If I had a dime for every response in this thread which is, hey they said Trump would be bad and they’ve been vindicated. Please just show yourselves out. That’s a different conversation and seriously get out more okay?
And people hold hope and despair simultaneously ALL THE TIME.
Recognizing the horrors all around us & how much we can't fix does not in any way mean that those people are unwilling to fight, or aren't actively fighting in the hope that we can slow the destruction, so there's something left to fix.
Or you could get over yourself. If you and the rest of the media had engaged in a bit more "doomerism" about Trump, maybe the world wouldn't be in this mess.
I've occasionally been guilty of such comments. - What I *want* is to grab every Trump voter by the hairpiece and scream it into their ears, not complain to people I agree with.
But liberals and conservatives basically never talk to each other anymore, you see. So I have to scream it to *someone*.
Worked for an engineering firm. One of the senior guys told me nothing consequential has been built without some asshole screaming it couldn’t be done.
sound smart and inspiring to the american people, be honest, be fearless, in actions and words, don't be afraid to anger the people who wouldn't piss on you if you were on fire. Be mad and animated, be threatening and powerful, on every issue with every nominee.
Also “It won’t matter. Nothing will happen. His followers will believe anything.” Like, OK? Do you feel better for having replied with this? Do you want everyone to just crawl into bed and cry for four years?
anybody who does the "Imagine if Biden admin had..." or "They just talked about prosecuting leaking classified info"
just shut up, they are liars and cheats and they don't respect their own policies, we know this. The goal is to keep making them look more and more stupid, avoid the hypocrisy stuff
Some people are too superior to have hope and too inept to work their way out of their intense cynicism. Some people would rather grind their axe. Some people are contemptuous of the people (see "too superior to have hope.")
I'd rather be w/ the folks who have always fought and with the newbies.
But not happy and nice all the time. By necessity used to the struggle. Friends with other people fighting, too. Ability to appreciate nature and people comes in handy.
I have hope. Unfortunately, that hope is primarily based off of how incompetent and dishonest this regime is. The blatant lies are getting harder and harder to believe, even for people that so depend on believing them.
It's hard sometimes, but I saw someone say a few days in 'yielding to despair is obeying in advance', and dammit, I'm gonna fight that urge with everything in me. FUCK YOU, MAKE ME.
libs obey in advance by supporting capitalist and imperialist enterprises, including active genocide. at best, they roleplay as doomers. I don't wholly disagree with this sentiment in relation to leftists, but libs ain't left.
Naw. Just made me get prepared. Created a mutual aid network. Turns out we can do amazing things as a team. Life’s never been better. Doomerism made it all possible.
True. That's why Americans need to take to the streets by the tens of millions and demand the fascistic trump admin steps down, or they will face a rebellion.
We could certainly see some big protests before this is over. (Or possibly not! We don't know the future yet.) Getting a whole adminstration to "step down" is a big ask, though. Let's just hope things DON'T get that wild.
Oh it's no fun at all! I'm not happy about it. But I mean "wild" as in "huge civil unrest, possible violence" all that. We're still allowed to hope we just white-knuckle through all this as a nation once more.
I mean, I guess I didn't define "white knuckling" so either of us could be right! But I just mean "get through it all without big violence, total collapse, etc." Just have a new administration in '29 and start picking up the pieces. That can still be the goal!
I think it's likely nothing but force will remove this fascist oligarchy from power but I still think everything should be tried. I'm trying to get the magic 3.5% of the population doing regular protests because if the fascists fear what COULD happen to them, they might flee.
Ever notice that when you point out the reality of there being no obvious way out of this, that the response is never, “No! Here’s a solution.” It’s always, “Stop being so negative.”
Omg thank you! Yes. I will not have it. Of course I know it is bleak and awful. But I will not allow “nothing matters anyway.” That’s bullshit! We have lives to try to protect. Including children’s ffs.
We should not forget that these fucking losers who now occupy our government are nothing more than skin bags full of shit! There's nothing special about these fucking losers!
tell that to the people who voted for the Dem in Lancaster Senate seat flipping a ruby red district. Dems have a real strong chance of flipping the state Senate next year and have unified gov't for the first time in decades.
tl;dr - I think "doomerism" is too broad a brush and is used to go after those undeserving of its spite when ecofascists and climate financialists are actively hurting our struggle
There is an understandable emotional drought for many after witnessing centrists both fail to see the warning signs for the past 13 years & attempt to wash away their collective guilt by pretending everyone else was wrong.
That is how you choose to interpret it. When everything is bad and the norms aren't working, as they are now, there is little left to lose, so di it differently and go all out.
What is the solution when ALL politicians are bought and paid for by the oppressor? Are Palestinians also doomers? Are Native Americans doomers? Are immigrants seeking Asylum doomers? The first reaction to psychological warfare is to avoid the circular firing squad of labels.
For mine, I'm concerned that people are fighting the wrong battles. If you're relying on your courts and institutions and the norms you're used to it'll be over before you know it.
One could say the same about recruiting people into MAGA...
United by anger at the government. Along comes Trump who floats to the top on this anger. They defer to him in advance of his promises to fix everything.
He becomes a pied piper and they hear his voice only.
They act like it's either democracy or dictatorship.
It's not binary, like a light switch. Those are the endpoints on a spectrum.
Worse, they excuse themselves from responsibility to fight back. I hope they read Timothy Snyder's "On Tyranny", and do something.
Time to man up, pussies!
it helps us believe most people don't actually side with the fash. And maybe most people don't want this, our perspective of what most people think in the entire of this unfathomably huge country, is both distorted AND *EXTREMELY* manipulated. But if most actually want the fash, well that's dark
it's telling that I feel the most 'doomed' when interacting with my family members who voted for trump. I suspect that people online who are saying such apathetic things have just lived around these types so long that they have learned helplessness.
I don't think "learned helplessness" is a fair description of "understand that absolutely nothing will change the minds of ~40% of the US voting population."
Respectfully, you’ve got this precisely backwards. Clear-eyed realism about how totally fucked things are & the stakes involved is the ONLY thing that is going to provoke the level of response needed. We need a general strike, if only in the blue cities & by the blue professional classes
I disagree. I warn people of the End Times and the fulfillment of prophesy, not because our fate is sealed, but because God wants us to save ourselves. The story of Jonah, specifically verse 3:10 tells us this. But we can't avoid the worst if we refuse to see it coming.
Now that you mention it, I'm not sure either. Very similar brands of shit, I suppose. They have the same stink of blind faith and unquestionable allegiance to a self centered authoritarian.
I like to call it living in the reality of our situation. I'm willing to bet that you're obeying way more than myself and those like me are or will. Do better, Josh.
Heh. He is unsparing, even of himself! But he's never really a DOOMER anyway in the "online" sense. CRITICAL, sure. But true doomering is being like "you naive fools how do you not know we're all screwed" like you see so often on here.
Ok you're not wrong. But I've been feeling nothing but despair and can't get my mind to think anything but despair. Perhaps I'm obeying in advance or perhaps I'm just in despair about my country and don't know what to do.
I would just say that you're allowed to feel that. Everyone does sometimes. Just remember that despair, like depression, is always a lie on some level. And while it's okay to FEEL it, it's not helpful to TELL people there's no hope. Because there is.
Doomerism is not saying “Trump is a fascist”. Doomerism is saying “Trump is a fascist and we can’t stop him”.
I have seen NOBODY saying the latter. Nobody’s out here saying “yeah it’s over everyone give up”. What we’re doing is warning you what’s going to happen so you can prepare for the fight
It is, and it’s frustrating because giving up is exactly what they want. BUT people are tired. This is a long fight. I understand why they feel that way. I have to actively fight against those thoughts and it is exhausting. Keep calling. Keep emailing. Keep protesting. Keep being a pain in the ass.
👏👏 Clinton won the popular vote. Harris a black/Indian woman 'almost' won. Both faced Trump who cheated, had interference etc etc. We have elected all races, gay persons & trans persons.
This is a horrible narrative & I call it out every time I see it. It's MAGAlite.
Labels divide us & are counter-productive-Do you refer to elected officials or folks impacted: jobs, healthcare, SS, safety.
Too many refused to acknowledge the ongoing '15 GOP Coup as our Constitutional escape options died.
Many finally waking up to the reality we've been warning about 👍 #United
Unfortunately, when the cabinet members f*ckup, it is the men and women in the services that die. That is what makes this cabinet such a sh*t show with daily reruns of the same actors acting the same regardless.
Agree, wholeheartedly. Libs saying Bernie's rallies won't help, or no point in pressing the Signalgate issue because they won't be held accountable, is not helpful.
We need pressure on all fronts and to encourage each other always.
I guess it depends on how you define doomerism. I'm not going to pretend things are going well right now like some brain dead idiot. I prefer to prepare for the worst, hope for the best. Unfortunately the bad will come before the good based on something called "reality"
Yep, I was going to say something similar. Many people just don't pay attention or believe nonsence because they don't know that they do not know stuff. Makes no sense to me, but it amazes me how many have no idea how government works and what its purpose is.
These people seem to feel that the government does things to us, not for us. That we work for the government, not that the government we works for us. We elect the board of directors charged to provide services to all its citizens.
They, the government(elected by us), provide security of our personal, intellectual properties, and economic and national security information. Provides protection from internal, external, and cyber threats. Maintains relationships and cooperation with other counties for our mutual benefit.
Other responsibilities are maintaining structural and social infrastructure. Support educational goals, facilitate community and individual safety regulations, and deliver public health services.
I could go on. But people don't understand their ownership of and responsibility for the government.
Until Americans take responsibility for this, we will continue having low voter engagement, low information, or misinformation voters. The solution? Education, persuasion, and invitation. Who knows when a seed of hope is planted that blossoms into action. Or we don't try, and they stay stuck.
I don’t think doomerism and conspiratorial thinking are necessarily the same. “Trump will try and stay in office” and “Obama is going to take everyone’s guns” are not the same level of critical thinking.
Fair point. Use whatever example you prefer. I still don’t judge people for their despair. We’re in uncharted waters and everyone is swimming at a different skill level. Cut scared people some slack, especially if you’re a white guy named Josh.
Despair isn't doomerism either. Josh is talking about people who have nothing to say other than shit like "that's funny you think we'll ever have elections again." No one is telling anyone how to feel. Just don't try to convince everyone else they should feel despair. It's selfish.
Thanks for this. After a series of huge personal losses & limited family support I'm prone to doom. But I think constantly about one of my best friends: green card holder, homeowner, endlessly talented & now fearful of being disappeared. I put my shoes on & roll up my sleeves every day - for her.
Um exactly how? Have you seen reality? Or are you speaking of like the statements saying we might as well give up? You do realize ppl who see the doom are probably also going through some personal shit, right? I'm sorry, but I am just really confused by your statement. Also, if you aren't a leftie
I think most doing this don't realize that is what they are enabling. I appreciate you giving some "tough love" to people who are on our side, Josh. They need to re-think how they react to fear. Paul Weiss firm contained good people, but don't react like them.
You and your colleagues at TPM are doing major work right now.
So why are you kicking out reflexively at the class of people -- "libs and lefties" -- who are allies or potential allies in this decidedly uphill struggle?
Don't answer, just stop wasting your valuable time.
Getting lost in the weeds is the media's way of profitably normalizing him. "He's frickin Donald Trump" should alone have disqualified him. He is proof that American politics is indeed doomed.
Ripley: Well, I don't care how but we better think of something. We better think of a way.
Private Hudson: Think of what? We're *fucked*!
Corporal Hicks: [shouting over Hudson] Shut up!
Private Hudson: We're doomed!
Such a childish take. I don't care what they "deserve". I care about what can help stop Trump and what helps Trump stay in office - and damaging Democrats is in the second category.
They’ve had the trifecta. But at the beginning the Dems were spinning their wheels. Now they are pushing back, and figuring out how to “play the game” as it were. They are now more engaged than they were and that’s how holding them accountable 24/7 is working.
There is a difference between tactically focused pressure on specific politicians and the widespread "Ds are collaborators; we're doomed; primary them all" that floods Bluesky every single day. That is doomerism and the Gaza-flavored version of it cost us the election and possibly our country.
The inverse of doomerism is Schumerism. I see which way things are going. Maybe “we’re fucked” is disabling/demotivating but denying a state of affairs is equally or more disabling since it absolves you of having to do something. The first step of OODA is “observe” and stopping that stops the rest.
I will keep repeating, WE THE PEOPLE HAVE THE POWER IF ONLY WE WILL USE IT!!! There are MANY MILLIONS MORE OF US!!!
"Just Say No" has never sounded more appropriate to me!
It's about abandoning strategies that never pan out, and looking for alternatives. I mean the idea that big law firms would save us was always ridiculous and it wasn't "doomerism" to say so: the position is being vindicated daily. I wish I had better solutions, sure.
I think, sadly, it's going to take some form of catastrophe, like a major depression or large scale violence, to get out of this fascist moment. It's not going to be Chuck Schumer or Dick Durbin or your buddy from school who did pro bono work for left causes.
I'm not giving up or saying there's no point--but the solutions aren't going to come from elite institutions. They will come from the ground up I think. Meanwhile I'm looking into buying a rifle
No, it’s actually not. Acknowledging reality is one thing. Being cynical about anything positive is another. Excessive pessimism and being realistic are two very different things
But how did you get there? No one wakes up and chooses doomerism. Same as depression. You can't fault some people for being overwhelmed, but you can try to help them rather than blaming them for their own condition.
^this part. Is it painful to acknowledge that these people are going to try to nullify free and fair elections? Of course it is, but only a fool believes they won’t. Anybody want to do something about it? Or do we want to be the positivity police online?
“Doomerism” whiners seem to be yeah. Saying exactly that. Anybody who thinks 2026 elections are going to go off as we would normally expect still hasn’t fully grasped where we are now.
Cool. Maybe we can start talking about how to prevent that rather than shit talking the people who point it out. The answer isn’t to wait it out until the next election. If we don’t force the issue (cover your ears doomer whiners) then we won’t have an election. Are they acting like they care?
those same libs just tucked their head back into their turtle shells when SCOTUS handed bush the presidency, instead of rioting like their zeal would have you believe should've been the response.
if we have elections and the Dems nominate anyone other than AOC, we're officially cooked. been calling my reps and her every day to convince them to endorse her.
I’d like to push back a bit. I have feelings of doom. I’m not sure our democracy will survive or it may take generations to undo the damage. But I’m not obeying in advance. Have called my reps, been to a rally, stopped subscriptions to billionaires and heading to my congressman’s office tomorrow.
My feeling of dread lifted yesterday. I knew it would go away eventually. Also been protesting, writing, and calling. Doom comments are demoralizing and destructive.
I get that. It’s natural and human to be afraid. It’s what we do in response to it. I see doomerism as a laziness, rolling up my sleeves and getting my hands dirty will be hard and it might not even work. So I’ll hedge my bets by jumping the queue and wailing all hope is lost. So I win either way.
A little bravado is in order in trying to beat these Nazis.
I like the description of this defeatism as a hedge. That’s the way I’d describe what the legacy press and other institutions are doing: hedging on democracy.
so you've decided it's okay for people to be afraid, just not okay for them to *checks notes* post about it online in a specific way, knowing exactly nothing about what steps they're taking IRL? because posting online is where the real work is done?
Josh, Republicans aren't coming for you now.
For people whom they are, "doomerism" is far from lazy.
It is confronting the very realities of today's America for them.
Bravery is not the absence of fear, or even an absence of "doomerism" that it might not work out. It is working in spite of it.
I think you misunderstand. He's criticizing people who always assume the worst. That's not realism.
Of course, we should call it like it is, but we should not say, for example, that the courts will fail to reign in the Trump administration. If that's the case, then why fight at all?
I don't believe the courts will sufficiently reign in Trump. But, the fight is important for helping people where one can at the moment. That supporting rule of law now will make rebuilding it easier later. But, unduly supporting the courts can give Trump legitimacy as bad decisions come.
Doomer?
Thank you. I'm kind of tired of non-Americans pushing a general strike or civil war. GS works in societies where most people will still have their job, home, and food the next day. US is a precarious society, more Argentina than France. Need to look at Chile and Brazil.
CW is a whole other thing.
Part of it is that a lot of us HAVE been rolling up our sleeves for the past 10 years and this is what it got us. We’ve been doom chicken littles and now the doom we warned about is here. (sleeves still rolled up tho!)
It's not nothing, it's a significant thing. It's just not the whole thing. I don't blame people who hoped they'd see the victory they have worked so hard for.
But the way out is through, toward a victory we may not get to see. It's still worth the work
People who fall back on that are losing sight of the joy that comes with knowing that even if I lose, I've made the lives of my enemy a little less comfortable.
From Bob the Drag Queen in a recent Vulture interview:
"Everyone can’t take it to the streets. That’s not everyone’s path in life. I’m a loudmouth. I’m in the streets. But if you don’t want to go there, I’m still fighting for you, too.
I see this happening with random anonymous profiles online but never in real life. All of the "doomers" I have met in real life were political nihilist before 47.
I think that is a selective read on “doomerism”. I think we would be in a better position to fight if fewer people had taken the few “Trump can’t get away with …. because there is a whole bureaucracy and court system in his way”
this is non-responsive to the point. the opposite of doomerism isn't saying everything is fine or the courts will take care of it. obviously people can have their own definitions of the term. But this has nothing to do with what i'm talking about.
Perhaps, it wasn’t your intent. But the impression left by some of your writing about what you call Doomerism gave the impression that Trump could not move as fast as he has in dismantling things.
Pessimists have the idea that a projection which turns out to have been optimistic in retrospect was such a terrible mistake that they will always predict the worst possible outcome. That's not realism.
It's OK to be hopeful. Be hopeful but also plan for eventualities. I don't think there is any benefit to spreading despair. Hope is not a plan, but also we need hope.
Pessimists aren't realists. They always assume the worst, which isn't realism.
I'm not American, so I don't think my scepticism is even doomerism. I just see very little resistance and that not enough people are willing to do anything. Experience tells us it only gets harder as authoritarianism becomes more entrenched. Would obviously love nothing more than to be proven wrong.
upshot is there's no way to know what people are doing IRL vs what they post so maybe everyone cope the best way we know how? ffs. can you imagine if the right policed each other the way the left does???
“THESE are the times that try men's souls. The summer soldier and the sunshine patriot will, in this crisis, shrink from the service of their country; but he that stands by it now, deserves the love and thanks of man and woman."
Same on all of the above. Keep going. Like Henry Miller said, Let us do our best, even if it gets us nowhere. (But we are racking up wins in court so I'm also supporting Democracy Docket instead of funding political campaigns, at the moment.)
Yeah, "Doomerism" isn't the perfectly natural fear, dread, anxiety, and despair we are all experiencing. It's performative social media behavior to encourage that those feelings are ALL we do. Courage.
Read the forum posts on your own website. It’s 2025 and the majority of your paid subs who post think Hillary ran a perfect campaign, Bernie voters are rank misogynists, and Obama didn’t meddle in the 2020 primary.
Josh, you’re normally on point with your takes. This ain’t it through…
I’m a doomer because the Democrats are the most politically inept opposition party in modern history, and any efforts to displace the rot are cut off at the legs.
Not *all* efforts to displace the rot are cut off at the legs. And saying so abandons the exceptions and makes further attempts to cut them off more likely to succeed.
It's sad that some of the responses to Josh sound like examples of what he's talking about.
It's particularly evident when people explain at length why they're being doom- ... sorry, "realistic". Seriously, does anyone really think Josh needs these things spelled out?
Gen X and Millenials watched way too much Daria. It had a bad effect. Gen Z is always willing to bet happily that even the worst idea will somehow reap them benefit. Doomerism is so 90’s.
The country has no real future as a free country. It will collapse or dissolve before freedom can return. Blame the Senate and Electoral College, if there are even going to be free and fair elections ever again.
Folks saying there’s hope need to be able to describe a theory of *how*. What specific things *can* still happen that would salvage the current government?
I don’t know that my views are “we’re doomed” so much as “hope will be realized in a new country.” There’s hope. Just not for the current US.
People on the left want stable housing, healthcare, an end to police and state violence, human rights for all people including trans people, an end to genocide.
People on the left want life-affirming changes, this is the exact opposite of doom and gloom as usual.
It is safe to assume that this right wing Sup Ct is in Trump's corner. But if that Court rules against them, these fuckers, from Vance & Trump on down, have made it clear they are fully prepared to defy the courts. So "who's going to enforce this" remains a very relevant question, like it or not.
Yes, we have to fight. But go into the fight with eyes wide open, knowing that to "win" a case now may not mean the same thing as it did before, when we knew, win or lose, we had a constitutional democracy. We don't have assurance now.
The lawyers have been the strongest defense we have had, not knocking any and everything else people are doing, and I don't mean the few sell out law firms - F them. But much respect for all the legal system has tried to do. But it's just not an easy fight.
Fighting 47 now is primarily up to those in (professional) positions of power to resist him. Judges, lawyers, governors, Congress. Protests short of a national general strike will get waved away by the #MAGA-t majority in D.C. until at least Nov. 2026, earlier if Dems sweep special elections.
1/
Failure of imagination and relying on “norms” and institutions to hold the line is why we are here. 10 yrs ago if you would’ve said Elon Musk was going to dismantle SS in broad daylight using 20 yr old “bigballs” dudes, pretty sure you’d be called a “doomer” then too. I call it preparing.
There's been a hefty influx of people from Twitter and Facebook who are exactly the people you are satirizing, so that makes it hard to tell the difference.
Yeah, I know. I'm not faulting you for misunderstanding me. It's more that my default way of replying and communicating is becoming more and more ill-equipped for the times. Also, I appreciate your earnest helpfulness. That wasn't sarcasm, for once.
In my case, my doomerism fuels me to actually get active on the civil society and organizing side myself, rather than wait or rely on the courts or the feckless opposition party
I suspect what's going on is that the people who have been warning that all this was coming are frustrated that Dem leadership never bothered to make any kind of plan to oppose or reverse it, and without that it's *not* going to change. Instead, Schumer in particular is blatantly complicit.
I think some people are being paid to doom, or are at least monetizing it. I saw a quick change in new people I followed here after Trump won the election. They did total 180s in doom before Thanksgiving and definitely by Christmas. Its a business I think.
Well... there are influencers who will take money to say pretty much anything. They shouldn't be conflated with the people who have literally been warning (correctly and accurately) for years that this is what the GOP and extremist evangelicals have been working toward.
They absolutely shouldn't be. Lots of very smart individuals have been talking about this since Obama's first election and that backlash. I'm talking, almost exclusively, about the "we're fucked"/"we're doomed" squad. It really is growing daily. That's why I lessened my time here.
Honestly, I think it's an effort to get people to recognize that, unless we MAKE things change, we WON'T have elections. Elections are not the default any more. Saying "well maybe the 2026 election will change things" is an active refusal to look at the implications of what they're doing.
If thats what they're trying to accomplish then they should actually give people examples of things to do instead of implying that there's nothing to be done.
I struggle with the where and what. Where does this end? And what’s the point?
Does this end with millions of people dying?? And to what end? I haven’t been able to understand how these people think they can harm so many of us and plunder the coffers without making sure we refill it.
No, that’s exactly backwards. Calling it doomerism is to deliberately mischaracterize and dismiss situations that if not addressed will have bad outcomes.
“We need to get off fossil carbon fuels or life on earth as we know it is over” is not doom.
I am still not seeing enough Dems fight, or know that there even is a fight to have. That’s the doomerism I am most worried about: that we can wait for a deus ex machina that is not us to change things.
Disagreed. It used to be called doomerism when people said "a new Trump administration will be catastrophic" and now it's doomerism when someone says "Democracies usually don't recover from this." Both statements are/were true and neither demands or suggests obeying in advance.
No. "A new Trump administration will be catastrophic" was the opposite of doomerism before the election. It was a call to action. "It doesn't matter who's president - both the candidates are the same" was the old doomerism.
To me, there’s doomerism and then there’s defeatism. I can keep in mind the doom that seems imminent, maybe IS imminent, but it still feels worthwhile to try and affect positive change in the world around me. Folks who respond with “what the point?”, I don’t have much respect for.
I think doomerism is a feeling. Defeatism is the act of giving up. I get the doomerism but I wish the defeatists would keep their pessimism to themselves. I sometimes wonder if their role is to turn the rest of us into defeatists.
Look I've been doomer since childhood. It's woven into my DNA now. I can be doomer and still want to put fascists to the guillotine. Eeyore would've still defended the Hundred Acre Wood if he knew his friends were gonna die.
I’m taking jabs at them here and there as I see them. Common thing they do is whine about anything currently being discussed because “what about the other bad stuff Trump is doing?” They are literally the reason flooding the zone works, no focus and they’d rather just attack democrats.
🤦♀️
We're trying to save our democracy and if you feel that it's "doomerism" you're further down the🐇 🕳️ than can be saved... Rump has said it often enough... "I love the uneducated." SMH... It must be "dense" down there... 😉
That's the opposite of what they are saying. They are frustrated with people who are like "why bother everything is doomed they've already won" etc. A fighting attitude is the correct one
I have the same thoughts about things like climate change efforts. The headline could read “these kids are planting 1000 trees!” and people will chime in with hope crushing reasons why it’s not enough and won’t help. It’s not naive or ignorant to at least TRY and make the world better.
I’ll also add onto this, and say that IMO doomerism also assists in lessening much needed energy and demoralizing the fight of those actually working to improve the situation, while making it easier for those who act to be at risk.
Which removes those working hard to protect folks even the doomer☠️
My family and I are fighting as hard as we can to save our country, but as an old Girl Scout who was taught “be prepared”, we are also making some escape plans if things get really bad.
I finally stopped visiting a poli-blog I’d been reading for years in November. Cynics, defeatists and edgebros dominating every thread, even ones about the dangers of doomerism. Openly mocking enthusiasm.
A losing battle explaining how public pessimism helps the Rs by creating infectious apathy.
Things do seem dark, but I look at what people have done and are doing in countries like Georgia. They have been out in the streets for 119+ nights. We have barely started fighting and we have yet to realize a fraction of the power we have. https://x.com/SFRCdems/status/1904572709423448361
I remember the women's march after the 1st inauguration! I was there. Why aren't we in the streets protesting by the millions? More than one day on strike, etc. Maybe we need a new leader to rise from the people and quit waiting for dem politicians.
My pinned post. One scheduled day & going home isn't cutting it. We go to the WH & Capitol on a Sun before he gets back from golfing & don't allow anyone IN both buildings until he & complicit MAGA are removed.
Comments
Recognizing the horrors all around us & how much we can't fix does not in any way mean that those people are unwilling to fight, or aren't actively fighting in the hope that we can slow the destruction, so there's something left to fix.
Y'all have decided that you want X, aren't actually doing anything, but have decided that blaming people who've had enough.
What are we supposed to be doing that you are?
You've decided that my lack of investment is premature. It's not time to give up. Presumably you haven't and that gives you something.
BTW, how do I get this water you're offering?? Not sure we're on the same page about social media here.
But liberals and conservatives basically never talk to each other anymore, you see. So I have to scream it to *someone*.
Its the only choice.
just shut up, they are liars and cheats and they don't respect their own policies, we know this. The goal is to keep making them look more and more stupid, avoid the hypocrisy stuff
And I don't have to, because you're right here.
Are you claiming things aren’t horrible?
I'd rather be w/ the folks who have always fought and with the newbies.
🫠
But not happy and nice all the time. By necessity used to the struggle. Friends with other people fighting, too. Ability to appreciate nature and people comes in handy.
Unwilling to be jaded.
🤘❤️🤘
I just feel better.
Don't always live up to my goal. But that's the goal.
Doesn't apply to fascists.
It's just that responsible people (left/journalists) are avoiding admitting the ugly truth of the only 2 paths forward:
1) capitulation to fascism (the default outcome)
2) something akin to a civil war (the active resistance outcome)
What other (non magical thinking) paths exist?
1) MAGA Fascists want to burn it all down
2) Trump will ignore the courts because
3) Congress / courts doesn't have police power to stop an aggressor
4) We aren't winning 60+ Senate seats to impeach/remove
What am I missing?
But I'm interested in having a a serious discussion. We*need* to have a serious discussion.
My "reason for going on" is the search for a *feasible* better answer than the two above (that not magical thinking).
I know we're all fucked for good. It's not obeying on advance for me because I'll still fight out of spite.
I do a lot of living out of spite these days 😂
"Doomerism" is not an option.
We're here because a lot of people have never had to fight for anything, and those same people watch it unfold and say "wait, hold my sippy cup..."
tl;dr - I think "doomerism" is too broad a brush and is used to go after those undeserving of its spite when ecofascists and climate financialists are actively hurting our struggle
No one is obeying/forfeiting in advance.
There is an understandable emotional drought for many after witnessing centrists both fail to see the warning signs for the past 13 years & attempt to wash away their collective guilt by pretending everyone else was wrong.
The two extremes of complacency and doomerism both lull people into inaction.
https://bsky.app/profile/jacquelyngill.bsky.social/post/3llgrhpyyac2m
For mine, I'm concerned that people are fighting the wrong battles. If you're relying on your courts and institutions and the norms you're used to it'll be over before you know it.
Do ya got one?
(I ask, hanging from the cliff of hope over the abyss of doom)
United by anger at the government. Along comes Trump who floats to the top on this anger. They defer to him in advance of his promises to fix everything.
He becomes a pied piper and they hear his voice only.
Until he can't fix things...
Doomerism can also be “we are all fucked anyway so why would I even bother complying?”.
- Edward R. Murrow
It's not binary, like a light switch. Those are the endpoints on a spectrum.
Worse, they excuse themselves from responsibility to fight back. I hope they read Timothy Snyder's "On Tyranny", and do something.
Time to man up, pussies!
It's our human body and what it does when we're "left behind for the summer gathering"
Our body actually has a physical switch somewhere in our brain
That tells it to not use too much energy or do too much, when everyone else is away
Socializing turns that switch off
The tv turns that switch off because it convinces our brain we are around a fire with a theatre troupe or musicians
@jvl.bsky.social:
https://substack.com/@jvlast/note/c-103022852?utm_source=notes-share-action&r=em6k0
I have seen NOBODY saying the latter. Nobody’s out here saying “yeah it’s over everyone give up”. What we’re doing is warning you what’s going to happen so you can prepare for the fight
How many men have run and lost?
This is a horrible narrative & I call it out every time I see it. It's MAGAlite.
Oh, wait, I accepted an invite to the wrong chat group.
This is obeying in advance:
Too many refused to acknowledge the ongoing '15 GOP Coup as our Constitutional escape options died.
Many finally waking up to the reality we've been warning about 👍 #United
We need pressure on all fronts and to encourage each other always.
So more compassion and less riding around on a high horse can fairly be called for here.
I could go on. But people don't understand their ownership of and responsibility for the government.
Being afraid is not the same thing as losing all ability to engage in critical thought
“everything sucks and there’s nothing we can do about it” — doomerism
So why are you kicking out reflexively at the class of people -- "libs and lefties" -- who are allies or potential allies in this decidedly uphill struggle?
Don't answer, just stop wasting your valuable time.
Private Hudson: Think of what? We're *fucked*!
Corporal Hicks: [shouting over Hudson] Shut up!
Private Hudson: We're doomed!
You believe democrats are doing anything that will stop Trump? The level of lib delusion is comical and sad at the same time.
"Just Say No" has never sounded more appropriate to me!
It’s Shel Silverstein!
Listen to Mustn'ts, child, listen to the Don'ts.
Listen to the Shouldn'ts, the Impossibles, the Won'ts.
Listen to the Never Haves, then listen close to me.
Anything can happen, child, Anything can be.
https://allpoetry.com/listen-to-the-mustn'ts-
https://www.phys.ufl.edu/~thorn/grooks.html
Because this isn't even the smallest part of it
first past the post and the electoral college are just blindingly obvious examples of making sure the power stayed with capital and never labor.
same with citizens united.
#Protest
#5Calls
#Indivisible
https://bsky.app/profile/thankstomimi.bsky.social/post/3lkn6nivhak23
I don't care what the reasons are. It helps NOBODY
I like the description of this defeatism as a hedge. That’s the way I’d describe what the legacy press and other institutions are doing: hedging on democracy.
For people whom they are, "doomerism" is far from lazy.
It is confronting the very realities of today's America for them.
Bravery is not the absence of fear, or even an absence of "doomerism" that it might not work out. It is working in spite of it.
Of course, we should call it like it is, but we should not say, for example, that the courts will fail to reign in the Trump administration. If that's the case, then why fight at all?
Doomer?
I’m a Canadian who has many American friends that are dispirited and worried, and asking “what can I do?”
My response: “It’s your country suffering a coup, almost by definition, I am outsider, should not be telling you how to resist and reverse it.”
CW is a whole other thing.
My first presentation on climate change was in 1973. I got a mark of 0: "science fiction, not science."
By 2015, I realized that ALL of our so-called "leaders" were actively mobilizing opposition to progress while pretending to do otherwise.
Reversing Roe was a 50 year project. And yet the right fought back on that every day of those fifty years.
But the way out is through, toward a victory we may not get to see. It's still worth the work
Expect the worst. Then one of two things will happen: either you'll be pleasantly surprised, or you'll be *right*.
"Everyone can’t take it to the streets. That’s not everyone’s path in life. I’m a loudmouth. I’m in the streets. But if you don’t want to go there, I’m still fighting for you, too.
https://www.vulture.com/article/bob-drag-queen-harriet-tubman-book-interview.html
For example, if you insist that the courts can't stop Trump, you're a pessimist, not a realist. We don't know that yet.
None of us know how things will turn out.
Pessimists aren't realists. They always assume the worst, which isn't realism.
Upshot is, if it's an excuse to just *not fight* and/or declare the performative wailing an end unto itself, then yeah it's stupid
--Thomas Paine, Dec. 23, 1776
SNAFU
Situation Normal All Fucked Up
I’m a doomer because the Democrats are the most politically inept opposition party in modern history, and any efforts to displace the rot are cut off at the legs.
Obama jumped in to ensure Bernie had no chance in 2020.
AOC denied her shot at an actual committee post, despite massively tacking to the center.
Quotes in politico about centrist Dems *fretting* over even a slight shift leftwards due to Bernie/AOC rally
It's particularly evident when people explain at length why they're being doom- ... sorry, "realistic". Seriously, does anyone really think Josh needs these things spelled out?
But maybe it'd be more Bluesky-ish to post links to activism resources instead.
And globally, climate change isn’t being stopped.
Reality says: plan for what’s next.
I don’t know that my views are “we’re doomed” so much as “hope will be realized in a new country.” There’s hope. Just not for the current US.
1. Some kind of massive political shift that hasn’t even begun to happen yet, *and*,
2. Some tech that doesn’t currently exist, but I suppose maybe could. Fusion? Space elevator? Soletta?
People on the left want life-affirming changes, this is the exact opposite of doom and gloom as usual.
- Reel Big Fish
but I guess some people really love their #denial & #minimization #DefenseMechanisms
and seem to get super mad when other people won’t wear them too.
1/
“I BEG you to understand that we will never have free and fair elections again”
…so that…we can…what??
I just don’t get what the doomers are trying to accomplish. It’s one thing to give up; it’s another to get upset that others haven’t.
Does this end with millions of people dying?? And to what end? I haven’t been able to understand how these people think they can harm so many of us and plunder the coffers without making sure we refill it.
“We need to get off fossil carbon fuels or life on earth as we know it is over” is not doom.
Motivation to avoid repercussions is not doom.
You just go ahead and do you thing mate, just pick another minority to stigmatize & frame negatively… 😌
See this blow? Be sure to check the second 🪁 too, the full essay on substack is #FFA and linked in the ALT text.
So perhaps just bugger off & go hug your family. 🥰
✌️
But this is all just semantics of course
We're trying to save our democracy and if you feel that it's "doomerism" you're further down the🐇 🕳️ than can be saved... Rump has said it often enough... "I love the uneducated." SMH... It must be "dense" down there... 😉
Opponents of MAGA must resist. Even if they lose, they will know that they fought the good fight.
Which removes those working hard to protect folks even the doomer☠️
A losing battle explaining how public pessimism helps the Rs by creating infectious apathy.
https://x.com/SFRCdems/status/1904572709423448361