Ours reduced the seating after their 3 month remodel. Most of the other coffee shops are drive through, so really no local space to sit and gather over a coffee anymore.
I spent more than 10 years designing them and they constantly pushed the design palettes toward the colder side, ie grays and less color generally. So the warmth and comfort of a coffee shop became a task in your day rather than a pause in your day.
The design of everything is now grey, plain and neutral. I don’t know why it’s not discussed more as being dystopian. All creativity is being sucked out of corporate imagery.
They seem to have worked really hard to make their stores as uninviting as possible. My 90 yo mom likes to go to her local Starbucks on the UWS and many times now, she cannot sit, her order is placed at one end of the store, picked up at another end. It's so not fun to go there.
Maybe because people get lost in airports, thus encouraging you to feel like you're stuck there and must therefore buy something? Or maybe just to give you that weird what-is-going-on-where-am-I headspace so you'll be easily manipulated into buying something?
In NYC it’s because they can skirt around the laws that require a bathroom if you have seating. Employees don’t want to clean the mess after someone lives in the bathroom for half the day.
I’m guessing armchairs require a lot more maintenance. For a long time, Starbucks’ bread and butter has been the drive-through—it’s not selling itself as the “place to hang out” any more.
My nearest Starbucks (in suburbia) often has a line of cars for the drive-through that looks to me would take 30-40 minutes to get through. Meanwhile, there's about a 5-minute wait inside. People just HATE leaving their cars. It's the craziest thing.
Yes. We need more spaces where you're allowed to exist without spending money. I'd suggest the library though. And some of them even have little coffee cafes!
Kyle Chayka wrote 'Welcome to Airspace' in 2016 | 'We could call this strange geography created by technology “AirSpace.” It’s the realm of coffee shops, bars, startup offices, and co-live / work spaces that share the same hallmarks everywhere you go.'
But it was Marc Augé who had the first insight (1992) of the aesthetic of hotels and airports as 'non-places' spilling into everywhere. See 'Non-Places: An Introduction to Supermodernity'.
And Miya Tokumitsu, Joeri Mol carried this theme into 'The Nowhere Office' (2016) | 'The new office presents itself as the interior design equivalent of everyone’s friend.'
I had to look up the meaning of “liminal,” and my vocabulary is pretty good. If we want messages to come across to the broad public, I think we should use more common words.
Oh, dear, no. I welcome learning, always.
After all, we’re already on the internet reading the comment, so it takes less than a minute to switch sites to look up any meaning.
Never cared for Starbucks. The coffee was always burnt and it’s run like a fast food joint. Now that it looks sterile and uninviting inside, no doubt to inspire you to just get your shit and get out, I have zero reasons to ever step foot in one again. I support local coffee shops instead.
The Starbucks customers I see, mostly seem to sit in their cars in a line for 20min to get a cup of coffee. I just don't understand it. Don't they have a coffee maker at home?
I once managed a S'bux in a ski town with a fireplace and cozy couches, it was tiny and it would be packed when the pass was closed and literally a line out the door after lifts shut down for the day, but the bigger one they replaced it with is 100% an English motorway service station from the 70s.
They can redesign their interiors to look like the Palace of Versailles, the Taj Mahal, or Mt. Vernon. I'll never go into another one or spend a dime on any of their products. Same with any business that has bent the knee and kissed the "ring."
The sad thing is, SBUX lost its way years ago when it abandoned Howard Schultz’s vision for a “3rd place” where people could relax, think, or converse. How does drive-through service provide that? Our local store has a big sign in its window, “Pick-up ONLY” that reinforces that their goal is churn.
I worked (barista) there ~25 years ago & there was always so much talk from corporate about wanting to make the stores "third spaces". It was the first place I, a normie college dropout, heard of that concept. And now they are such cold unwelcoming places. Adding drive thrus was the start of the end
I was a SM when McDonald's introduced specialty coffee and were being considered as competition, our big joke was "but who wants so sit and enjoy a latte in McDonald's!?". We had no idea the corporate solution was just to become McDonalds, only in brown.
this is, I think, one of the big reasons why Starbucks’ ubiquity spurred an indie coffee shop renaissance: people were like “I like the idea of this place, if its coffee and vibes didn’t suck”
And, they are all dirty, entry doors, glass around coffee area, counters, trash area and what is w one trash can only and no trash can outside?! I can find better coffee elsewhere
although it seems like they realize that made a mistake and are redesigning to make stabucks more of a "third place" again with cozier chairs and ceramic mugs
Speaking for myself, never understood the Starbucks craze. Maybe because I drink my coffee black. SB's sugar-fied drink is nothing more than teeth rotting liquid candy. I just never understood the craze for it.
I've heard that this is why most restaurants play music inside even though most people find it annoying. They're trying to increase turnover. It's annoying on purpose.
Bars have made their music loud because of a study that showed that loud music makes people talk less and drink more. Now 80% of the population thinks sports bars are too loud.
Yeah and loads of them have remodeled to take away public bathrooms (which is asinine seeing as how coffee is an actual diuretic 🙄) and they already removed outlets …
They decided they didn’t want people enjoying each other’s company in their space. They made the spaces inhospitable and primarily designed for drive through and mobile orders. What I can’t figure out is the revenue advantage of doing this.
Because they don’t want anybody sticking around. There are still Starbucks locations in Denver that have never re-installed tables since the pandemic, and don’t allow more than two people in the empty dining room. They’re paying for retail space but run it as a walk up counter.
Cuz they aren't coffee shops anymore. They are designed to get as many drive thru orders out as quickly as humanly possibly. Frankly I'm surprised most of them still allow inside customers. One near me only has the drive thru open. Often. As a pedestrian that is beyond annoying.
I thought this post was about Starbucks? No🤷♀️Did I not understand the post is about why Starbucks is gone to a cold empty place void of personality and a comfy place to enjoy coffee?
the only time I ever set foot in a Starbucks is when I'm traveling and there is no place to get a better coffee nearby. that basically means turnpike oases and some airports. and I'm assembling a travel coffee kit to avoid even those.
Because they don't want Gen Z/Alpha hanging around thinking liberal ideas. Close the spaces, close the mind. Thats the thinking. You can have union supporters if there no place to sit. .... maybe?
This was inevitable once they pivoted from selling just coffee consumed quickly to mostly food and cold drinks - more people come in and stay longer. So they’re making it like all other fast food restaurants
I think "third space" concept was 2 or 3 CEOs ago. Once they became associated w homeless people hanging out & defiling their bathrooms, they rapidly implemented re-do MO to minimize seats (alleviating legal requirement to provide bathroom facilities), maximize sterility & increase desire to leave.
They wanted more through traffic. They didn't want people to stick around. So they made everything less comfortable. Part of the previous line of management.
Think about a bar or restaurant where they generally want quick turns but actually sometimes don’t mind longer turns because you’re ordering more things.
No one orders more at Starbucks the longer they stay. They are a cost burden from the moment they get their order
The good news is that with coffee culture and smartphones you can always go somewhere more welcoming with better coffee and food than Starbucks if you have like 10 extra minutes, which is implicit in your question.
Very cold and impersonal. Exactly the opposite of what I would want in a coffee shop. I have aways been a huge Starbuck's fan. Love their coffee for all the reasons many don't. They were my local coffee shop for years. I don't care for this change at all. I wasn't even sure it was a Starbucks.
I miss when I would go into my college Starbucks and there would be comfy chairs, tables, you could really park it and lock in there. I miss getting a real mug and plate when I would dine in. Same with Panera 🥺
Comments
Lol
A place to meet, talk, and eat sweets with a strong cup of coffee.
1. You’re in an airport and that’s all there is.
2. You have explosive diarrhea and a $5 small coffee to get the bathroom code is better than pooping yourself.
Support local coffee shops.
https://www.theverge.com/2016/8/3/12325104/airbnb-aesthetic-global-minimalism-startup-gentrification
https://amzn.to/40eXSbU
https://newrepublic.com/article/136558/life-nowhere-office
After all, we’re already on the internet reading the comment, so it takes less than a minute to switch sites to look up any meaning.
adjective
Intermediate between two states, conditions, or regions; transitional or indeterminate.
Existing at the limen. Used of stimuli.
Of or pertaining to a limen, especially a sensory threshhold.
Buy, and leave!
…no, seriously. Wtf is happening
When you're in Harvard Square later this month, you might enjoy Tatte for coffee and a nosh.
Spends $$ to look fancy & takes away customer service that ppl remember/expect
No one orders more at Starbucks the longer they stay. They are a cost burden from the moment they get their order
I hate Starbucks, though.