This is melting my phone, so (since any viral post is an opportunity for a bit of blatant self-advertising) let me add that my new book Advance Britannia includes a discussion of the politics of 1940s India. Available in UK/US/world November. https://www.amazon.co.uk/Advance-Britannia-Rally-Alan-Allport/dp/1781257833
The Indian partition pretty famously didn’t go smooth though, and was a massive humanitarian disaster that has caused an ethnic division that to this day causes much racism and bloodshed, so pretty much sounds like the type of thing a Zionist would promote.
Hey, if we in the United States were able to relocate a bunch of native Americans down a trail (and they were so happy they shed tears…of joy) then this should be easy for us to do
This Dhume guy is a real embarrassment. Also happens to be transphobe who erase traditional gender identities of India by calling it "gender ideology".
Rapes, deaths, murder, torture, robbery was the Indian partition, my great grandfather used to talk about.
He was 23 at that time. He would talk about families being torn apart, entire families vanishing without trace, mass scale rapes, and torture from settlers who came to their now home.
This writer deserves a punch in the face. The number of people who died in the partition, the violence, the loss. Broken families was the best case scenario, if people even survived the moved and weren't killed in transit. Disgusting title by the this writer.
Hi. I'm British, with a modicum of history knowledge. the partition of India and the founding of Israel were both epochal mistakes that the former British empire made and we should, by rights, regret deeply.
I don't regret jews being free in their own countries. countries like America and Britain and France and Germany and everywhere Jewish people have lived for centuries.
Zionism is colonialism pretending to be repatriation. you've just drunk the kool-aid.
So Britain did not allow Jews to flee during the Holocaust to British territories, expelled Jews for 300 years before that, and somehow Britain is a good country for Jews where they are free
Hey, uh, if it was their own country, please do explain why 30 years of vigilante terrorism and a subsequent nakba and then like 80 years of violent oppression and displacement of the natives was necessary to … yknow, “be free.”
It’s not “land back” when you haven’t lived there for 400 years, and the last time you did, you shared it with the people still living there to this day. Sorry, boo.
Trying to equate native Americans with fucking Jacob from Brooklyn is the height of intellectual dishonesty. Or genocidal ignorance.
> It’s not “land back” when you haven’t lived there for 400 years
Jews have always lived there despite being repeatedly massacred by various invading groups but even using your definition Jews just have to wait for another 300 years to become indigenous again
I'm not likely to move, but I would never celebrate or defend whitey exterminating all the Native Americans so I could be born in this Satanic US of A.
Not to make light of it exactly, but my sister and I could not partition our closet without a little bloodshed and it was still not settled. So multiply times millions with actual weapons and an angry starting point.
and Germany just put them on railroad cars and sent them away. The united states had the trail of tears too.. just because there is historical precedent doesn't mean it's not a huge friggin atrocity to repeat it again. JFC WSJ..
JFC. My Grandmother was 17 & in Amritsar. Her mother boarded up all the windows & doors & they hid silently & as best as possible but she still saw some horrific things. My Grandfather’s family left everything behind & eventually made their way to Delhi from what was N Punjab.
And don't forget put an end to all conflict and everything's all peaceable and civil now - the ignorance and stupidity of this article is a thing to behold.
Fuck. me.
That shit is still going smooth and everyone is happy. What is also amazing is that it never floods in Pakistan and no one has ever died in a heatwave in India.
Reminds me of a Fox commentator ca 2017 suggesting copying Britain's tactics in Northern Ireland during the Troubles. Because as we all know, that put an end to political violence in the region. 🙃
Why should the Gazans trust any of this? Even if this was a good faith offer (it isn’t), there’s zero specifics. “Someplace nice”, yeah that’s quite a compelling offer.
Indian partition was brutal. However, at the same time we have to recognise that there's no huge clamour amongst the descendants of ethnic Germans to get back to Konigsberg/Kaliningrad. Seven million expelled, and successfully absorbed in post-war Germany.
If Indian Partition was so wonderful, why are movies STILL being made in India and Pakistan about the millions of families it destroyed and traumatized generations of people.
Oh, and look at all the peace between India and Pakistan, who've been on the verge of war with each other ever since.
"Between 200k and 1 million people are estimated to have been killed or died of disease in refugee camps. Tens of thousands of women, both Hindu and Muslim, were raped, abducted or disfigured." [BBC]
Not weird at all, the business/news content for "serious" publications needs to be more or less accurate for a couple of reasons--internatiobal businessmen need to know geopolitical reality, and it serves as a Trojan horse for fabricated news (see NYT) as well as opinion-coded propaganda.
My mother hid her mum, aunt and sister under the bodies of the dead when the militias attacked a train to Karachi; raping all the women and killing everyone
She stood guard as a15yr old
And never recovered
This cunt wants the same for more people. For more daughters
Sure look at all the crimes of the past, including the partition you speak of, the relocation of indigenous people virtually everywhere- let’s keep the genocide rolling yesterday India (actually the Indus) contuining today in Palestine. Hooray for the west!
Ah yes, what are few hundreds of thousands of deaths among friends... Esp. if they are brown people, right, WSJ?
FML we are just going full tilt into embracing the worst parts of the 20th century, aren't we?
The author must’ve no knowledge of historical facts, there’s no such thing as smooth transfer of population The effects of these so called smooth transfers of population are felt to this day across the world Only if the author was possessed of tiny bit of integrity & basic understanding of history.
i feel like those have something in common.... can't put my finger on it... idk anyway maybe they can relocate to Southern England, seems nice don't you think?
This is why learning History is so important. A million people massacred during the partition of 1947, collective trauma of which still lives in the psyche of those displaced and their generations. The author of said article is an ignorant arsehole. #wsj WTF? Ever crosscheck what you guys publish?
They know *exactly* what they're publishing and why. And it's not to in any way oppose or disagree with any of the following: Trump, fascism, ethnic cleansing, genocide, or being craven, morally bankrupt, collaborationist pieces og human garbage.
In other words, WSJ.
Safe solution: US offers Palestinians to relocate to US, maybe some would be interested. If you promise Trump and his cronies leave. Oh, and BUY their property.
So a friend of my father's told me when he was an apprentice in the Merchant Navy around that time, his ship was anchored off Calcutta I think and one of his jobs every morning was to clear the dead bodies from the anchor cable...
Was speaking to a pal recently whose Father served with the British Army in India during the partition, says that the things he saw were utterly horrific…
My dad did his national service in India during partition. Was occasionally officer in charge of getting corpses off the trains at Delhi station after they'd been attacked en route
(And only time he ever drew his gun was to stop rioting in the cinema when God Save The King was played)
Yes.......
Just like our FIRST NATIONS PEOPLES.......EH?
To these pristine areas of the land where they could all flourish.
Called RESERVATIONS:))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))
My grandparents and their children suffered the partition. There was nothing smooth about it. And we've never been peaceful neighbors and come close to nuclear flashpoints.
Presumably the suggestion is that if only Partition had followed the Gazan model all the Muslims would have been sent to Iran or Afghanistan with Punjab and Bengal ending up as Muslim-free South Asian Rivieras?
I'm gonna be a real Debbie Downer and note that the Holocaust started with a "population transfer" of Jews out of Germany. Other countries (including the U.S.) refused to take all the refugees so, oh well, gotta put them in camps for disobeying the order to leave.
Hi Ms. Downer, let's get our facts right, espec re: Holocaust;
Allport is referring to a FORCED expulsion by govt authrties of a group of people. That did not happen w/GE Jews (NO "order to leave") who either emigrated (something very different - voluntary!) or were shipped out to be killed in East
World War Two saw a huge upheaval of people. Around 20 million people, mainly in Europe but probably further afield too. Who knows how many deaths on the way.
For the love of DOG please stop thinking any conservative is smart. They are not. If they are, they are absolutely not acting in good faith. This also applies to their publications.
Hey, I have an idea. Let's force these assholes to all relocate together, say in a really nice area with cabins - we'll call it "camp"! - where they only have to interact with each other. Problem solved. Give them a taste of their own medicine.
I am struggling to grasp how you can be aware that the Partition happened and involved millions relocating and not be aware of, well, literally anything else about it.
And thus I'm fearing they do, in fact, know other things about it.
Wtaf... send them this...somebody need a history lesson. A few home hitting truths. The cause and effects ... millions of people Good old fallout from British colonialism and still goes on today. https://www.britannica.com/topic/Bengal-famine-of-1943
America has a long and storied tradition of happily relocating people, like the Cherokee, the Iroquois, and the Sioux to name just a few. We can certainly do the Gazans.
Can’t wait for the exciting sequel: “Redrawing Borders worked well, why can’t America redraw the Canadian Border” and point to the Berlin Conference 😭😭😭
Right? They've already relocated once. There's an argument to be made that they should accept what happened in 1948, because it was part of the same post-war process as other tragic forced migrations - but there's literally no sane reason for them to have to move somewhere *again*.
The maniac is catering to domestic hatred politics in India. It fetches votes for Modi and his party BJP. Majority hindu is happy voting for BJP because this party insults Muslims, Christians, Sikhs and other minorities in India.
He’s a soft Hindu nationalist. The type who wouldn’t openly admit it but would go out of his way to find excuses to align with their policies. The type that uses liberal arguments to justify the Hindu nationalists
What partition is proposed? Is Jordan, Saudi Arabia, or Egypt giving up a part of their country so that 2 million people can have their own state while the Orange Felon develops Gaza? No? Then how does this remotely apply?
Partition would be drawing a line across the middle of Israel.
They wouldn't call it ethnic cleansing today (because most of the victims were Bosniak Muslims, and as we've learned since 2001, they don't actually count /s)
There is a good video about why the Serbian government was spared the genocide conviction, and how genocide convictions are highly inconsistent across space and time- even in the same case!
(Horrendous title makes it look like he is denying it, but he is not)
He’s a desi in denial. I grew up in Pakistan, so many heartbreaking stories of people who lost everything during partition on both sides of the border. My family moved from India to Pakistan and it wasn’t easy.
About as "majestic" as the sanctions trump imposed on the International Criminal Court. Ya know, triers of those committing war crimes, genocide, crimes against humanity.
Hindu nationalism at it’s finest. Our people still carry the trauma. There is still violence between Muslims and Hindus. This revisionist bullshit is not okay.
My brain is melting. More than a million Hindus, Sikhs, and Muslims died as a result of the partition, and hundreds of thousands died when Greece and Turkey “repatriated” ethnic nationals in the early (1914-1923). Many other disastrous examples.
There's a frickin' show for teens on Disney+ made by comic book people that's kind of centered around Partition, ffs. Like, lots of teens know this already.
Media outlets are tripping over themselves to point to historical atrocities as … a warning? no … as *justification* for carrying out the imperialist whims of a puree-brained old fascist.
Comments
Churchill killed millions.
y.......eeees those examples are why we now consider resettlement to be a genocidal atrocities 0.o
I don't know whether that answer is written in the style required by the WSJ.
I do have some versions in far more colloquial style, but I am pretty sure they are unprintable.
He was 23 at that time. He would talk about families being torn apart, entire families vanishing without trace, mass scale rapes, and torture from settlers who came to their now home.
do not repeat them. it will not end well.
The British put Jews fleeing the Holocaust in camps in Cyprus, Madagascar and mandatory Palestine
British officers were heading the Arab army that invaded in 48
Who the fuck cares if you regret Jews being free in their own country, take care of your inbred terf island
Zionism is colonialism pretending to be repatriation. you've just drunk the kool-aid.
> Britain
Hmm, what did Britain do during the Holocaust? How was Britain treating its Jews before? lol, lmao even
was it enough? no. but you have a ludicrously skewed view of history if you think 'nothing was done'.
lol. lmao even.
Cool story limey
Criticises the oppression of one group while cheerleading another
Cognitive dissonance really does rot the brain huh
Incredible reach bro, you should play basketball
Trying to equate native Americans with fucking Jacob from Brooklyn is the height of intellectual dishonesty. Or genocidal ignorance.
Jews have always lived there despite being repeatedly massacred by various invading groups but even using your definition Jews just have to wait for another 300 years to become indigenous again
Cope
Cope
"There's No Crying in Genocide! - Finding the Laughter on the Trail of Tears"
Fuck. me.
Oh, and look at all the peace between India and Pakistan, who've been on the verge of war with each other ever since.
"Between 200k and 1 million people are estimated to have been killed or died of disease in refugee camps. Tens of thousands of women, both Hindu and Muslim, were raped, abducted or disfigured." [BBC]
Oh.
#cspan #cspanwj
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-south-asia-62467438
(The weird thing is that the rest of the paper is actually quite good!)
Man opinion piece writers are the weirdest bunch.
She stood guard as a15yr old
And never recovered
This cunt wants the same for more people. For more daughters
Fuck him and racist Murdoch
Anything so I don't have to put up with that kind of bullshit, please!
Hell, even Doctor Who made it clear it didn't go smoothly.
I am so sorry to bear bad news for the satire world.
Same vibe.
FML we are just going full tilt into embracing the worst parts of the 20th century, aren't we?
Book looks cool though I’m gonna grab a copy.
"Sometimes genocides work out great. Look at Armenia!"
In other words, WSJ.
(And only time he ever drew his gun was to stop rioting in the cinema when God Save The King was played)
Lost him one morning. Found him in the hotel shop chatting to the shopkeeper over breakfast. Mostly in Hindi. I had NO IDEA he spoke it at all
This is horrifying.
Just like our FIRST NATIONS PEOPLES.......EH?
To these pristine areas of the land where they could all flourish.
Called RESERVATIONS:))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))
200,000 to 2 million,[1][a] 12 to 20 million displaced[2][b]
80-year coma and all
It’s like that, more or less, but it only takes one bomb to achieve the same effect the entire raid did.
We got really good at marking that one bomb, and our V2 rockets got… like a bit better. And lots of people have them.
Not everyone with them are besties
Can't everyone who lives near the Gulf of Mexico just be forcibly moved to Montana or one of the other states with lots of space and few people?
Allport is referring to a FORCED expulsion by govt authrties of a group of people. That did not happen w/GE Jews (NO "order to leave") who either emigrated (something very different - voluntary!) or were shipped out to be killed in East
https://news.stanford.edu/stories/2019/03/partition-1947-continues-haunt-india-pakistan-stanford-scholar-says
Hey, I have an idea. Let's force these assholes to all relocate together, say in a really nice area with cabins - we'll call it "camp"! - where they only have to interact with each other. Problem solved. Give them a taste of their own medicine.
And thus I'm fearing they do, in fact, know other things about it.
https://www.britannica.com/topic/Bengal-famine-of-1943
So happy I canceled WSJ subscription awhile ago ….
Holy macaroni !
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=z7kCQYPRI10&pp=ygUXbmlzaCBrdW1hciB3aGl0ZSBwZW9wbGU%3D
Publish it you cowards.
Partition would be drawing a line across the middle of Israel.
(Horrendous title makes it look like he is denying it, but he is not)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CDdt9QfC68U
Chapeau to you for the original post though! 😀
...of course now I have to check to see what went problematic there.
At what point do I stop being surprised by the depths because… ugh
I mean, sure they happened but, we're still here, right?
Any historian will tell you the most important lesson of history is that it's okay to do bad stuff as long as it happened before.
I am going to lose my goddamned mind.