in order to "own the libs" or some such nonsense. They're actually flirting with propaganda supported by mainstream media

andyharless.bsky.social•1 day ago

Elon is literally the devil.

patbyrnes.bsky.social•22 hours ago

What's this strange word,... "moral"?

tinkerbellehell.bsky.social•21 hours ago

I agree. Let’s bring back rewarding good behavior and aggressively promote the norm that telling lies is bad.

mattbh.com•1 day ago

It’s pretty essential to have one common epistemology in the country to be able to identify truth from lie. The weaponisation of the truth via creating an epistemic breach in America has been a central dynamic since Sarah Palin in 2008.

lynneraughley.bsky.social•23 hours ago

Bring back shame!

bellaciao007.bsky.social•18 hours ago

The power of shame to shape and influence political behavior is something I’m very much interested in.

pixelssideways.bsky.social•23 hours ago

shellsheddy.bsky.social•1 day ago

Musk doesn't even know COBOL-- you think ANY Thing #ApartheidNaziMusk has to say about #OurSocialSecurity is true in ANY manner---?!?
Musk stated that ANYONE who gets #SocialSecurity is a #Parasite.....
GrifterMusk & FelonTrump just want our $$$$

webrant.bsky.social•23 hours ago

Exactly. Because projection is a tenet of fascism for the sake of normalizing its corruption and degeneracy to breakdown society itself to protect it.

We're better than that.

Unlike billionaires where sociopathic greed & narcissism makes everything become just for them at the expense of all of us.

invictusghost.bsky.social•1 day ago

That is a lie. He knows they can not collect SSA purely on an SSA.

isthislifeonmars.bsky.social•1 day ago

This mf-er is coming for my money that I worked for and EARNED, and I am NOT HAVING IT. #GETLOUD

mflowerhat.bsky.social•19 hours ago

THIS.

I genuinely believe that a large part of Nordic countries' success is that being a liar, or not keeping your word, is considered as the most despicable character flaw here.

adamblack411.bsky.social•15 hours ago

The Nordic countries were very poor before the last century. There's no evidence that they became more truthful

mflowerhat.bsky.social•15 hours ago

No honesty has always been held a high value, which has paved way for a high functioning society (see corruption index, for instance).

Also I'd challenge the poverty notion, Sweden (incl Finland) was a major player with quite an advanced government model already in 16-1700s. 1/2

mflowerhat.bsky.social•15 hours ago

Obviously, before industrial revolution, the harsh conditions meant that simply feeding the people would be a massive undertaking.

adamblack411.bsky.social•15 hours ago

The corruption index is fake. Healthcare companies in the US lobbying to maintain their control over a key sector of the economy isn't illegal but obviously corrupt.

mflowerhat.bsky.social•14 hours ago

not perfect <> fake

Fact is Nordics are among the least corrupt countries on the planet.

pastelmagpie.bsky.social•8 hours ago

As a Norwegian, our parliament is a revolving door for both mild social democrats and right wing politicians to become lobbyists or rewarded with high paying positions in the business world immediately after leaving office. I don't believe we're much less corrupt, our corrupt politicians are subtle.

handlehaveruno.bsky.social•1 day ago

I've been thinking a lot lately about the initial spate of Trump lies, and what the editorial discussion around them must have been like. I know you spoke about it happening at the time, evading the obvious word 'lie'; but I'd love to know what the NYT et. al. thought they'd lose re culpability.

mstrofbass.bsky.social•1 day ago

One of my big issues is that we basically spend ~18 years of our early life being told that being wrong is not the ideal scenario and we should do better. Then immediately afterwards we just jettison that concept.

Nobody actually cares about being wrong anymore and it drives a lot of bad things.

mshaf3456.bsky.social•2 hours ago

Liar!

sal52.bsky.social•1 day ago

Still no evidence of any claims of fraud and no grand jury. Just speculation only.

elmobronowski.bsky.social•18 hours ago

...and further that believing an extreme liar is considered a failure of citizenship (it is already considered a failure of responsible decisionmaking in other important matters, but for some reason in the US we've failed to promote the same responsibility in politics)

suvroc.bsky.social•23 hours ago

This guy got where he is full stop by lying his ass off. His pseudo boss too. I'd add we should also assert online annon hate, trolling, and death threats are bad and should never ever been allowed to go on unchecked and unpunished.

dr-rrr.bsky.social•1 day ago

DJT and Elon lie so frequently that the media gets worn down. When Trump lies during a presser, someone needs to call him on it, and when he bullies that reporter, the next reporter needs to ask the same Damn question and challenge the lie. The broken record technique works!

secretoriginz.bsky.social•22 hours ago

Nothing vulgar about idealism. That's the same kind of thinking you're trying to reverse.

chucklestyle.bsky.social•1 day ago

Had a former roommate that was a compulsive liar and also very loud about being Christian and i dunno dude isn't thou shalt not lie one of the big ten

sendakmonster.bsky.social•23 hours ago

Technically it's bearing false witness that's the sin. Which he's absolutely doing.

bravovictorcharlie.bsky.social•19 hours ago

Lying brings down organizations, societies, and civilizations.

Say that you’re in a war zone and one guy on your squad is always telling fibs.

What’s the obvious remedy?

boinkofscience.bsky.social•1 day ago

And also mental incapacity. Like wow, you're probably not smart enough to understand the truth. It must be too complicated for you so you had to make up this silly little lie

craftyprimrose.bsky.social•1 day ago

Maybe washing his mouth out with soap every time he tells a whopper

massyankee.bsky.social•11 hours ago

Bullshit

janerabbit.bsky.social•1 day ago

That is *so* well said! Thank you!

catsheepmon.bsky.social•1 day ago

When did he give this interview

joshtpm.bsky.social•11 hours ago

Agree. A basic moral failing, a defect of character and sign of moral degeneracy.

mel-33.bsky.social•11 hours ago

Absolutely. Unless we want to turn into a nation of orcs in some dystopian nightmare.

theotherjim.bsky.social•10 hours ago

"Drug-addled immigrant billionaire claims..." sounds like a perfectly reasonable intro to any Musk statement, although "hallucinates" and "has conspiratorial fantasies about..." can be substituted for "claims."

framplings.bsky.social•11 hours ago

Liars suck! Let’s unite!

dallas-taylor.bsky.social•9 hours ago

Not unlike hoarding billions of dollars.

libdibnords.bsky.social•1 day ago

Elon Musk has never prepared payroll, or filed a quarterly 941 or a W-3. Fake SS numbers, or real SS numbers being used by multiple people, are spotted immediately and not processed. The taxes paid under those #s go into some dead zone that no one will ever claim. Elon Musk is a fraud. As usual.

stopallbuying.bsky.social•1 day ago

Did he pay any FICA while he and his brother were illegals? Was he working then?

bassofpj.bsky.social•21 hours ago

It's also a matter too of he and his people literally not knowing how the COBOL database system works. Combine that lack of knowledge on even the basics (there's a reason why there are "150 year old" people in the system but it's just a Universal Database Code thing that everyone uses everywhere)/1

bassofpj.bsky.social•21 hours ago

with such a blinkered zealotry trying to find "corruption and fraud" and damn near any salt grain they think they've come across is gonna made into Mt. Everest.

bassofpj.bsky.social•21 hours ago

The funny thing is, anyone who has worked at Sam Ash Music Stores (RIP) or Guitar Center and is familiar with their "green screens" has MORE EXPERIENCE working within a COBOL system than anyone currently on the DOGE team right now.

That's fucking wild LMAO

libdibnords.bsky.social•21 hours ago

I can imagine the scene in a dramedy. Elon hires youngsters who are whiz kids with modern computers but it turns out what he needed was old and experienced and the whizzes have no idea how this ancient operating system works. It'd be hilarious if it wasn't all so stupidly horrifying.

apple431.bsky.social•7 hours ago

Suspect the fake socials are paying in not taking out so when he weeds them out we will loss money

ironprincessm.bsky.social•14 hours ago

This is full on bullshit. No one gets their SS without records of payment, YEARS OF PAYMENT! There aren’t fake ss numbers getting paid. Jfc

telemark.bsky.social•12 hours ago

I mean, I get a letter every year with when I started paying, how much I have paid, and what my projected benefits will be depending on when I retire. I think everyone gets this!

lunaticdevice.bsky.social•22 hours ago

Beautifully put.

irish-norgie.bsky.social•1 day ago

Does he pull these shit numbers out of his butt?

gruelly.bsky.social•14 hours ago

Even if there were half a trillion dollars of fraudulent social security payments, and there aren't, that number doesn't equal 10 percent of the federal spending. Like not only is he lying about the SS, but his math is off if he wasn't.

petergratton.bsky.social•1 day ago

Imagine being an investor and hearing this but going, but I believe him when he says we’ll have flying robot cabs next week.

knitmyworld.bsky.social•6 hours ago

See stock ticker...

hambone717.bsky.social•9 hours ago

It’s not just lying. It’s careful coordinated propaganda. No one accused the Nazis of being liars. The spread propaganda - the “big lie.”

ifill.bsky.social•21 hours ago

Not idealism...it's basic logic

cassprophetsee.bsky.social•1 day ago

Maybe also something along the lines of "I'm not being hyperbolic about the murder part of social murder."

cheryl-blue.bsky.social•6 hours ago

Yes. Those who wish to manipulate and exploit others will also wish to manipulate and exploit the truth.

palelibrarian.bsky.social•13 hours ago

i suggest factchecking with bullets, it'd take so few of them.

blueyintexas.bsky.social•22 hours ago

davewilde.bsky.social•1 day ago

Aren't engineers supposed to be good at math?

ann50.bsky.social•1 day ago

Agree

radioactivegorgon.bsky.social•1 day ago

Anyone who strategically lies to you—outside of recognized and mutually consented play—is not a part of the same society, at least to some extent. There is always a dominating/conflict element to it.

quinnh2o.bsky.social•1 day ago

How about a big red LIAR button?

alwayscorrect.bsky.social•20 hours ago

Has there ever been this level of constant and blatant lying from people in power?? Besides fascists and other authoritarian? I don't think there has in this country. It's out of control.

bentripp.bsky.social•19 hours ago

Trump's first term, but otherwise no

jekmann.bsky.social•19 hours ago

Well, they are fascists, sooo..

alwayscorrect.bsky.social•19 hours ago

Yep, it's just such a mind fuck that people act like it's just normal politician dishonesty. They're like zombies

yoruichidragon.bsky.social•1 day ago

A big question is, given the 0% chance of prosecution, and history of public lies, how can anyone trust the books at his companies?

changegamer.bsky.social•1 day ago

Lying liars gonna lie!

jroylake.bsky.social•1 day ago

Does ketamine make it easier to lie or something?

brooklynkid53bskys.bsky.social•1 day ago

OK, so how do we do this ?

seriously, how ?

jhcannon.bsky.social•8 hours ago

As Abraham Lincoln said to Steven Douglas during their famous debates when Douglas made a dubious claim , “ I call for the evidence.”

ettouslouie.bsky.social•1 day ago

The GOP, trump and his supporters are unprincipled, moral degenerates making it easy for Putin, Russian mafia and billionaires to take over America.

defran.gobirds.online•1 day ago

Imagine a world where lying simply did not happen bc everyone recognizes how toxic and destructive it is. No fraud, no scams, no bs just people being decent and accountable to one another

burntbulb.bsky.social•10 hours ago

I think it's downstream of a lack of regard for the truth. If you can't handle uncomfortable truths, you will be swamped in comfortable lies.

racheltkeeney.bsky.social•1 day ago

When did any kind of idealism become "vulgar"?
As in, I don't believe it is.

ghep.bsky.social•21 hours ago

That anyone thinks Musk is anything more than a spoiled manbaby with a god complex and a Nazi fetish is evidence of how far society has fallen…

eawinick.bsky.social•1 day ago

For those who hang on Musk's every word, I think that's likely the case. Fortunately, a good many people see his statements for what they are: bullshit. And I believe that number is growing.

icuk.bsky.social•1 day ago

I just applied for social security. And I am damn sure ENTITLED to it…

rupertramsgate.bsky.social•1 day ago

Damn right. I applied 3 months ago. Where is my damn money.

icuk.bsky.social•1 day ago

This is going to be bad

donnayoungdc.bsky.social•16 hours ago

It's MORE than just a big LIE. It's a BIG CON. It's using MAGAs' hate for immigrants to con MAGAs into ACCEPTING Republicans killing off #SocialSecurity #Medicare #Medicaid.
MAGAs who have nothing donate to Trump/buy his merch shit. Elon wants their Social Security now, too.
https://bsky.app/profile/donnayoungdc.bsky.social/post/3lk2i3ug3ns2h

donnayoungdc.bsky.social•15 hours ago

And why does Elon want to end #SocialSecurity, #Medicare, #Medicaid?
So Elon can weaken Americans for his pal Putin & use the U.S. Treasury as his personal piggybank to fund his SpaceX Mars fetish.
Elon just needs MAGAs to go along with it. MAGAs' hate of immigrants is key.
https://bsky.app/profile/donnayoungdc.bsky.social/post/3ljy7apigq22o

rodneycremeans.bsky.social•1 day ago

Musk is a fucking liar!

siyandawrites.bsky.social•1 day ago

I say this everyday! Cynicism is not useful. Saying “well they always lie” doesn’t mean lying isn’t bad yall

gvyjr.bsky.social•23 hours ago

I’m sure musks evidence is on the way

gorillagladiator.bsky.social•18 hours ago

What is a person when their word does not mean anything? They are nothing!

conflictgeog.bsky.social•1 day ago

Journalism in the US would be vastly improved if it 1) started from the assumption that any claim republicans are making is a lie absent clear evidence otherwise, and 2) centered stories/analysis around the fact that lies are now the foundation of their politics.

realnuttyqueen.bsky.social•23 hours ago

If he could demonstrate that amount of fraud— and his claim is ridiculous on its face— he and the Republicans would be having hearings on it every damn day.

whyisthat.bsky.social•21 hours ago

I'm shocked they didn't have to hire more people on their staff to investigate every single claim. Gymmy Jordan and Little Jimmie Cramer are pouncers. Names right?

whyisthat.bsky.social•21 hours ago

That's how you know it's not real. Or they instigated the found out fraud.

welcome2absurdia.bsky.social•23 hours ago

When has a lack of evidence stopped the Republicans from having sham hearings before? I’m kind of amazed they’re not running with it, tbh.

diprima01.bsky.social•1 day ago

As usual no proof from our co president

pnwwestcoast.bsky.social•1 day ago

Musk must be a graduate of the Trump University School of Bullshit.

il10per.bsky.social•21 hours ago

Well, as many times as I've called him out and insulted him on his X website, Guess who's gonna be one of 'em..?

infintecycle.bsky.social•23 hours ago

so if there are so many, bring charges with evidence in court.

alexnnder.bsky.social•21 hours ago

He needs to be held accountable for these lies. It’s absurd what he can get away with saying…

aloysiuso.bsky.social•1 day ago

I would vastly prefer a world in which "lying is bad" is not idealism.

charlottebanks.bsky.social•23 hours ago

Unemployment doesn't run through the feds.

Just another lying liar, lying.

mrknowvember.bsky.social•12 hours ago

The US needs to pass legislation that if you lie as a representative of the government, you are no longer eligible to be a representative of the government.

If you lie in order to make a profit, any profit you made from that lie is forfeit.

Include jail time for repeat offenders.

mesugo.bsky.social•1 day ago

Yes, I absolutely love this. Well said. 💪❤️

koglesby1.bsky.social•1 day ago

I agree.

carepelto.bsky.social•1 day ago

Musk is a LIAR!

jeanmoulin4ever.bsky.social•1 day ago

thetd.bsky.social•1 day ago

If you are in government, you should face consequences for purposely lying in the media to the public as a strategy to advance an agenda.

Attorneys get disbarred for knowingly lying in court. Politicians should fave similar sanctions.

ablativmeatshld.bsky.social•1 day ago

Tar, feathers, rail, some assembly required.

cloudbuster01.bsky.social•1 day ago

”Before mass leaders seize the power to fit reality to their lies, their propaganda is marked by its extreme contempt for facts as such, for in their opinion fact depends entirely on the power of man who can fabricate it.”

Hannah Arendt, The Origins of Totalitarianism

jackinsd.bsky.social•20 hours ago

The sycophants are beyond being able to be shamed. Their ability to just make things up knowing half the country will believe it shields them from ever having to own up to anything.